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US reportedly forcing TSMC to buy 49% stake in Intel to secure tariff relief

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Re: US reportedly forcing TSMC to buy 49% stake in Intel to secure tariff relief

#381

Post by presentation »

nosignono wrote: post #207
tw04 wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>so the logical conclusion is that American consumers will end up paying the tariffs. That’s been the point all along… they are significantly raising taxes on the bottom 90% of Americans and most are too stupid to even understand it. Gotta pay for those tax cuts for the wealthy somehow.

It has nothing to do with stupidity. Stop painting people as idiots because they exist in one of the most information hostile environments in human history. This isn't some natural state that's unrecoverable. The people you describe have been given a highly addictive media environment tailor made to engender outrage and drive behavior. It shouldn't be a shock when most people cannot resist it. The first step to chang…

I see things as incentive problems, including this.

People are incentivized to be intellectually lazy since there isn’t really any personal reward for making the effort (your vote is on the margins practically meaningless, even if you’re “right,” whatever that means).

But there is great reward for staying ignorant (dopamine hits from outrage media and camaraderie with the large plurality of similarly intellectually lazy people).

How do we make it so that having well reasoned opinions is actually rewarded commensurately?

Re: US reportedly forcing TSMC to buy 49% stake in Intel to secure tariff relief

#382

Post by booleandilemma »

DiddlyWinks wrote: post #256
nosignono wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It has nothing to do with stupidity. Stop painting people as idiots because they exist in one of the most information hostile environments in human history. This isn't some natural state that's unrecoverable. The people you describe have been given a highly addictive media environment tailor made to engender outrage and drive behavior. It shouldn't be a shock when most people cannot resist it. The first step to chang…

At this point they're not "being had." They are deliberately and belligerently ignorant. It's way past time to stop giving anyone a free pass on supporting this malevolent clown.

Democracy's no fun when your guy doesn't win, right?

Re: US reportedly forcing TSMC to buy 49% stake in Intel to secure tariff relief

#383

Post by dylan604 »

modzu wrote: post #360
dylan604 wrote: post #293

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> most information hostile environments in human history Is it though? East Germany comes to mind as well as the rest of the Cold War countries behind the Iron Curtain. China seems to be pretty hostile as well. In the US, it is still much easier to find real information that counters the propaganda than it is in any of those other countries. There's no Great Firewall to bypass. You don't even need to do anything anon…

"Great Firewall"... thats propaganda my friend. American Internet is not open either, its just censored differently

Up until recently with SCOTUS saying age verification is not rights infringing, I would have disagreed. Even with that, what else is blocked by default? It's easy to get hyperbolic in partisan discussions, but seriously, what else is being blocked that counters administration propaganda? Yes, Trump admin is changing data on the websites it controls. That's the right of any sysadmin to control and publish content they want. It would be a real bit of censorship if the admin said no other websites anywhere in its jurisdiction could publish contrary data. You can scream about FB/Twitt...er,X/socialPlatformOfChoice making decisions on its website, but again, I go back to it's their site to manage. You can choose to use it based on those decisions, but again, those are not the only sites offering contrary data.

Re: US reportedly forcing TSMC to buy 49% stake in Intel to secure tariff relief

#384

Post by sethops1 »

Nevermark wrote: post #264
cyphertruck wrote: post #209

This is like an old fashioned Civilization game trade. Taiwan gets a significant ownership in a blue chip US company, TSMC should then take %51 control over intel, and turn it around. The US gets a stronger position with China such that china attacking Taiwan would be like bombing Apple or Google. The USA will go to war over that. Only the willingness to go to war, stops aggressors. War is terrible and economic compe…

> Taiwan gets a significant ownership in a blue chip US company Blue chip, Intel is not: > "[...] known for its stability, consistent earnings, sound financials, and long-standing reputation." [0] [0] https://www.investopedia.com/terms/b/bluechip.asp

15 years ago Intel was a bluechip company. Today it is circling the drain.

Re: US reportedly forcing TSMC to buy 49% stake in Intel to secure tariff relief

#385

Post by dylan604 »

dvt wrote: post #364
dylan604 wrote: post #293

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> most information hostile environments in human history Is it though? East Germany comes to mind as well as the rest of the Cold War countries behind the Iron Curtain. China seems to be pretty hostile as well. In the US, it is still much easier to find real information that counters the propaganda than it is in any of those other countries. There's no Great Firewall to bypass. You don't even need to do anything anon…

[flagged]

I never said or meant to imply by not specifically saying something that the opposing view was unavailable back then. That's just willfully trying to twist the narrative to a purpose I don't know why it is necessary. But since we're here, we can compare/contrast.

RFE/RL could broadcast whatever it wanted. If you received it and heard the contrary views from what official stance was, you can pretty much just accept it. You couldn't just go and search for more information in a browser/app. Seeing video of things just wasn't happening over the air on your wireless. You couldn't jump onto social platform of choice and see images in real time. Information is so freely flowing today it is a joke to compare the two.

>Typical American response confidently knowing literally nothing of what they speak of

Sadly, this reads from someone with a person grudge that has nothing to do with the conversation. If you honestly think there was more information freely available then as compared to know, you've just disillusioned yourself for whatever reason. Yes, there was resistance back during the Cold War. Fax machines FTW. That still just does not compare to how freely flowing information is today. To call today the "most information hostile environments in human history" is just nonsense. How can you even compare it?

Re: US reportedly forcing TSMC to buy 49% stake in Intel to secure tariff relief

#386

Post by MBCook »

Aurornis wrote: post #374
treyd wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We can use older processes if we have to. We'd be taking a step back of... maybe 5-10 years? Computers 10 years ago were not that much slower than they are today. Volume would be a bigger concern than performance. Maybe it'd force the tech industry to start writing more efficient user-facing software instead of depending on the incremental advancements made by chip designers and semi fabs.

> We'd be taking a step back of... maybe 5-10 years? Computers 10 years ago were not that much slower than they are today There’s more to the world of computing than your laptop. Stepping back to 10 year old GPUs and server CPUs would be a massive handicap on the country. > Maybe it'd force the tech industry to start writing more efficient user-facing software instead of depending on the incremental advancements made…

Not to mention there wouldn’t even be enough capacity to make all the chips we need even if we went with slower chips.

Re: US reportedly forcing TSMC to buy 49% stake in Intel to secure tariff relief

#387

Post by MBCook »

hobobaggins wrote: post #300
MBCook wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is “don’t buy stuff with TSMC chips” really a valid option we have? Isn’t that basically “stop buying high technology” to a large degree?

> Is “don’t buy stuff with TSMC chips” really a valid option we have? Not sure that TSMC would want to do that either! We're probably their biggest market, even allowing for China. > Isn’t that basically “stop buying high technology” to a large degree? I think you're right, to an extent, at leastt in the near term. However, we do have (and especially used to have) various fabbing here in the States, from Samsung to I…

I’m not arguing TSMC is in a good place geopolitically. I agree there’s a huge risk there.

I just don’t think “don’t use TSMC“ is a realistic choice at all right now.

That’s like telling someone in rural Montana “just don’t use a car”. If you want to live a normal life it’s not very doable.

Re: US reportedly forcing TSMC to buy 49% stake in Intel to secure tariff relief

#388

Post by cgio »

stephen_g wrote: post #309
dylan604 wrote: post #293

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> most information hostile environments in human history Is it though? East Germany comes to mind as well as the rest of the Cold War countries behind the Iron Curtain. China seems to be pretty hostile as well. In the US, it is still much easier to find real information that counters the propaganda than it is in any of those other countries. There's no Great Firewall to bypass. You don't even need to do anything anon…

I mean, maybe this way is worse. I can see how it could be far more obvious that the propaganda is BS when it's being pushed at you from every outlet and every form of media. Makes it more clear that it's controlled. Yet at the moment where there is still diversity, people can make the mistake of thinking that the propaganda is just a difference of opinion so perhaps trust it more.

To me the propaganda is still blatant and there is only an engineered illusion of diversity, only inasmuch as it keeps people opinionated on the things that don’t matter. There’s also no foundational or universal desire for diversity, so alternative propaganda contexts may induce different focus areas.

Re: US reportedly forcing TSMC to buy 49% stake in Intel to secure tariff relief

#390

Post by jrflowers »

heraldgeezer wrote: post #295
jrflowers wrote: post #290

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I recently lost my COVID kilos, 10-15kg. Was easy. It took you five years to do that though. Why did it take that long if it was easy

I started in like December or January... Was COVID 5 years ago fuck me. Also, COVID weight gain would be during lockdowns, and ALSO my job went fully remote. Being fully remote was an issue for sure. So it's like COVID was extended for me. I never really weighed myself and then felt weird like a big mechelin man and I saw I was 10-12 kg heavier, makes sense why I feel bad I thought, and I did not weigh before and jus…

> Love the downvotes, btw.

I’d wager that you’re getting downvoted for two reasons, first because current science is strongly indicating that “obesity is a moral failing” is factually untrue, so being smug while dead wrong is off putting.

And second reason would be the framing of the issue of obesity as being solved by just losing weight. A lot (maybe most? Almost all?) of people that are overweight have at some point lost weight, the bigger challenge is keeping it off long term.

So you kind of just Kramer’d into this thread and loudly volunteered unprompted that you don’t understand this stuff on a basic level, aren’t in a position to understand it, and you definitely feel like you’ve accomplished something so enormous that it makes you smarter and better than everybody else. It’s kind of like if you show a kid Google Translate and they start lecturing you about how easy it is to move to Mallorca because Catalan isn’t that hard to pick up

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