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Nvidia won, we all lost

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Re: Nvidia won, we all lost

#381

Post by Ologn »

Kon5ole wrote: post #317

TSMC can only make about as many Nvidia chips as OpenAI and the other AI guys wants to buy. Nvidia releases gpus made from basically the shaving leftovers from the OpenAI products, which makes them limited in supply and expensive. So gamers have to pay much more and wait much longer than before, which they resent. Some youtubers make content that profit from the resentment so they play fast and loose with the fundame…

Yes. In 2021, Nvidia was actually making more revenue from its home/consumer/gaming chips than from its data center chips. Now 90% of its revenue is from its data center hardware, and less than 10% of its revenue is from home gpus. The home gpus are an afterthought to them. They take up resources that can be devoted to data center.

Also, in some sense there can be some fear 5090s could cannibalize the data center hardware in some aspects - my desktop has a 3060 and I have trained locally, run LLMs locally etc. It doesn't make business sense at this time for Nvidia to meet consumer demand.

Re: Nvidia won, we all lost

#382

Post by homebrewer »

josephg wrote: post #361
ho_schi wrote: post #324

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is wrong. For 14 years the recommendation on Linux is: * Purchase always AMD. * Purchase never Nvidia. * Intel is also okay. Because the AMD drivers are good and open-source. And AMD cares about bug reports. The one from Nvidia can and will create issues because they’re closed-source and avoided for years to support Wayland. Now Nvidia published source-code and refuses to merge it into Linux and Mesa facepalm Wh…

I've been using a 4090 on my linux workstation for a few years now. Its mostly fine - with the occasional bad driver version randomly messing things up. I'm using linux mint. Mint uses X11, which, while silly, means suspend / resume works fine. NVIDIA's drivers also recently completely changed how they worked. Hopefully that'll result in a lot of these long term issues getting fixed. As I understand it, the change is…

They opened a tiny kernel level sliver of their driver, everything else (including OpenGL stack et al) is and will still be closed.

Sadly, a couple of years ago someone seriously misunderstood the news about "open sourcing" their drivers and spread that misunderstanding widely; many people now think their whole driver stack is open, when in reality it's like 1% of the code — the barest minimum they could get away with (I'm excluding GSP code here).

The real FOSS driver is Nova, and it's driven by the community with zero help from Nvidia, as always.

Re: Nvidia won, we all lost

#383

Post by ionwake »

ionwake wrote: post #10

I don’t want to jump on nvidia but I found it super weird when they clearly remote controlled a Disney bot onto the stage and claimed it was all using real time AI which was clearly impossible due to no latency and weirdly the bot verifying correct stage position in relation to the presenter. It was obviously the Disney bot just being controlled by someone off stage. I found it super alarming because why would they f…

Not sure why my comment got so upvoted, all my comments are my personal opinion based solely on the publicly streamed video, and as I said, I’ll happily correct or retract my impression.

Re: Nvidia won, we all lost

#384

Post by homebrewer »

senko wrote: post #321
rewgs wrote: post #297

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I use Linux and have learned not to touch AMD GPUs (and to a lesser extent CPUs due to chipset quality/support) a long time ago. Even if they are better now, (I feel) Intel integrated (if no special GPU perf needed) or NVidia are less risky choices. Err, what? While you're right about Intel integrated GPUs being a safe choice, AMD has long since been the GPU of choice for Linux -- it just works. Whereas Nvidia on L…

Had major problems with xinerama, suspend/resume, vsync, probably a bunch of other stuff. That said, I've been avoiding AMD in general for so long the ecosystem might have really improved in the meantime, as there was no incentive for me to try and switch. Recently I've been dabbling in AI where AMD GPUs (well, sw ecosystem, really) are lagging behind. Just wasn't worth the hassle. NVidia hw, once I set it up (which…

> I've been avoiding AMD in general

I have no opinion on GPUs (I don't play anything released later than about 2008), but Intel CPUs have had more problems over the last five years than AMD, including disabling the already limited support for AVX-512 after release and simply burning themselves to the ground to get an easy win in initial benchmarks.

I fear your perception of their products is seriously out of date.

Re: Nvidia won, we all lost

#385

Post by alganet »

bigyabai wrote: post #289
alganet wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They were awful compared to newer models, but for the price of nothing , pretty good deal. If no good use is found for high-end GPUs, secondhand models will be like AOL CDs.

Sure, eventually. Then in 2032, you can enjoy the raster performance that slightly-affluent people in 2025 had for years. By your logic people should be snatching up the 900 and 1000-series cards by the truckload if the demand was so huge. But a GTX 980 is like $60 these days, and honestly not very competitive in many departments. Neither it nor the 1000-series have driver support nowadays, so most users will reach f…

There's no zero-cost e-waste like that anymore, it was a once-time thing.

Also, it's not "a logic", it's not a cosumer recomendation. It was a fluke in the industry that to me, represents a symptom.

Re: Nvidia won, we all lost

#386

Post by sunnybeetroot »

ThatPlayer wrote: post #354
bob1029 wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I have also realized that there is a lot out there in the world besides video games My favorite part about being a reformed gaming addict is the fact that my MacBook now covers ~100% of my computer use cases. The desktop is nice for Visual Studio but that's about it. I'm still running a 5700XT in my desktop. I have absolutely zero desire to upgrade.

Put Linux on it, and you can even run software raytracing on it for games like Indiana Jones! It'll do something like ~70 fps medium 1080p IIRC. No mesh shader supports though. I bet more games will start using that soon

I don’t think a reformed gaming addict wants to be tempted with another game :P

Re: Nvidia won, we all lost

#387

Post by alganet »

rightbyte wrote: post #373
alganet wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why not? This is the exact model in which WWII operated. Car and plane supply chains were practically nationalized to support the military industry. If drones, surveillance, satellites become the main war tech, they'll all use silicon, and things will be fully nationalized. We already have all sorts of hints of this. Doesn't need a genius to predict that it could be what happens to these industries. The balance with…

> Why not? Bombs that fly between continents or are launched from submarines for any "big scale" war.

I don't see how this is connected to what you said before.

Re: Nvidia won, we all lost

#388

Post by nozzlegear »

bob1029 wrote: post #89
__turbobrew__ wrote: post #49

> With over 90% of the PC market running on NVIDIA tech, they’re the clear winner of the GPU race. The losers are every single one of us. I have been rocking AMD GPU ever since the drivers were upstreamed into the linux kernel. No regrets. I have also realized that there is a lot out there in the world besides video games, and getting all in a huff about it isn’t worth my time or energy. But consumer gotta consoooooo…

> I have also realized that there is a lot out there in the world besides video games My favorite part about being a reformed gaming addict is the fact that my MacBook now covers ~100% of my computer use cases. The desktop is nice for Visual Studio but that's about it. I'm still running a 5700XT in my desktop. I have absolutely zero desire to upgrade.

The only video game I've played with any consistency is World of Warcraft, which runs natively on my Mac. Combined with Rider for my .NET work, I couldn't be happier with this machine.

Re: Nvidia won, we all lost

#389

Post by alganet »

selfhoster11 wrote: post #217
alganet wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Gaming needs no additional VRAM. From a market perspective, LLMs sell GPUs. Doesn't even matter if they work or not. From the geopolitical tensions perspective, they're the perfect excuse to create infrastructure for a global analogue of the Great Firewall (something that the Chinese are pioneers of, and catching up to the plan). From the software engineering perspective, LLMs are a nuissance, a distraction. They har…

> Gaming needs no additional VRAM. Really? What about textures? Any ML that the new wave of games might use? For instance, while current LLMs powering NPC interactions would be pretty horrible, what about in 2 years time? You could have arbitrary dialogue trees AND dynamically voiced NPCs or PCs. This is categorically impossible without more VRAM. > the perfect excuse to create infrastructure for a global analogue of…

How is any of that related to actual silicon sales strategies?

Do not mistake adjacent topics for the main thing I'm discussing. It only proves my point that right now, all silicon talk is bullshit.

Re: Nvidia won, we all lost

#390

Post by sfn42 »

ErrorNoBrain wrote: post #277
darkoob12 wrote: post #271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not a gamer and don't why AMD GPUs aren't good enough. It's weird since both Xbox and PlayStation are using AMD GPUs. I guess there games that you can only play on PC with Nvidia graphics. That begs the question why someone create a game and ignore large console market.

ive used an amd card for a couple years its been great. flawless in fact.

Same. Bought a 6950xt for like $800ish or something like that a few years ago and it's been perfect. Runs any game I want to play on ultra 1440p with good fps. No issues.

Maybe there's a difference for the people who buy the absolute top end cards but I don't. I look for best value and when I looked into it amd looked better to me. Also got an amd CPU which has aso been great.

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