Live data from Hacker News

The American Press Is Destroying Itself

taibbi.substack.com

391–400 of 618 posts

Re: The American Press Is Destroying Itself

#391
I knew to take the entire article with a grain of salt with the first sentence:

"Sometimes it seems life can’t get any worse in this country."

Yes, there are astonishingly brash, illegal actions being taken by police departments. Yes, we're still in the middle of a pandemic.

But that statement is absurd, and childish.

Re: The American Press Is Destroying Itself

#392

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can swap "left" and "right" in your comment and it would lose no substance and it's meaning would not change.

What are the right's social initiatives? Can you name three?

What you're doing here is meme-tier, bottom text: THE RIGHT HAS NO CULTURE. I'm a lefist and I find it insulting.

Re: The American Press Is Destroying Itself

#393
post #190
post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

This is exactly what I was talking about. You make a bunch of assumptions about peoples' political opinions that are incorrectly portraying them as centrists and supporters of nazis if they don't adopt your world view. "Us or them" is killing America. Lack of nuance and intelligent discourse is destroying us. There's more to the extreme left than "Everyone deserves to be treated equally and with dignity." Politics in…

There really isn't more to the "extreme left" than equality and dignity.

The problem is that even suggesting that equality and dignity are valid as bedrock communal values in business, politics, law, and economics is considered an aggressively extremist ultra-left position in the US - and not a sane and mature common sense centre-left view, as it is in parts of Europe.

There's a reason for this, and it's to do with the real bedrock values of US culture.

Bottom line is the Left in the US operates the same way as the rest of US culture does.

And the underlying problem is understanding why, not complaining about superficial dynamics that are actually consistent with the way the culture operates as a whole.

Re: The American Press Is Destroying Itself

#394
And it is destroying the country. The death of Floyd was no doubt a hideous crime, which should be punished harshly but the narrative of systemic and widespread police racism is unsupported by data and incredibly, irresponsibly manufactured by the media. We are close to a civil war, in the middle of a pandemic, we are all out of our minds with rage and indignation and, for the most part things were better than ever, including the level of police brutality. I beg all of you, do not let yourself be manipulated, no matter how righteous it might feel. Check the actual facts. More whites are killed by police than blacks, in absolute terms as well as per crime committed [1]. Sam Harris discusses all of this in his latest podcast, just hear him out [2]. America is not perfect, for sure, there is still racism, for sure, and the police could do far better, for sure, but we are burning the country down in a middle of a plague, when we should be working together to solve all of this. And its largely the fault of the media.

[1] https://www.statista.com/statistics/585152/people-shot-to-de...

[2] https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cHM6Ly93YWtpbmd1cC5saWJ...

Re: The American Press Is Destroying Itself

#395

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What I'm saying is that when black people kill more than ten times more black people than cops kill black people, somebody is not wrong to ask why the focus should only be on the cops.

Again, the focus isn't only on cops. There's plenty of time, effort, money, etc. spent on minimizing "normal" violence and crime. Society is quite capable of doing more than one thing at once, even if the media likes to focus.

You can't realistically claim that the focus isn't on the police right now.

And they're not even wrong. Policing in the US is in serious need of reform.

But you're doing the thing you're saying you're not doing. If we can do both things at once, then why shouldn't we do both things at once? Why are we dismissing people who want to do the other thing?

Re: The American Press Is Destroying Itself

#396
post #384

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Economist has high quality news. It has a slight free market/neoliberal bias on economic issues, but for politics it's just the facts. Wikipedia is actually a decent free news source too, since articles about current events get updated and reviewed frequently.

The Economist is completely biased, they just have a way to write that somehow tones it down. You could probably write a National-Socialist or Marxist-Leninist publication in the style of the Economist.

My impression of the economist is that they are unashamed and forward with their perspective. You read it and you get "this is a neoliberal perspective and these are the arguments of of neoliberales." So yes, they write from a very clear perspective, but it doesn't feel like bias creeping in. Instead it feels like "this is what this situation looks like from this perspective." Bias is trickiest when it's hard to tell where someone is coming from, and with them I never have a problem.

Re: The American Press Is Destroying Itself

#397
post #277

On a side note, does anyone subscribe to any good news/information site? I would like to subscribe to something good and know I'm supporting it.

Highly recommend the Financial Times, a British newspaper owned by a Japanese corporation, has very robust world reporting. Letters to the editor section that sometimes reads like a Davos guest list.

Re: The American Press Is Destroying Itself

#398
post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People also seem to be unaware that howling mobs move on ...you just have to wait them out. Stand firm and they'll quickly find another target to bully.

Case in point: remember last year when the governor and the AG (I think?) of Virginia were caught in blackface 30 years ago and the lieutenant governor was revealed to have raped a woman in college 20 years ago? And they all refused to resign? Everyone forgot about that a month later.

The only thing I admire about Trump is his megalomania and ignorance makes him impervious to politically correct McCarthyites. The Twitter mobs will move on, just wait a little while.

Re: The American Press Is Destroying Itself

#399

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Again, the focus isn't only on cops. There's plenty of time, effort, money, etc. spent on minimizing "normal" violence and crime. Society is quite capable of doing more than one thing at once, even if the media likes to focus.

You can't realistically claim that the focus isn't on the police right now. And they're not even wrong. Policing in the US is in serious need of reform. But you're doing the thing you're saying you're not doing. If we can do both things at once, then why shouldn't we do both things at once? Why are we dismissing people who want to do the other thing?

As far as I'm aware, none of the efforts to curb normal violence and crime ("Problem A") have declined. The only thing that's changed is that more people are joining the chorus to fix policing ("Problem B").

Nobody is going to dismiss you for wanting to fix Problem A. But that's a very different thing than intruding on conversations about Problem B to tell people to focus on Problem A instead.

The Black Lives Matter movement is explicitly about dealing with systemic racism and state violence against Black people. If you want to contribute to solving other issues (and there are many other issues), go for it, but I don't see what that has to do with Black Lives Matter.

Re: The American Press Is Destroying Itself

#400

For those in the comments that haven't read the article, I highly recommend you check it out. While the comments are talking about the survival of news media and "tone-deaf" titles, the bulk of the article is about the Overton window[1] shifting to the point where rigerous journalism questioning outrages of the time is becoming untenable, weakening the news overall. It's a very good read. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org…

I would advise care when reading it. It’s not immediately clear but it uses very hand picked facts to paint a very different picture of what’s actually going on. I call these kinds of articles disinformation-lite; not outright lies but selectively picking events to portray a hypothetical scenario that doesn’t really hold true.

I’ll cite a specific example to make this case. See this paragraph:

> Cotton did not call for “military force against protesters in American cities.” He spoke of a “show of force,” to rectify a situation a significant portion of the country saw as spiraling out of control. It’s an important distinction. Cotton was presenting one side of the most important question on the most important issue of a critically important day in American history.

What Cotton actually said:

> One thing above all else will restore order to our streets: an overwhelming show of force to disperse, detain and ultimately deter lawbreakers.

(Emphasis mine)

It’s very clear to anyone reading Cottons article that the call is to deploy troops to subdue he largely peaceful protests, which are painted as overwhelmingly violent in the beginning of the article. The author of the current article is simply using selective words to further his argument.

The other arguments are similar in nature. So while it appears to be a good read, it actually is not.

Post reply on HN