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PayPal to support Ethereum and Bitcoin

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381–390 of 409 posts

Re: PayPal to support Ethereum and Bitcoin

#381
post #337
post #294

Is this a legitimate alternative domain name for PayPal, or is it a parody or phishing site? It's not paypal.com. Apparently it's legit: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45250319

It’s so dumb because they are training everyone to be phished by scammers.

I once got an email from PayPal where it claimed that I had been double-charged on my PayPal account, and they also misspelled my first name. It was a legit email, but it sure as shit didn't look like it.

Re: PayPal to support Ethereum and Bitcoin

#382
post #367

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You probably need to update your sources. It’s super cheap to send ETH https://www.gasfees.io/

Huh, I was basing this on NFT gas prices since that's the part of blockchain I've always been most curious about, I didn't realize that simple ETH transfers required far less gas than things like minting and selling NFTs.

Minting and selling NFTs in general require more computation, but many smart contracts with NFTs have been gas optimized compared to 2021, sometimes requiring less approvals and transactions.

A lot of activity moved to L2s, making L1 gas cheaper, and so simple ETH and token sends are cheaper. L2s will continue to get cheaper, with the next hard fork around November and L1 gas should be even cheaper with the hard fork after the next.

Re: PayPal to support Ethereum and Bitcoin

#383
post #365

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> cold email marketing earlier this year, and it's all about learning to be a spammer You sound surprised. What's the difference between "cold email marketing" and "spamming"?

Cold email marketing can be highly targeted. Like, reaching out to your 5 potential customers and telling them about your service in terms of their specific context. Spamming is not that.

You're right, although I think I'd just call that sending a few emails. Cold email marketing as a practice includes learning how to avoid spam filters and avoiding being detected, and it's unapologetically spammy.

Re: PayPal to support Ethereum and Bitcoin

#384
post #305

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The foreign individual is likely better off in game theory terms, but their country is collectively likely worse off due to a reduction in their central bank's independence and ability to perform seigniorage/print money. Difficult to ban for the foreign nation, and probably results in a greater need for dollars for their government also.

Probably not. You would be right if we were talking about honest, competent central bankers. But most people live in poor countries. Why are those countries poor? Every country is different, but poor countries are mostly poor because they are governed by kleptocrats, generally including their central bankers, and hyperinflation in particular is a constant menace. When the central bankers aren't directly kleptocratic…

I agree that kleptocracy and incompetence are a important factor, but I'm not sure it's the only one. There's a correlation between corruption indices and low GDP but I'm not sure it's causal. For example the US scores only moderately in corruption index terms, but does quite well in GDP terms. Arguably GDP growth rates are a better measure, in which case there's possibly a inverse correlation.

For example China, India and Malaysia have grown quite substantially are not particularly transparent, but they are alike in their resistance to dollarization. On the other hand Ecuador and El Salvador are examples of countries that have fully embraced dollarization with less than great outcomes. There are examples in the middle as well, but there is not a clear trend that it's necessarily a change for the better of the country and it's citizens.

To me it seems like a continuation of the IMF's dollarization as described by Joseph Stiglitz in 'Globalization and its discontents', in terms of mechanisms and effects on recipient countries. From this perspective it's less like transferring power from kleptocrats to the people, and more like choosing kleptocrats that are offering a better deal.

Re: PayPal to support Ethereum and Bitcoin

#385

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They're not as openly shitty at least. Crypto was supposed to be an alternative to all this but, well, look how that worked out.

Crypto was supposed to be an alternative to all this but, well, look how that worked out. Bitcoin hasn't really changed in over a decade and is trading at all time highs. What "didn't work out" in your mind?

None of my clients can pay me for my work in bitcoin without first turning real money into bitcoin, with fees involved. I can't pay my rent with bitcoin without turning it into real money, with fees involved. I can't go to the market and buy food with bitcoin. I can't see someone begging outside Walgreens and help them out with some bitcoin. Bitcoin's also volatile enough that there's a significant risk of its value dropping on the floor between the time I receive it and try to use it. It's a fine Ponzi scam but it's utterly useless for replacing USD.

Maybe you live somewhere that your landlord takes bitcoin, that's nice for you, my landlord wants USD. If you would like to fund me finding out if my landlord will actually take bitcoin if I ask nicely enough then please feel free to send a couple bitcoins to 3CzUW828J2u5wCB2xD4iE9kH8dPTokjxow.

Re: PayPal to support Ethereum and Bitcoin

#386
post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only when it's the literal only option at checkout. Then it's the merchant's choice, not my problem. When possible, I'll always opt to use a different instantaneous method (e.g. iDeal or direct debit), or give the merchant my money directly and wait 3 days for the IBAN transfer to go through. Using paypal just risks the money being indefinitely frozen on either side and them taking a cut for the privilege, if it work…

If the merchant screws you on a transaction paid via IBAN transfer, how do you get your money back?

Same as if Paypal screws me, or the store I just bought something in... you talk to them and if they don't cooperate you take it to court (small claims hopefully). So far, nobody I know has needed to take a shop to court. It's extremely rare, but yes it sure happens

If I really don't trust the seller, I can always still get some sort of insurance thing, but an X% insurance fee needn't be the default for every transaction. (Even if the % is invisible to you, then the seller updates their product's prices. The seller won't choose to eat less just to finance your transaction fees... the only way to not pay those is operate a deficit, which eventually leads to bankruptcy and loss of your warranty, which isn't a desirable situation either)

Re: PayPal to support Ethereum and Bitcoin

#387
post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And they make it as difficult and hidden as possible. At the same time they advertise to "support sepa now" as if it's something new while by law they have to process such transactions within two hours for over 10 years now.

At ING it's just a button click. It's directly next to the transaction on their app.

ING is Dutch, not German.

Re: PayPal to support Ethereum and Bitcoin

#388

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you think that the rich dipshits that Zelle enables are significantly better? They're just responsible for an older slower form of the same abuse. We desperately need a ethical alternative, buy I think were going to have to build it ourselves.

They're not as openly shitty at least. Crypto was supposed to be an alternative to all this but, well, look how that worked out.

It took AI until it was about 70 to be useful for the things that people initially wanted it for. Crypto is a teenager. We may yet get it there.

Re: PayPal to support Ethereum and Bitcoin

#389
post #305

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Probably not. You would be right if we were talking about honest, competent central bankers. But most people live in poor countries. Why are those countries poor? Every country is different, but poor countries are mostly poor because they are governed by kleptocrats, generally including their central bankers, and hyperinflation in particular is a constant menace. When the central bankers aren't directly kleptocratic…

I agree that kleptocracy and incompetence are a important factor, but I'm not sure it's the only one. There's a correlation between corruption indices and low GDP but I'm not sure it's causal. For example the US scores only moderately in corruption index terms, but does quite well in GDP terms. Arguably GDP growth rates are a better measure, in which case there's possibly a inverse correlation. For example China, Ind…

I don't think corruption indices do a great job of measuring kleptocracy. The PRC's national government, for example, has clearly prioritized enriching the general population through economic development and reducing poverty over lining their own pockets, despite not being transparent or accountable. The indices do provide some information; extremely kleptocratic countries like Venezuela, Eritrea, Yemen, and Nicaragua reliably come out on the bottom of the CPI. But the most damaging effects of kleptocracy are very subtle.

I do agree that dollarization hasn't been resoundingly successful, and that does undermine my thesis somewhat. I agree that cryptocurrencies are like super-dollarization: not only do they remove domestic government control of monetary policy, they remove or weaken domestic government control of and visibility into capital flows, banking services such as savings and lending, and payments. If that would be great, you'd expect dollarization to at least be good. And it isn't clear that it has been. It hasn't been obviously disastrous either—you can make credible arguments that Ecuador or El Salvador would be either better off or worse off without it—but it hasn't been obviously beneficial.

I think "choosing kleptocrats that are offering a better deal" is a good description of dollarization and, for example, Tether, USDC, or CBDCs. But, as a description of Bitcoin and Ethereal, it's comprehensively incorrect; there haven't ever been any credible allegations of corruption in their blockchains, unless you count Ethereal's DAO rollback. They've so far been completely immune to the kind of politically-motivated currency manipulation that is the actual official job of central banks behind fiat currencies like the dollar.

Re: PayPal to support Ethereum and Bitcoin

#390
post #387

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At ING it's just a button click. It's directly next to the transaction on their app.

ING is Dutch, not German.

There's also ING in Germany. They are super famous.

They are not called Ing Diba anymore.

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