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OpenAI says over a million people talk to ChatGPT about suicide weekly

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Re: OpenAI says over a million people talk to ChatGPT about suicide weekly

#381

Post by MangoToupe »

7moritz7 wrote: post #207
jacquesm wrote: post #187

HIPAA anybody? (1) they probably shouldn't even have that data (2) they shouldn't have it lying around in a way that it an be attributed to particular individuals (3) imagine that it leaks to the wrong party, it would make the hack of that Finnish institution look like child's play (4) if people try to engage it in such conversations the bot should immediately back out because it isn't qualified to have these convers…

> if people try to engage it in such conversations the bot should immediately back out because it isn't qualified to have these conversations For a lot of people, especially in poorer regions, LLMs are a mental health lifeline. When someone is severely depressed they can lay in bed the whole day without doing anything . There is no impulse, as if you tried starting a car and nothing happens at all, so you can forget…

Sure, but you could also apply this reasoning to a blank sheet of paper. But while it's absurd to hold the manufacturer of the paper accountable for what people write on it, it makes sense to hold OpenAI accountable for their chatbots encouraging suicide.

Re: OpenAI says over a million people talk to ChatGPT about suicide weekly

#382

Post by MangoToupe »

otabdeveloper4 wrote: post #224
jacquesm wrote: post #187

HIPAA anybody? (1) they probably shouldn't even have that data (2) they shouldn't have it lying around in a way that it an be attributed to particular individuals (3) imagine that it leaks to the wrong party, it would make the hack of that Finnish institution look like child's play (4) if people try to engage it in such conversations the bot should immediately back out because it isn't qualified to have these convers…

> (4) if people try to engage it in such conversations the bot should immediately back out because it isn't qualified to have these conversations There is nothing in the world that OpenAI is qualified to talk about, so we might as well just shut it down.

I'm in favor; any objections?

Re: OpenAI says over a million people talk to ChatGPT about suicide weekly

#383

Post by wonderwonder »

kylehotchkiss wrote: post #213
wonderwonder wrote: post #40

Most people would really benefit from going to the gym. I'm not trying to downplay serious mental illness as its absolutely real. For many though just going to the gym several times a week or another form of serious physical exertion can make a world of difference. Since I started taking the gym seriously again I feel like a new man. Any negative thoughts are simply gone. (The testosterone helps as well) This is comi…

Most people would really benefit from socializing with others on a weekly basis. If you don’t have friends, make some. Volunteer. The gym is another type of pressure on people’s lives.

I'm pretty good without friends. I'm sure it could be helpful but I don't see any negatives currently from not having them. Been 20 years and I've gotten used to it. I completely understand that for other people this may not work. I have zero interest in volunteering or similar. I'm good but with that said your advice is good.

Re: OpenAI says over a million people talk to ChatGPT about suicide weekly

#384

Post by wonderwonder »

btilly wrote: post #57
wonderwonder wrote: post #40

Most people would really benefit from going to the gym. I'm not trying to downplay serious mental illness as its absolutely real. For many though just going to the gym several times a week or another form of serious physical exertion can make a world of difference. Since I started taking the gym seriously again I feel like a new man. Any negative thoughts are simply gone. (The testosterone helps as well) This is comi…

Yes. Most would benefit from more exercise. We need to get sufficient sleep. And more sun. Vitamin D deficiency is shockingly common, and contributes to mental health problems. We would also generally benefit from internalizing ideas from DBT, CBT, and so on. People also seriously need to work on distress tolerance. Having problems is part of life, and an inability to accept the discomfort is debilitating. Also, we s…

correct as a society we appear to have embraced coddling. Its not good for anyone

Re: OpenAI says over a million people talk to ChatGPT about suicide weekly

#385

Post by testdelacc1 »

walthamstow wrote: post #255
testdelacc1 wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Reddit is a really good example of this because it used to be a feed of what you selected yourself. But they couldn’t juice the metrics that way, so they started pushing algorithmic suggestions. And boy, do those get me riled up. It works like a charm, because I spend more time on these threads, defending what seems like common sense. But at the end I don’t feel a sense of joy like I used to with the old Reddit. Now…

I'm a driver and a cyclist. I used to frequent both r/londoncycling and r/CarTalkUK. I liked each sub for its discussion of each topic. Best route from Dalston to Paddington, best family car for motorway mileage, that kind of thing. Now, because of the algo-juicing home page, both subs are full of each other's people arguing at each other. Cyclists hating drivers, drivers hating cyclists. It's just so awful.

The general level of hatred and anger that they’re stoking is insane. There used to be a reddit taboo against linking to other subReddits to avoid “brigading”. No issues with that now, because the Reddit app will add that thread to your feed. “/r/londoncycling users also enjoy /r/CarTalkUK!” For some weird definition of enjoy I guess.

Re: OpenAI says over a million people talk to ChatGPT about suicide weekly

#386

Post by danaris »

torben-friis wrote: post #368
danaris wrote: post #345

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then... Maybe the tool should not be available universally. Maybe it should not be available to anyone . If it cannot be used safely by a vulnerable class of people, and identifying that class of person sufficiently to block use by them, and its primary purpose is simply to bring OpenAI more profit, then maybe the world is better off without it being publicly available.

>If it cannot be used safely by a vulnerable class of people, and identifying that class of person sufficiently to block use by them Should we stop selling kitchen knives, packs of cards or beer as well? This is not a new problem in society. >and its primary purpose is simply to bring OpenAI more profit This is true for any product, unless you mean that it has no other purpose, which is trivially contradicted by the…

There's a qualitative difference between knives and publicly-available LLMs.

Knives aren't out there actively telling you "use me, slit those wrists, then it'll all be over".

Re: OpenAI says over a million people talk to ChatGPT about suicide weekly

#387

Post by ndiddy »

ben_w wrote: post #21
mgh2 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you sure ChatGPT is the solution? It just sounds like another "savior complex" sell spin from tech. 1. Social media -> connection 2. AGI -> erotica 3. Suicide -> prevention All these for engagement (i.e. addiction). It seems like the tech industry is the root cause itself trying to masquerade the problem by brainwashing the population. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45026886

I personally take no opinion about whether or not they can actually solve anything, because I am not a psychologist and have absolutely no idea how good or bad ChatGPT is at this sort of thing, but I will say I'd rather the company at least tries to do some good given that Facebook HQ is not very far from their offices and appears to have been actively evil in this specific regard.

> but I will say I'd rather the company at least tries to do some good given that Facebook HQ is not very far from their offices and appears to have been actively evil in this specific regard.

Sure! let's take a look at OpenAI's executive staff to see how equipped they are to take a morally different approach than Meta.

Fidji Simo - CEO of Applications (formerly Head of Facebook at Meta)

Vijaye Raji - CTO of Applications (formerly VP of Entertainment at Meta)

Srinivas Narayanan - CTO of B2B Applications (formerly VP of Engineering at Meta)

Kate Rouch - Chief Marketing Officer (formerly VP of Brand and Product Marketing at Meta)

Irina Kofman - Head of Strategic Initiatives (formerly Senior Director of Product Management for Generative AI at Meta)

Becky Waite - Head of Strategy/Operations (formerly Strategic Response at Meta)

David Sasaki - VP of Analytics and Insights (formerly VP of Data Science for Advertising at Meta)

Ashley Alexander - VP of Health Products (formerly Co-Head of Instagram Product at Meta)

Ryan Beiermeister - Director of Product Policy (formerly Director of Product, Social Impact at Meta)

Re: OpenAI says over a million people talk to ChatGPT about suicide weekly

#389

Post by kakacik »

Auracle wrote: post #159
NathanKP wrote: post #3

> It is estimated that more than one in five U.S. adults live with a mental illness (59.3 million in 2022; 23.1% of the U.S. adult population). https://www.nimh.nih.gov/health/statistics/mental-illness Most people don't understand just how mentally unwell the US population is. Of course there are one million talking to ChatGPT about suicide weekly. This is not a surprising stat at all. It's just a question of what to…

~11% of the US population is on antidepressants. I'm not, but I personally know the biggest detriment to my mental health is just how infrequently I'm in social situations. I see my friends perhaps once every few months. We almost all have kids. I'm perfectly willing and able to set aside more time than that to hang out, but my kids are both very young still and we're aren't drowning in sports/activities yet (hopeful…

Small kids do this to everybody. The only solution - if you have good family nearby, use them as parenting services from time to time, to get me-time, couple-time and social time with friends. Buy them gift or vacation as return. Its incredibly damaging to marriage which literally transforms overnight from this rosy great easy-to-manage relationship into almost daily hardship, stress and nerves. Alternative is a (good) nanny.

People have issues admitting it even when its visible for everybody around, like some sort of admission you are failing as a parent, partner, human being and whatnot. Nope, we are just humans with limited energy and even good kids can siphon it well beyond 100% continuously, that's all.

Now I am not saying be a bad parent, in contrary, to reach you maximum even as a parent and partner, you need to be in good shape mentally, not running on fumes continuously.

Life without kids is really akin to playing game of life on easiest settings. Much less rewarding at the end, but man that freedom and simplicity... you appreciate it way more once you lose it. The way kids can easily make any parent very angry is simply not experienced elsewhere in adult life... I saw this many times on otherwise very chill people and also myself & my wife. You just can't ever get close to such fury and frustration dealing with other adults.

Re: OpenAI says over a million people talk to ChatGPT about suicide weekly

#390

Post by Razengan »

willis936 wrote: post #349
itchyjunk wrote: post #336

It seems like people here have already made up their mind about how bad llms are. So just my anecdote here, it helped me out of some really dark places. Talking to humans (non psychologists) had the opposite effect. Between a non professional and an llm, i'd pick llm for myself. Others should definitely seek help.

It's a matter of trust and incentives. How can you trust a program curated by an entity with no accountability? A therapist has a personal stake in helping patients. An LLM provider does not. Seeking help should not be so taboo as people are resorting to doing it alone at night while no one is looking. That is society loudly saying "if you slip off the golden path even a little your life is over". So many people reso…

On the other hand, if someone really wants to leave, they should be allowed to.

"Seeking help" goes both ways.

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