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AirPods libreated from Apple's ecosystem

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Re: AirPods libreated from Apple's ecosystem

#381

Post by array_key_first »

raw_anon_1111 wrote: post #378
array_key_first wrote: post #371

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, except that SMS/MMS sucks major ass, and RCS is really, really bad too. Not as awful as SMS, but close, and missing various barebones features. That's not Apple's fault per se, but of course, they contribute to it. They should open up the iMessage protocol.

So what you are saying is that for Apple to create a better experience, they have to add to the industry standard - the same as AirPods.

Yes, that would be mutually beneficial both for Apple customers and people who are not Apple customers.

Re: AirPods libreated from Apple's ecosystem

#382

Post by manmal »

oofbey wrote: post #297
bloppe wrote: post #286

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're commenting on a post where a random guy provides this "nightmare of supplying and supporting an app" in his spare time, except he actually has to work around Apple's malicious obfuscation and standards non-compliance, so it would actually be way easier for Apple to do it themselves.

It is in fact significantly harder for Apple. Because nobody expects random spare time GitHub project to work perfectly. Or even very well. Apple’s reputation, and trillion dollar market value, is based on the idea that their stuff works perfectly.

Are you aware they are maintaining multiple complete OSs, and multiple versions of each? With drivers for hundreds of components? The scope of AirPods on Android is laughable in comparison.

Re: AirPods libreated from Apple's ecosystem

#383

Post by freedomben »

manmal wrote: post #380
TylerE wrote: post #336

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or… just report whichever one is lower, which is the value 99% of people care about 99% of The time.

I often use just one of them, and then I want to know that one‘s battery.

If you're only using one, it seems fine to have only one battery level report. I don't see the problem

Re: AirPods libreated from Apple's ecosystem

#384

Post by Andrex »

yard2010 wrote: post #119
Andrex wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm convinced it's impossible to implement the BT spec without MANY of these kinds of bugs popping up. Apple mercy-killed Adobe Flash, we should be asking they do the same to Bluetooth. I'm sick of living in a reality where no one thinks to make something better. It has to be possible.

Apple killed flash and an alternative has not emerged decades later. Please don't give these pricks ideas.

Adobe Animate (née Flash) still exists and exports HTML5-ready MP4s now. Which, as an actual user of Macromedia Flash and dabbler in Newgrounds uploads, is a much better situation. Flash the plugin sucked shit and everyone knew it, including Tom Fulp.

Re: AirPods libreated from Apple's ecosystem

#385

Post by Andrex »

mschuster91 wrote: post #137
Andrex wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm convinced it's impossible to implement the BT spec without MANY of these kinds of bugs popping up. Apple mercy-killed Adobe Flash, we should be asking they do the same to Bluetooth. I'm sick of living in a reality where no one thinks to make something better. It has to be possible.

> Apple mercy-killed Adobe Flash, we should be asking they do the same to Bluetooth. They won't, because it turns out Bluetooth is the best thing we have at "discover nearby devices". Guess how Apple TV/screen sharing detection, iPhone hotspot detection and configuration, AirDrop and a whole host of other features work without communicating via some cloud mothership? They are all using Bluetooth to do detection and n…

That's what I'm saying. Adobe ends BT support in all their devices and software stacks and switches to "Appletooth," which they promise to open up and then 5 years later actually do it.

Appletooth being a from-scratch all-new, cleanly-designed protocol that makes actual sense and is easy to implement by vendors without inherent security flaws.

I won't lie, it would be a horrifically painful transition. But it would be worth it. Apple should have some courage when it's actually called for (...not killing hardware ports, which no consumer was asking for).

I've never used iPhones and have stuck by Google Pixel. I still feel all of the above in my heart. Apple's the only one who can possibly fulfill my dream of Bluetooth's bitter end.

Re: AirPods libreated from Apple's ecosystem

#386

Post by bubblethink »

rangestransform wrote: post #363
bubblethink wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's tautological. Everything that is not supported is so because supporting it has a cost. The question is what is the cost? It seems quite obvious that the marginal revenue from airpods would be overshadowed by the revenue of getting a user in the ecosystem.

Having to test the AirPods with more standards compliant devices, having to waste time to tell customers to fuck off if their phone/laptop/toaster is not standards compliant, having to waste engineering time to investigate non compliant aliexpress phones/laptops/toasters, wasting time to implement additional functionality for Apple customers because it has to go into the spec first

Yes, all that is a part of the cost equation, which points to the same thing, namely, that $200-$300 widgets are not worth selling to the general public; they would rather sell them to a customer who will spend a lot more in the ecosystem. Same as razors and blades or consoles and games.

Re: AirPods libreated from Apple's ecosystem

#387

Post by Zetaphor »

dmitrygr wrote: post #312
Zetaphor wrote: post #299

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The multipoint spec was added to Bluetooth 4.0 in 2010: https://www.bluetooth.com/specifications/specs/core-specific... The Battery Service 1.0 spec was officially adopted in 2011: https://www.bluetooth.com/specifications/specs/battery-servi... The first airpods were released in 2016... Please consider that simping for a trillion dollar company might actually not be in your best personal interests...

What do you mean by "multipoint spec"? I have written a few BT stacks (you might have even used one I wrote at one point or another) and I have no idea what you mean by that phrase. Please cite a section of the spec or proper name of what you are talking about.

If you're such an expert then you could have likely found this even easier than I did:

https://www.bluetooth.com/specifications/specs/multi-profile...

Re: AirPods libreated from Apple's ecosystem

#388

Post by dmitrygr »

Zetaphor wrote: post #387
dmitrygr wrote: post #312

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you mean by "multipoint spec"? I have written a few BT stacks (you might have even used one I wrote at one point or another) and I have no idea what you mean by that phrase. Please cite a section of the spec or proper name of what you are talking about.

If you're such an expert then you could have likely found this even easier than I did: https://www.bluetooth.com/specifications/specs/multi-profile...

Airpods already do this all...

They support HFP and A2DP and AVRCP, and properly, including all of those features working on android phones and proper switching between them as needed...

Re: AirPods libreated from Apple's ecosystem

#389

Post by angoragoats »

hluska wrote: post #351
angoragoats wrote: post #262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're responding in a sub-thread where others have specifically called out the fact that you can't get battery status from AirPods on non-Apple platforms. This is, to my knowledge, a feature that is supported natively by the Bluetooth stacks on every mainstream OS and requires no "apps" at all. For example, I can connect my Bluetooth mouse to my Linux machine and it happily reports the state of the battery. Care to…

The Bluetooth spec only supports one battery status. AirPods have three batteries. Is 1 On the subject of the multi-trillion-dollar behemoth, Apple is a private company. If you have the capital, you can acquire a controlling interest and then they’ll work on whatever you like. Until then, you’re out of luck.

> The Bluetooth spec only supports one battery status. AirPods have three batteries. Is 1 No, it's not. The Bluetooth Battery Service spec allows for a single device with multiple batteries and individual battery reporting for each. [0] They even give the example in that doc of earbuds which are one “logical device” but two physically separate pieces, each with its own battery.

> On the subject of the multi-trillion-dollar behemoth, Apple is a private company.

Apple is, by definition, a public company.

> If you have the capital, you can acquire a controlling interest and then they’ll work on whatever you like. Until then, you’re out of luck.

No. Anticompetitive behavior such as tying (what I would argue is happening here) can and should always be subject to examination, criticism, and possible litigation by the public.

[0] https://www.bluetooth.com/wp-content/uploads/Files/Specifica...

Re: AirPods libreated from Apple's ecosystem

#390

Post by angoragoats »

sroussey wrote: post #344
angoragoats wrote: post #262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're responding in a sub-thread where others have specifically called out the fact that you can't get battery status from AirPods on non-Apple platforms. This is, to my knowledge, a feature that is supported natively by the Bluetooth stacks on every mainstream OS and requires no "apps" at all. For example, I can connect my Bluetooth mouse to my Linux machine and it happily reports the state of the battery. Care to…

The multi battery levels thing is native proprietary on every platform since there is no Bluetooth spec for more than one battery level and even that just uses uint8.

As I posted elsewhere in the thread, this is incorrect. The Bluetooth Battery Service spec allows for a single device with multiple batteries and individual battery reporting for each. [0] They even give the example in that doc of earbuds which are one “logical device” but two physically separate pieces, each with its own battery.

As additional evidence, there are "AirPods-like" earbuds on the market such as the Sony WF-C700N, which have no problem reporting three battery levels over standard Bluetooth on e.g. Linux.

[0] https://www.bluetooth.com/wp-content/uploads/Files/Specifica...

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