Rule #1 in any work, business, or even personal and social life: never put all your eggs in one basket.
For CF first example, only use the cdn part, don’t use the registrar one, there are more registrars out there, don’t use their worker, use something else, and do on. It’s for obvious reasons, when shit happens, you can mitigate the impact quickly and easily compared to using all at once.
Cloudflare took down our website
381–390 of 483 posts
Re: Cloudflare took down our website
#382Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Unfortunately companies can chose who they want to do business with but it shouldn't be like this. If you have a contract with them then they can't arbitrarily choose who they do business with. OP would presumably have a chance at a lawsuit against cloudflare here, the success of which would depend on how well cloudflare argued the ToS violation. A lawsuit might not be worth pursuing here, but this isn't a case of…
You signed the ToS, article 4 gives them the ability to terminate the service.
Courts generally require termination of contract to require a good reason, even when the clause says it can happen at the company's discretion. That doesn't lock them out of a court case, though it certain opens up which reasons cloudflare could argue the termination happened for.
Re: Cloudflare took down our website
#383Earlier quoted context omitted.
4. TERMINATION OF USE; DISCONTINUATION AND MODIFICATION OF THE WEBSITES AND ONLINE SERVICES We may at our sole discretion suspend or terminate your access to the Websites and/or Online Services at any time, with or without notice for any reason or no reason at all. We also reserve the right to modify or discontinue the Websites and/or Online Services at any time (including, without limitation, by limiting or disconti…
Yes, that means OP probably can't sue them. My comment is about customer trust.
OP isn’t a customer (anymore), therefore customer trust isn’t a concept that exists for them anymore.
For everyone else, this clause is pretty much standard for all SaaS services. Take your pick. If you don’t want this level of service with any vendor you have to sign an enterprise contract where termination procedures are agreed upon more intentionally by both parties.
Re: Cloudflare took down our website
#384Earlier quoted context omitted.
4. TERMINATION OF USE; DISCONTINUATION AND MODIFICATION OF THE WEBSITES AND ONLINE SERVICES We may at our sole discretion suspend or terminate your access to the Websites and/or Online Services at any time, with or without notice for any reason or no reason at all. We also reserve the right to modify or discontinue the Websites and/or Online Services at any time (including, without limitation, by limiting or disconti…
This still doesn't contain the word "gambling". Instead, it says that they can terminate your account at any moment, for any reason, no matter what your business type is, which is the opposite of "trust".
Oh well, last I checked “gambling” will match with a .* regex pattern.
Re: Cloudflare took down our website
#385Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yes, that means OP probably can't sue them. My comment is about customer trust.
OP isn’t a customer (anymore), therefore customer trust isn’t a concept that exists for them anymore. For everyone else, this clause is pretty much standard for all SaaS services. Take your pick. If you don’t want this level of service with any vendor you have to sign an enterprise contract where termination procedures are agreed upon more intentionally by both parties.
This comment still misses the point.
Any customer or potential customer who reads about this incident may have their trust in Cloudflare reduced, and rightfully so in my opinion. They have the legal right to terminate the relationship without reason or warning, but exercising that right in this context hurts their reputation.
Re: Cloudflare took down our website
#386Earlier quoted context omitted.
Gaming machines are highly regulated, almost like medical devices. There are seals on the hardware, any modification must be approved, you must certify that the payout is the expected one, ...
I'd say worse than medical. As long as it works and doesn't fail, no one will give a fuck about medical hardware or the condition it's in. Just look at your average GP's ultrasound, it's probably older than the GP themselves is. Gambling however, you constantly have government auditors and the tax office crawling up your literal arse to make sure you don't cheat the gamblers, or worse, the government out of their mon…
Yep, governments can change, and the new one can decide to crank up the regulation too.
Re: Cloudflare took down our website
#387As far as I can tell, the issue with this is: OP runs a casino/gambling site. Gambling is a regulatory mess (I have spent far too long dealing with this as an RNG supplier), and so it's very hard to comply with every jurisdiction, and each one needs you to prove compliance to operate in that jurisdiction.* Gaming companies spend a lot on compliance and tracking, but since the internet is the internet, it's pretty har…
>I have spent far too long dealing with this as an RNG supplier Is there much of a market for that? I thought random.org had it all sewn up.
> Is there much of a market for that?
I don't think it's a huge market, but state-run lotteries around the world need good random number generators for games without physical balls (like Keno for example).
I've talked with people that have created RNGs (rather than buying off-the-shelf solutions) and it sounds like soul-crushing work - mostly due to dealing with the government regulators that need to give final approval before the RNG can actually be put into production.
Re: Cloudflare took down our website
#388Earlier quoted context omitted.
> By default, every OVHcloud product is supported by the Anti-DDoS infrastructure to defend against malicious activity. https://us.ovhcloud.com/security/anti-ddos/
everyone that has used OVH and received an attack is laughing at that.
It's worked extremely well against every single DDoS we've received. I'd rate it as one of the best for the price.
Re: Cloudflare took down our website
#389As far as I can tell, the issue with this is: OP runs a casino/gambling site. Gambling is a regulatory mess (I have spent far too long dealing with this as an RNG supplier), and so it's very hard to comply with every jurisdiction, and each one needs you to prove compliance to operate in that jurisdiction.* Gaming companies spend a lot on compliance and tracking, but since the internet is the internet, it's pretty har…
It almost sounds like you are excusing them. Asking people to switch to the enterprise plan and bring your own IP is reasonable, but not on a timeline of 24h, and trashing their account when they tell you they are talking to a competitor makes me feel like I should flee Cloudflare services with all haste.
Re: Cloudflare took down our website
#3901-The gambling business is shady by design, whether you like it or not. This was probably more risk than benefit for them based on what they were getting from you. 2-Your business is probably very profitable, and $300 a month is very cheap compared to the potential hassles they could face working with such a business. 3-I find it very inappropriate to dox business representatives and show names when you have carefull…
Gambling site or not: Cloudflare took their money for years, failed to communicate any problems, then deleted their data when they didn't accept their "enterprise deal". There's nothing saying that they won't do the same to ANY of their other thousands of customers, many of who reads this forum...
Jup, that’s my takeaway. Even if they were in the “right” to stop serving the customer, the way they went about that is absolutely ridiculous.