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YouTube and Reddit roll out new restrictions including channel and sub bans

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Re: YouTube and Reddit roll out new restrictions including channel and sub bans

#391
post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I am just pointing out that an untrained populace armed with even military-style assault weapons is really just laughable if your enemy is the largest military that has ever existed with technology and weapons that could annihilate humanity. Tell that to the Nazis. They were the military superpower of their time. Except for the nuclear option every armed enemy can tie up >10 soldiers if they are going to try to kee…

Third reich army was trained. It was army. This is not an example of "untrained populace". This is example of well trained army from country with great military tradition. The fight against nazi was ultimately won by armies, not by "untrained populace". All in all, this is really odd example.

> Third reich army was trained. It was army. This is not an example of "untrained populace".

Yep. That is my point.

> The fight against nazi was ultimately won by armies, not by "untrained populace".

Also true. But local groups (and of course SOE operations) helped tying up their resources so they couldn't help on the eastern front or start the invasion of Britain.

From Wikipedia[0]: The following afternoon, on 8 May, ... At this time there were no fewer than 400,000 German troops in Norway, which had a population of barely three million.

[0]: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_occupation_of_Norway

Re: YouTube and Reddit roll out new restrictions including channel and sub bans

#392

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The second amendment states that a well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. I’m no expert on the legalities and legal interpretations of the 2nd amendment but it seems to me a case could be made that well regulated gives the government broad regulatory powers. The mention of militia could be interpreted to mean only members of the…

The Battles of Lexington and Concord were fought to keep "the military" (British troops) from taking weapons away from arguably "self-regulated" militias. I think it's a tough case to make if you're arguing that the Constitution was referring solely to current members of armed services commissioned by the government.

Those militias were under the control of the colonial government. Indeed one of the colonials killed at Lexington was an ensign. That militia was the army at the time.

Re: YouTube and Reddit roll out new restrictions including channel and sub bans

#393
But Google still has the NRA channel. The list of companies that have cut ties with the NRA are very long but do not include Google.

"One By One, Companies Cut Ties With The NRA"

https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2018/02/23/588233273...

Re: YouTube and Reddit roll out new restrictions including channel and sub bans

#394

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Second Amendment did not limit the type of arms it applied to, and the reason that it's preamble referred to the dependency of the security of a free state on a well-regulated militia was because it was in the context of the best universal opinion at the time that large standing professional armed forces for either internal security or international conflict were a mechanism of tyranny , and that having a free co…

According to the quote I have of the Wikipedia article there are Supreme Court cases that say it does limit the type of arms.

Yes, you can't have sawed-off shotguns, for example, because those are not a military weapon and cannot contribute to the common defense.

Re: YouTube and Reddit roll out new restrictions including channel and sub bans

#395
post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why not an iPhone? At least Apple seems to care about privacy, and they aren't an ad-tech company like Google or FB.

Apple pretends to care about privacy as long as it is good for the bottom line.

> Apple pretends to care about privacy as long as it is good for the bottom line.

I don't care why Apple's interests are aligned with mine, as long as they are. When it comes to corporations, dealing with one whose bottom line is aligned with my interest is exactly what I want.

Also, Apple is not 'pretending' to care about privacy. While they have had some embarrassing bugs, they do put privacy as a high priority. Many speculate that Apple is behind in the assistant category because of privacy concerns.

Re: YouTube and Reddit roll out new restrictions including channel and sub bans

#396

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This is very dismaying to see This is the chilling effect from the attack on Section 230 safe harbor protection (an attack which was largely “justified” by conduct which was already found to be outside of the pre-existing safe harbor, and so which needed no modification to deal with.) Companies that are being responsible to their shareholders are going to change behavior to minimize exposure to content which is lik…

We're also seeing corporations removing discounts for NRA members. I don't see a link between that and legal fiduciary duty in those actions. They seem to be reactions to social pressure. That's speaking as someone who would like to see clearer legal protections for content-neutral hosting platforms.

> We're also seeing corporations removing discounts for NRA members. I don't see a link between that and legal fiduciary duty in those actions. They seem to be reactions to social pressure.

Thats a slightly different, but related [0] effect. The NRAs own PR approach has made special deals with the NRA a PR liability for many businesses. Public relations aren't something companies burn money on for entertainment value, they do it because corporate image impacts the bottom line, because it has a direct effect on things like consumer choices and ability to attract and retain talent.

[0] related in that lawsuits are also used to address political issues (and targeting tangentially-involved businesses formgun violence is a well-known example of that), so that the public mood on gun policy that shapes the reaction to NRA PR efforts also is a factor in the legal risk that firms face with Section 230 being weakened.

Re: YouTube and Reddit roll out new restrictions including channel and sub bans

#397
post #367

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's not censorship, it's moderating your platform. On the contrary, it's literally censorship. It's moderation through censorship. > I can't really see how you can complain if they decide that they don't want to deal with your content anymore. I don't find this line of thinking convincing. It's certainly appropriate to criticize moderation policies of platforms. If YouTube decided to censor videos on how to use co…

>On the contrary, it's literally censorship. It's moderation through censorship. I suppose you can say that but I don't think it's a useful definition. Censorship is a strong word, if we overuse it it's going to lose its meaning. Censorship generally has the intent of removing something from society at large because the elites deem it dangerous. Youtube isn't calling for the removal of gun content from the internet,…

> If your Dungeon and Dragon forum bans you because you posted porn, are they censoring you?

Yes. Censorship is a neutral term.

> If you expect advertising-powered private platforms that host your content pro-bono...

I expect people to let each other say their piece. Content owners and content hosts have a partnership, and the balance of power definitely tips toward Reddit and YouTube at the moment.

We can argue that "someone can go start up a more permissive platform", but if we're not sharp and clear about how current hosts should behave, the next hosts won't have a clear understanding of what they should be doing differently. If we're not sharp and clear about how current hosts should behave, regulators trying to get YouTube and Reddit out of the moderation business will likely defer to whichever lobbyists happen to be in the room.

Re: YouTube and Reddit roll out new restrictions including channel and sub bans

#398
it was eventual. once you get big, you have to follow these guidelines or run the risk of ad revenue disappearing or getting sued by the government. with success comes the spotlight.

it will be sad the day when they ban r/pomeranians and other animal channels cause it will be consider animal cruelty to put eyebrows on your pom or a pickle behind your cat.

Re: YouTube and Reddit roll out new restrictions including channel and sub bans

#399

There are _so_ many ways to make a leathel weapon I can't begin... If I take my car (a Jeep Grand Cherokee) and ram it into a crowd - I'm confident that can take out more people than I can with a gun, knife, probably even bomb. Point being, I understand not facilitating trade, but for the love of god, videos? You really want to push the right over the edge? We need guns. Legally, in the U.S. it's our right - one of t…

EDIT: The fact that I actually support the second amendment seems to be lost on some readers who didn't take the time to read a nuanced opinion. :) Okay, I don't support the restrictions YouTube and Reddit are putting on free speech, but I think we need to keep things rational here: > We need guns. Legally, in the U.S. it's our right - one of the first and most protected rights. The ability to defend yourself and cou…

> Guns as they are allowed now don't allow you to protect yourself from tyranny. Look at the Branch Davidians in Waco, Texas. Whether or not you believe they had illegal guns, they had guns, and they died. Guns lose to tanks every time. When the second amendment was drafted, guns made sense as a way to defend your rights from the government, but in the modern day, it's been probably half a century since civilians lost the arms race. Civilian gun ownership has lost its relevance as a means of defending our rights in the face of increasingly militarized law enforcement.

The thing about firearms is they equalize power. You are almost certainly bigger and stronger than me, you could beat me up in a fight, if I had a knife you could probably take it from me. When I have a gun your power advantage is greatly diminished and your size becomes a detriment. If we're both armed with firearms the disparity in power is much closer than otherwise. If we played out a fight 10,000 times we'd expect the odds to be 50/50 on either side.

The same is true among groups of people: a pair of cops with a gun can control a dozen prisoners working in a chain gang until just one of those convicts has control over a gun. You only need to look at how expensive it is to clear a madman who's held up in their home or for soldiers to clear streets in the middle-east even when most people living there aren't armed (as they're just regular people caught in a conflict zone). Armed individuals mean it's no longer possible for 1 or 2 people with guns to overpower them, you need to outnumber 3, 5, 10 to one to tilt the odds in your favor again.

Look at how effective—or ineffective—powerful western armies were fighting comparatively poorly armed Afghan and Iraqi rebels. For the most part, these were people with relatively little training and practice, small arms, and loose organization and yet they've managed styme the west's greatest powers for nearly 2 decades. They're better armed than your typical dooms-day prepper, but not by much (and those same doomsday people argue they should be able to horde mortars and RPGs if they want to). If we took the most extreme 'weapons-rights' view I think it is reasonable to think a few million angry Americans could oppose a president like Trump ordering the US military to enforce some sort of tyranny. We've seen that kind of thing have great effect in recent history and all the way back to the first and second world wars where armed citizens were able to take bake their cities (Warsaw) and mobilize into effective resistance movements.

That's where the value of an armed population is found. The government can kick in my door with a half dozen thugs and take everything from me. What they can't do is take everything from a town where half the homes have people prepared to resist. An armed population makes it impossible for a government to effectively oppress the people. Can you imagine the Khmer Rouge making much progress in Texas or Arizona? That's the way a firearms owning population protects against tyranny. The government can get away with "picking on" small groups: klansmen, draft-dodgers, homosexuals, men's-rights activists, but it is much more difficult to impose a more totalitarian rule without popular support.

That's the system I think most people generally support: the government has a "right" to use violence against its enemies provided that use is targeted and narrow. It doesn't have a "right" to broadly disregard the will of the people or to try and enforce rules most people won't somewhat-willingly comply with.

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Some people don't think that's okay: they see the cost of policing in America, where police (rightly?) assume everyone is armed and angry and the police are quick to violence and say "there is nothing worth this!" There are people who will point at the rates of violent crime and say "even if a gun ban won't help, it certainly can't hurt." and they'll hear stories of children killing themselves or their parents 'accidentally' and say "even so-called responsible gun owners can't be trusted not to put themselves and others in danger through negligence."

I understand those positions, I'm even sympathetic to them. At the same time, I don't think it's too much to ask that those of us who think that maybe the American relationship with firearms could use some changes at least try to consider the arguments, rather than trotting out some "lone man with AR-15 destroys US Navy thereby defending freedom of everyone from Trump's goon army" fantasy to poke fun at.

Re: YouTube and Reddit roll out new restrictions including channel and sub bans

#400

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Don't take guns away from people to protect the populace because if you try to do it nutters with guns will shoot people"? That sounds like justification for taking people's guns from them.

Every time I see this argument come up people always try to frame it like it will be ‘nutters’ shooting ‘some’ people. You are very wrong, and that is the attitude that will get a lot of innocent people killed. This country is filled with rational, professional, well organized people who will kill before being disarmed.

> well organized people who will kill before being disarmed.

The collective noun for people who will kill rather than obey the law is "terrorists".

One of the conditions for peace in Northern Ireland was that political groups had to disarm in order to enter politics, because you can't do politics with people who are threatening to murder you. That's not a democracy.

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