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Bash on Ubuntu on Windows

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Re: Bash on Ubuntu on Windows

#391

Post by koenigdavidmj »

ultramancool wrote: post #377
koenigdavidmj wrote: post #368

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Windows doesn't provide consistency between versions at the interrupt level, and Wine doesn't provide any interface at that level. It's basically a COFF loader, and a bunch of regular userspace functions in DLLs that do everything. Linux, on the other hand, provides exactly that, and this wrapper makes it so that you can actually run "movl $1, %eax; movl $0, %ebx; int $0x80" and it will actually call the equivalent o…

Yes Windows does provide such a thing: http://j00ru.vexillium.org/ntapi/ Would be very interesting to see a Wine based on this concept instead...

Of course it does at some point, but they're not meant to be used by the public, which is why:

* you're linking to a URL with leetspeak in it, and not MSDN.

* the codes change so frequently.

* some of them disappear or are renumbered, even in service packs.

If we wanted to do this for Wine, then it would also require emulation or something like OS X's Hypervisor.framework to catch system calls, which seems heavyhanded when we have working code already.

Re: Bash on Ubuntu on Windows

#393

Post by wrs »

dboreham wrote: post #347

I wonder who came up with the "Bash on Windows" tagline. That was a really smart idea. I think most of us would have run with "Emulated Linux syscall layer from user mode processes on Windows". Promoting bash specifically seems to me like engineering marketing genius -- less technically knowledgeable people are more likely to be familiar with bash, while the more knowledgeable are going to think "wait...what? how do…

Not totally clear to me, since most of the devs around here saw it and thought more along the lines of Cygwin. This is a much bigger deal than Cygwin!

Re: Bash on Ubuntu on Windows

#394

Post by munin »

xorblurb wrote: post #384
munin wrote: post #280

Earlier quoted context omitted.

is it a derived work of the NT kernel if it's contained in a separate loadable driver? my understanding is that's where this system call interface is contained, and as I understand it, you can have GPL NT drivers..?

It is not very probable that only public interfaces are used to implement this subsystem. Therefore, we can think that the special exception of the GPL that exclude major components of the OS would not apply. It also explicitly won't apply in the first place because MS is absolutely in the case: "that component itself (1) accompanies the executable (2)" (1) core NT kernel (2) Linux subsystem

I'm pretty sure you can use only public interfaces to implement this subsystem. You can do quite a lot to NT via the public interfaces, and it helps that the stuff in the linux subsystem basically only needs to work with itself (i.e. you don't need to send signals to Windows processes... but even if you needed to, you could use public interfaces to do that from the kernel...)

Re: Bash on Ubuntu on Windows

#395

Post by evook »

merpnderp wrote: post #356
evook wrote: post #285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except if you expect a snappy UI. OS X and Linux with X11 or even Wayland are easily 20 years behind windows in terms of UI responsiveness and snappiness. The constant input lag of unix desktops always drives me back to windows for my workstations, although I am a fullheart windows server hater and despite everything that comes with it. It's stable, extremely fast and when edited/hacked right also privacy aware.

I use a mac alongside a win10 machine, with the win10 being brand new i7 hardware with ddr4 ram. And OSX's UI is far far snappier and hangs quite a bit less. My win10 machine often will just hang for no reason at all for a few seconds, then pop up whatever I had switched to.

Which GPU are you using? I have a 2015 Mac Pro with two D500, before I had a mid tear iMac. The mac pro stands directly besides my "beast" a i7 6700, titan x, nvm custom machine.

I can't really describe it, but it's bothering me and I would put my hand in a fire betting that it's somehow measurable. It feels like the input lag of a cheap IPS-Monitor. Every klick, every slide, every window resize has this minimum lag of maybe 10 to 50 ms, worse on linux. That's hardware independent, because that was already bothering me with a MacBook Pro and my old iMac. I haven't booted OSX in years to work production because of that tbh (Every piece of apple hardware I own is booted 99% of the time with Arch or W10E) but did it just now and compared it side to side. It's still there. It's driving me crazy. I know that I am hyper sensitive for lags and stuttering because of my former quake carrier.

Re: Bash on Ubuntu on Windows

#396

Post by JdeBP »

krisroadruck wrote: post #293
JdeBP wrote: post #279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What goes wrong when you try to install Java?

if you go the apt-get route you get a sha256sum mismatch on both java7 & java8. If you try to be clever and manually download it and throw it in the cache, same story. If you try to be really really clever and manually download it and try to manually extract the tar it throws a bunch of cannot create symlink: invalid argument errors. I spent a good 2+ hours trying to force it to install in various ways. For now at le…

For those interested in this, here's a more detailed report from someone named Joachim Moeyens.

* https://community.lsst.org/t/lsst-stack-on-ubuntu-linux-on-w...

Be aware that the Java8 installer/uninstaller has other potential symbolic link problems (not "invalid argument", though) that exist on actual Ubuntu Linux.

* http://askubuntu.com/questions/608961/

* http://askubuntu.com/questions/653885/

Re: Bash on Ubuntu on Windows

#397

Post by Starsgen »

Can I run chron and schedule jobs?

I have Win 7, so I was thinking of running a VM with Win 10 to try it out (once it is officially released).

It sounds like it runs X/Windows which is fantastic!

Re: Bash on Ubuntu on Windows

#398

Post by JdeBP »

hellameta wrote: post #367
dboreham wrote: post #347

I wonder who came up with the "Bash on Windows" tagline. That was a really smart idea. I think most of us would have run with "Emulated Linux syscall layer from user mode processes on Windows". Promoting bash specifically seems to me like engineering marketing genius -- less technically knowledgeable people are more likely to be familiar with bash, while the more knowledgeable are going to think "wait...what? how do…

Is this sarcasm? Bash on Windows definitely comes before "Emulated Linux syscall layer from user mode processes on Windows" ... it's a great name, sure, but marketing genius?

It's probably not a reference to https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11391931 , but see that anyway. Naming is up for discussion according to the developers.

Re: Bash on Ubuntu on Windows

#399

Post by Bedon292 »

I put this on my machine last night, and quite enjoyed playing around with it. apt-get, python and everything I tried worked. Even vim works great, as long as you don't mind 16 colors. The one thing I could not figure out was getting 256 colors out of Command Prompt.

Has anyone come up with a solution for that yet? I wonder if you can install something like xterm, and get that running outside of Command Prompt...

Re: Bash on Ubuntu on Windows

#400

Post by charonn0 »

dlandis wrote: post #333
annnnd wrote: post #323

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> One legal thing that I'm also wondering about is the "Linux" trademark. This probably explains why they never talk about Linux (at least I never saw it), but always about Ubuntu. I guess they have an agreement with Canonical.

They mention "Linux" all the time. The feature is called Windows Subsystem for Linux (Beta).

The "for Linux" part is their hedge, I think. I recall Microsoft forced a project known as "Ultimate Windows Boot CD" to change its name to "Ultimate Boot CD for Windows".
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