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Student beauty and grades under in-person and remote teaching

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Re: Student beauty and grades under in-person and remote teaching

#381

Post by jimbokun »

mikkupikku wrote: post #115
torginus wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think most 'attractive' people put effort into their appearances, which might appeal to management types who evaluate work performance. Also, imo the best way to get a management position in my experience isn't to work hard, or be knowledgeable, but to be the least objectionable pick. This varies with country/company, with Euros usually being appearance focused, but in US companies, it's dudes in crumpled T-shirts…

Best way to get a manager position is to be a few inches taller than everybody else. It doesn't make a lick of sense, but pay attention to how often the boss is taller than everybody else on the team. Not always, but far more often than random chance can account for. (Incidentally, the best boss I ever had was barely 5 feet.)

I think this only applies to men?

Re: Student beauty and grades under in-person and remote teaching

#382

Post by iamacyborg »

gcanyon wrote: post #342
iamacyborg wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t think that’s particularly true. There’s a lot you can do with texture, colours and silhouettes, even within items that are “the same”. I do think most men are pretty unimaginative when it comes to dressing themselves though, and most can’t even do basic things like getting trousers hemmed to fit them properly.

Never forget the Australian newscaster who wore the same suit for a year and no one noticed/called him out for it. His broadcasting partner, a woman, had been called out for wearing the same outfit previously. There may be subtle variations available to men, but the simple fact is that many fewer people notice or care. https://www.bbc.com/news/newsbeat-30069564

> There may be subtle variations available to men, but the simple fact is that many fewer people notice or care.

I wouldn’t say that’s the takeaway, even with a simple navy suit you have a lot of options.

What that article does do though is highlight just how low the bar is for men to dress.

Re: Student beauty and grades under in-person and remote teaching

#383

Post by jimbokun »

Spivak wrote: post #160
Aurornis wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> if I had my way, job interviews would be exclusively audio only. Unfortunately, cheating is becoming rampant in remote interviews, especially for early career roles right now. I think companies are moving toward having final interview rounds in person because it’s such an effective tactic to discourage interview cheating.

Forget cheating, we get entirely fake people applying for our positions.

Someone needs to right a novel about an LLM that gets hired through phone interviews, becomes a star employee, and rises through the ranks to CEO , always coming up with excuses to not show up in person.

Like a 21st century Office Space.

Add in a remote only office romance to give it a romcom vibe.

Re: Student beauty and grades under in-person and remote teaching

#384

Post by jimbokun »

Aurornis wrote: post #281
jeremie_strand wrote: post #116

[flagged]

I don’t think it’s that simple. My assistant professor friends build relationships with students and help them work on topics and weaknesses. They get to know students and how to help them on problem areas. For deeper courses they may help them pick topics to write about and sources to read. Having that context for the ongoing feedback from grading and mentoring is valuable. Depending on the work it simply might not…

You would have to separate the teaching and assessment functions entirely.

Re: Student beauty and grades under in-person and remote teaching

#385

Post by arw0n »

TrackerFF wrote: post #68

People that have used to be fat, and then lost a lot of weight, will know how brutally different people will treat you. Whereas you'd practically be a ghost before weight loss, random people will suddenly look you in your eyes, smile, even start conversations with you. Some will of course argue that you losing weight will also make you more confident, and thus you become more approachable. I think there's a lot of bi…

> People will go out of their way to help you, and to support you. Over time this could very well boost your ego to also become more confident and decisive.

This was my first thought about why the move to online works for men but not women. When I was attractive, people intuitively thought I was competent as well. I could speak with authority on topics not knowing more than the average and people would believe me.

Fo women this might sometimes even be the other way around - more beauty is associated with less intelligence.

Re: Student beauty and grades under in-person and remote teaching

#386

Post by jimbokun »

crims0n wrote: post #6

> When education is in-person, attractive students receive higher grades in non-quantitative subjects, in which teachers tend to interact more with students compared to quantitative courses. I wonder how much of this is less about attraction and more about social skills. Granted, higher attraction affords more opportunity to develop those skills, but I have met plenty of charming people who were not conventionally at…

Then why would it change between in person and remote environments?

Re: Student beauty and grades under in-person and remote teaching

#387

Post by ralferoo »

Melonai wrote: post #237
xyzelement wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a benefit. Being healthy and fit is objectively great for you. That your peers subtly nudge you in that direction is great. And in contrast, I feel horrible about "body positivity" - making you feel good about an objective problem that's incapacitating and killing you is a huge problem.

I'm also quite anti "body positivity" as it is usually espoused online, especially in relation to weight, which is by far the main focus of the movement. It feels quite self-destructive, you accept that your weight is unchangeable (even though I would say that in 75% of cases, and probably even more, it definitely isn't), and try to feel "proud" of it, even though there are piles upon piles of quite definitive resear…

I agree with a lot of this. For context, I'm very fat, so I feel a bit more that it's OK to say this, but yeah the body shaming stuff is a very interesting topic.

Obviously, if you feel that your whole life you're being bullied, then it's definitely right to be empowered someway to get someone to stop bullying you that way.

But we seem to have gone way beyond stopping body shaming and to promoting body positivity, which I think is dangerous. We shouldn't be teaching kids that it's OK to be fat and that's just a personal choice and not to change.

The simple fact is that being overweight leads to a lot of health issues. I'm fortunate that my body still tolerates being able to run, but at my BMI that's by no means a guarantee long term. I know that realistically, I need to drop 1/3 of my body weight ASAP and keep it off, or the chances of me living another 20 years is actually quite low.

I know exactly the issues with weight loss and how hard it is. At least 3 times in my life, I've lost 25% of my body weight through dieting, but it's always a constant struggle to keep that off if I ease off even a little bit. Most of the times I've regressed, it's been a combination of factors - an injury so I can't go out running for a few months, maybe winter so it's cold and wet and I'm also avoiding my daily lunchtime walk, and maybe my work is really boring so I'm comfort eating a bit more than I need each day, and suddenly before you even realise it, all the weight has suddenly re-appeared, and each time it's harder than the last to get rid of it and keep it off for good.

But definitely, we want a bit of that stigma to remain. Knowing that I'm fat and that most girls don't even look twice at me, or knowing that the health risks are very real and every day I stay fat, it's doing even more damage to my body... it all sucks in the moment, but it's all helping the motivation that something needs to change. It's not OK to just do nothing.

Re: Student beauty and grades under in-person and remote teaching

#388

Post by jimbokun »

bombcar wrote: post #313
kevinsync wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's always said that a lot of success and opportunities are attributed to being in the right place at the right time (aka "luck"), but in a lot of cases, those folks had the tenacity to be in the right place ALL the time; when opportunities arise, they typically go to whoever's present and available. Chatting with professors after class or attending office hours might be a grift, but it's not necessarily unfair. Spe…

What's the old saying? So much of success is up to luck, but you can make your own luck?

Woody Allen said 80% of success is showing up.

Re: Student beauty and grades under in-person and remote teaching

#389

Post by jimbokun »

bombcar wrote: post #322
azan_ wrote: post #189

The most interesting results is that the title is true only for females - for males the beauty premium persisted!

Male beauty is so powerful it can be transmitted over TCP/IP?

This feels like a Zoolander quote.

Re: Student beauty and grades under in-person and remote teaching

#390

Post by mikkupikku »

neilv wrote: post #318
bombcar wrote: post #263

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This reminds me that SkyMall (RIP) always had those advertisements for height increasing shoes. Now that I think of it, the inflight magazines still have those ... Amusingly enough the best CEO and best salesman I ever knew (two different people) were below average height.

It could be that height says nothing about competence as a CEO, or it could be that the people who attain CEO and succeed despite height bias need to have an exceptionally strong mix of merit/will/effort. I've heard the latter theory at least a couple times about US Navy SEALs. The first time, it was a retired SEAL I knew (well over 6', and a brick wall) who one day out of the blue said something like, "You shouldn't…

I've heard that special forces guys tend to be smaller, but I'm not sure that's true. It seems like there could be a few tactical advantages to being shorter, less likely to bump your head maybe, but who knows.
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