Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

The Era of Visual Studio Code

blog.robenkleene.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

391–400 of 698 posts

Re: The Era of Visual Studio Code

#391

Post by lmm »

jolux wrote: post #323
derefr wrote: post #297

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> and expecting them to be skeuomorphic to a particular approach may hold us back Whatever a programming language is, it has to be something you can hold onto in your head, because the human mind is where "programming" takes place. And there really aren't many forms that such a thing can take. The step-sibling of programming languages, the mathematical proof, can really take any form we like; we're not limited to mat…

If you're suggesting we all switch to writing APL then I'm probably in agreement with you :) but I still think you're partially undervaluing and partially misunderstanding the full potential of IDEs. >Can you think in terms of what a JetBrains codebase will look like after you refactor it, without actually doing the refactoring and seeing the result? How about with two or three such applications in play? Not sure wha…

You should try writing Scala in IntelliJ. It's not Idris, but it's a lot closer than C# is (and already past OCaml, IMO).

Re: The Era of Visual Studio Code

#393

Post by jimbokun »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #170
jimbokun wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems like Emacs shares the same product philosophy of VS Code. Outside of the core functionality everything is an ELisp/Javascript plugin. That explains Emacs amazing longevity, but as the article points out, Emacs longevity is actually a problem as its keyboard and UI conventions predate the modern conventions that came with Windows and MacOS.

It's a slightly different philosophy. Emacs is best viewed not as text editor with plugins, but as a Lisp Machine emulator with a text editor. The joke about it being an OS is more true than people think: what you get is a (2D, not 1D like shell) text-oriented programming environment, back from the times where "a programming environment" meant a fully end-user-programmable OS. This has an important downstream consequ…

Current keyboard conventions go back to 1984 and the Mac, and no sign of them changing anytime soon.

The article mentions Excel, for example, coming a few years after that and going strong today.

So I really do think Emacs predating those conventions is not going to be overcome.

Re: The Era of Visual Studio Code

#394

Post by oshea64bit »

A bit of a tangent, but I think it would be worth distinguishing between vim-as-the-text-editor and vim-as-the-keybindings. For me, the value of vim comes from how quickly I can manipulate text, not necessarily that I can use a text editor in the terminal.

For bigger projects, I mostly use VSCode (and used IntelliJ in the past) but with vim bindings turned on. Because of this, I feel it's a bit difficult to compare the popularity of something like VSCode and Vim.

Re: The Era of Visual Studio Code

#395

Post by vladvasiliu »

renewiltord wrote: post #384
varispeed wrote: post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From my experience out of the box you get poor performance and you have to spend a lot of time figuring out how to change configuration to improve it as knowledge is scattered in many places and not always up to date. Then it still likes to stall from time to time or sometimes doesn't register key presses properly. It's a poor user experience, but even worse is that alternatives are often worse. I wish there was an e…

Well, I think you're right about performance being a problem, but I have 64 GiB and a 4790k and an NVMe SSD. It's like half a percentage of my pre-tax income and was even less when I bought it. I don't need efficiency. I need something that, given fuel, gives me power. And as someone who has donated to vim, was an early backer of neovim's bountysource, and loves his terminal: vim is my ion drive, IntelliJ and friends…

I'm not sure how performance is a problem for Intellij. Granted, I've only ever used Pycharm but I've never felt it sluggish or "slow" or got the impression I was waiting around for the IDE to do its thing. All this on a 2013 MBP with 16GB of RAM.

I've found it also works very well on Linux on a laptop with a i5-8250U and 16 GB of RAM.

The only thing that seems "slow" is starting up and indexing libraries and whatnot. Now I've never loaded the same projects in VSCode, but I'm not sure indexing would be that much faster and the startup doesn't really bother me, as I don't launch it multiple times a day.

Re: The Era of Visual Studio Code

#396

Post by jdrobertso »

TheRealDunkirk wrote: post #299
drdaeman wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's the core product values for me. JetBrains IDEs are development environments, meant for editing code, in specific primary language. They really try their best to understand code that user works on (which is a hard problem, because code is frequently invalid while it's being actively edited), and make it as convenient as possible. VSCode is - in my understanding - essentially, a step over older glorified e…

> JetBrains IDEs are development environments, meant for editing code, in specific primary language. I've used RubyMine and IntelliJ. IntelliJ kept me sane for the thankfully-short time I worked with Java, and I appreciate it. But I can't get past how SLOW RubyMine is. Even on my $4,000 MBP, it just feels sluggish. Maybe that's because I'm at home on Rails, and I can think faster than the IDE, but there's really not…

How are you guys all working in one language?

I work on a stack that has ruby on rails on the backend, javascript on the frontend, .NET Core apps to do data transformation, and some NodeJS thrown in there, too. I have to switch back and forth between these projects regularly. There is no other tool like VS Code that provides me the flexibility to have snippets and highlighting and the things I need to maintain these projects, while also giving me the flexibility to switch between languages and syntax on the fly without having to wait 20 minutes just for the IDE to load up.

Re: The Era of Visual Studio Code

#397

Post by abhijat »

Teknoman117 wrote: post #358
BossingAround wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's good for JS. It's ok for Golang, since there doesn't seem to be anything better that's free. But I still feel it's an editor trying to be IDE. I love it for markdown/asciidoc though.

I'm a long time Linux user/developer, and I've completely switched to it for C++ on Linux. I've used vim and various simple text editors for a long time, but wow is VS Code nice. The Linux port of IntelliSense (at least for me) works more consistently than any of the of the code introspection tools plugins for vim I've tried. It works especially well if you're using CMake - it can pull all of the header paths out of…

Have you tried out the vscode-clangd plugin?

Re: The Era of Visual Studio Code

#398

Post by tjpnz »

willbw wrote: post #198

I find this post along with the comments in "A Picture of Java in 2020" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24551390 to be incongruous with my experience as a professional developer. My first couple of years writing software I used Vim, then VSCode, then worked in a Java shop and was forced to use IntelliJ. I didn't like it at first, but now after a couple of years I cannot see how I lived without it. The idea that…

People have written the same hype driven articles about Sublime, Atom and even IntelliJ. The same articles will continue to be written for whatever comes next. Just use whatever you feel makes you most productive. Having tried VSCode I ended up sticking with PyCharm/Goland.

Re: The Era of Visual Studio Code

#399

Post by macinjosh »

mekster wrote: post #367
macinjosh wrote: post #156

If you want a text editor with longevity try vim or emacs. They aren't dependent on the benevolence of a greedy corporation. Over time VSCode _will_ be raided by the bean counters at MS and it will begin to track you, give you ads about MS products, and lock you in to their ecosystem. I'll never understand why a professional developer would give so much influence over their work to the likes of MS, JetBrains, etc. Su…

I'd like to assume you're joking but 20 years of vim doesn't get me anywhere close to the productivity of JetBrains or even VS code on their first years. Vim first of all has its default set so that only very patient people can live with it. So you need to edit the defaults so much to make it slightly more comfortable, and you need to pick plugins that only some work as expected, mostly not updated in years and they…

> 20 years of vim doesn't get me anywhere close to the productivity of JetBrains or even VS code on their first years.

If that is the case you only scratched the surface of vim.

Re: The Era of Visual Studio Code

#400

Post by macinjosh »

cutler wrote: post #200
zeroxfe wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Two decades of vim here, and I switched to VS Code. As a "professional developer", it's just nicer to use, and makes me feel way more productive than ever. I definitely wouldn't call it a toy.

It's not like you have to give up Vim anyway considering the good-enough VSVim plugin gives you most of the Vim basics. Personally I have found JetBrains' Vim plugin to be the best.

If you use vim to its utmost a plugin that emulates vim in another editor pales in comparison.

It is like learning to play an instrument. Some people stop digging into it when they learn to play a few tunes but the true beauty comes out when you really invest the time into it.

Post reply on HN