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More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

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Re: More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

#381

Post by clickety_clack »

lupusreal wrote: post #316
dustbunny wrote: post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the person who came up with this shouldn't be fired, the person who _approved_ it should be reprimanded. There's some intersection point between who "owns" the wallet and who is coming up with ways to generate marketing revenue. Whoever lives at that intersection point is the real shot caller here aren't they? Imo you don't fire people for generating bad ideas, that just creates a culture of not thinking outs…

Why not fire them both? > Imo you don't fire people for generating bad ideas, If an idea is that bad, at the very least they should be transfered into a role that doesn't involve coming up with good ideas, since obviously that is outside of their skill set. And what's the argument for not firing the chain of people who approved it? Their job was to stop bad ideas and they catastrophically failed.

There’s bad ideas like “it wasn’t possible to execute this the way we thought we could”, and bad ideas like “this goes against the core values of what this company is”.

The first is something that might have gone better in better circumstances, so it’s a learning opportunity. The second shows you either don’t understand the company and decided to carry on despite that, or you just don’t care about the company, but either way it reflects poorly enough on an individual that a firing should be on the table.

Re: More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

#382

Post by graemep »

vinceguidry wrote: post #357
roody15 wrote: post #335

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“ we overvalue short-term gains (thus we have serious agent-principal and integrity issues),” Agree and would even make the argument that Chinas rise in some is a response to short term with patience. China is willing to move mountains and allow western corporations 8-10 years of ridiculous low labor costs and promote incredible profits. They then learn the process and the tech and now companies like TP-link, Huawei,…

> China will patiently build the largest Navy and infiltrate the political landscape of Taiwan until they just peacefully transfer back into the fold. I don't think this would work, they can't manipulate a sophisticated Western political system without actual sovereignty over the land. Western soft power is just that good. If China had a playbook that could accomplish that, they would have used that instead for assim…

The west is very naive. A lot of the current state of the world is a result of western politicians believing the "end of history" theories of the 1980s - the idea that any country would naturally become a free market liberal democracy as it grew richer.

China is building soft power. We have Chinese funded teaching in British universities, lecturers moved from teaching a course because they upset Chinese students (who supported the regime), open apologists at places like Jesus College, Cambridge, agents building influence with MPs....

I agree Taiwan is unlikely to easily agree to be taken over by China, but that is because they know what living under Chinese rule will be like, not because of the soft power of the west.

Re: More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

#383

Post by linhns »

karel-3d wrote: post #349

Living in Asia for a while, this stuff is so mild... all these "super-apps" are always so annoying with cross-promotions that are impossible to turn off. It's true that they are usually not yet having root level access.

Asian here, always surprised when these apps keep putting their money into those promotions and getting almost nothing back in results.

Re: More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

#384

Post by BurningFrog »

hopelite wrote: post #255
somenameforme wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple is basically a smartphone company at this point, and smartphone sales are plummeting. And I think they're plummeting for the same reason desktop sales plummeted. We went from a time where a new PC was a bit dated in 3 months and obsolete in 2 years, to modern times where a desktop from a decade ago is good for pretty much everything, even including high end gaming if you started with a high end card. The exact…

I would say it’s simpler than that. Between Wall Street demanding “growth” and the executives’ stock options being tied to meeting those numbers, they always pull out any and all stops to push “growth”. As others have implied, with people like Jobs and others gone, there is also no cultural resistance based on core values that created Apple to push back on shameless debasement. It is also what is happening all over t…

Growth is awesome. We're incredibly fortunate to live in this high growth era!

What Apple may be guilty of here is focusing on short term growth at the expense of the long term. If you make an extra buck today, at the expense of losing user loyalty, that's not what any shareholder wants.

This could be a case of short term growth being rewarded inside the company. It could also be any number of other reasons.

Re: More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

#385

Post by al_borland »

em500 wrote: post #129

Apple Wallet is in the App store, and the F1 ad debacle directly violates App Store guidelines https://developer.apple.com/app-store/review/guidelines/ ) > 4.5.4 Push Notifications must not be required for the app to function, and should not be used to send sensitive personal or confidential information. Push Notifications should not be used for promotions or direct marketing purposes unless customers have explicitly…

A lot of companies violate that policy, and it quickly leads me to uninstall the app when they do.

I didn’t get the F1 ad though (at least not yet).

I have seen Apple abusing notifications in other areas to push their subscription services though, and it a problematic trend. It makes them look cheap and desperate.

Re: More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

#386

Post by croes »

em500 wrote: post #129

Apple Wallet is in the App store, and the F1 ad debacle directly violates App Store guidelines https://developer.apple.com/app-store/review/guidelines/ ) > 4.5.4 Push Notifications must not be required for the app to function, and should not be used to send sensitive personal or confidential information. Push Notifications should not be used for promotions or direct marketing purposes unless customers have explicitly…

They are for third party developers. Apple can and will do whatever they want

Re: More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

#387

Post by madeofpalk »

t8sr wrote: post #248

I have never said and rarely thought this before, but I really hope the person who came up with / approved this idea got fired for it. It’s rare that you see something so unbelievably stupid and destructive of the shared pool of trust, which Apple spent 30 years building, only for one self-interested PM to blow a chunk of it up for no gain. If the person who came up with this reads this site, I hope they see this com…

> destructive of the shared pool of trust

Will there actually be any short, mediumm, or long term consequences for Apple? What real, tangible trust has Apple lost that could lead to meaningful harm to them?

The only thing I can come up with is people who hold Apple to some kind of high-minded ideal, that they constantly run foul of for other reasons already.

Re: More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

#388

Post by croes »

t8sr wrote: post #248

I have never said and rarely thought this before, but I really hope the person who came up with / approved this idea got fired for it. It’s rare that you see something so unbelievably stupid and destructive of the shared pool of trust, which Apple spent 30 years building, only for one self-interested PM to blow a chunk of it up for no gain. If the person who came up with this reads this site, I hope they see this com…

>if everyone acted the way they did.

Everyone with the power like Apple does

Re: More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

#389

Post by croes »

_benton wrote: post #279
komali2 wrote: post #274

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google too. I wish the fact that every company enshittifies in the end would wake us all up to the fact that rampant unregulated capitalism just doesn't work before it's too late to make any changes at all.

Apple wouldn't exist without "rampant unregulated capitalism".

Why not?

I think Apple wouldn‘t exist without cheap labor in authoritarian countries but that‘s a prerequisite for capitalism

Re: More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

#390

Post by dreamcompiler »

drdaeman wrote: post #296
foooorsyth wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve said several times before that notifications should be reportable as spam directly to Google/Apple, just like email spam reporting. Google tried to tackle this with notification channels, but the onus falls on the developer to actually use them honestly. No company trying to draw attention back to their app with advertisement notifications will willingly name a notification channel “advertisements” or “user re-e…

There should be a public API, open to any user-designated program (including self-made, without requiring any special hoops to obtain any fancy entitlements), that can act as a "firewall" for all notifications (except, possibly, for few system-critical ones), allowing it to control and modify those as it seems fit.

Precisely this. There needs to be an API that all apps have to use not only for notifications but also for getting your contacts, your phone's location, etc. that is spoofable by the user. Or better yet, an AI program that runs entirely on the phone and does the spoofing automatically and entirely on behalf of the user.

Let the enshittified apps' ads interact with your AI agent and steal your fake "data" in the background without bothering the user.

Also important: It must be IMPOSSIBLE for any app to detect that its requests are being intercepted by your agent. (If they can tell, they'll refuse to work until you give them direct access.)

This is a real killer app for AI but you'll never get VC funding to build it.

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