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Credit card debt collection

bitsaboutmoney.com

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Re: Credit card debt collection

#381

Post by NoMoreNicksLeft »

Broken_Hippo wrote: post #354
pjc50 wrote: post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How on earth can people be denied jobs for poor credit? You're not a creditor to your employer! Isn't this just the "social credit" system that people worry about in China, except privatised?

I applied for a job at a gas station in the late 90's. The store manager had to get permission to run a credit check that I needed for the job: The dude explained that folks with bad credit were more likely to steal from the company. Which isn't true, of course, and they had other ways to check for theft - but this didn't stop them.

How is it not true? Do you have evidence refuting the premise that people with bad credit are more likely to skim cash from the till?

Re: Credit card debt collection

#382

Post by mrguyorama »

hiatus wrote: post #356
DoubleGlazing wrote: post #315

There was a case a few year back around the time of the 2008 recession where a man in debt used the Fair Debt Collection Practices Act to earn a decent living from their aggressive/dishonest practices. I did try Googling for the story, but I could find it. His process was to let them lie to him - he even encouraged it, all while he was recording the call. After the call ended he'd launch a legal claim for compensatio…

Seems like that might not be possible these days. > On June 25, 2021, the Supreme Court of the United States held that a plaintiff must suffer a concrete injury resulting from a defendant’s statutory violation to have Article III standing to pursue damages from that defendant in federal court. The Court also held that plaintiffs in a class action must prove that every class member has standing for each claim asserted…

And then two years later they take and rule on a case that was completely fabricated.

Awesome. Glad to know it's rules for thee and not for me

Re: Credit card debt collection

#383

Post by philwelch »

dylan604 wrote: post #375
philwelch wrote: post #340

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When you say “don’t give cash to homeless people” obviously you’re talking about beggars and street vagrants, not whatever demographic some NGO has decided to formally define as “homeless” in order to game the statistics.

First, I didn't say "don't give cash to homeless people" because I do have a very different interpretation of being homeless. The view you take sounds like you've been privileged enough to have never been homeless yourself. I promise you will think of homelessness in a very different manner if you ever have the misfortune of being homeless. I specifically modified the comment to call out addicts. I have on multiple o…

> First, I didn't say "don't give cash to homeless people"

Sorry, I meant “you” in the general sense, not you personally.

> The view you take sounds like you've been privileged

Stuff it with the personal comments.

> I have on multiple occasions helped someone out that was facing some very difficult decisions because of not having a place to stay.

I have as well. And in my experience, at least with street people, it’s much better to give them bottled water and food than to give them cash. If it’s a family member or someone you actually know, that’s a completely different situation than what most people (not you, to be clear!) are talking about when they say “don't give cash to homeless people”.

Re: Credit card debt collection

#384

Post by mrguyorama »

rcxdude wrote: post #238
Reason077 wrote: post #177

One thing that's not mentioned in this article is that credit card companies will sometimes make last-ditch "clear your debt at a discount" offers before passing your debt on to a collection agency. This happened to me many years ago. In the wake of the '08 financial crisis, I'd lost my job abruptly and decided to go travelling. I'd accumulated a balance that was fairly substantial for me at the time (on the order of…

This is because debt collection is a terrible deal: debt like this sells for a very steep discount, because debt collectors generally have a low rate of success of collecting. They essentially rely on apathy, ignorance, or compliance from the debtor, and if there's any resistance put up they essentially just write it off as it's no longer worth the effort (especially because debt collectors often don't have any actua…

> if there's any resistance put up they essentially just write it off as it's no longer worth the effort

That's rarely the case. Debt collection agencies will absolutely hound you and your relatives, damn the laws, to try and milk value from you, for quite some time. They will then go to conferences and brag about how they have tricked people into claiming debts, the ways they have harassed people, and other atrocious things.

Re: Credit card debt collection

#385

Post by mrguyorama »

pjc50 wrote: post #220
Broken_Hippo wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the US, it also means things like getting denied for jobs and apartments. Car loans will be more: You might not be able to easily buy a new car. And that's not even getting into some of the other random things. You'll need to pay upfront to replace the washer that went out instead of financing - unless that financing is through one of the rent-to-own places (which still might be cheaper than going to the pay laund…

How on earth can people be denied jobs for poor credit? You're not a creditor to your employer! Isn't this just the "social credit" system that people worry about in China, except privatised?

>Isn't this just the "social credit" system that people worry about in China, except privatised

Indeed it is, but Americans have a weird tendency to love horrible things done to them by private companies.

Re: Credit card debt collection

#386

Post by linuxftw »

wizerdrobe wrote: post #257
cavegirl wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Might as well not pay it, if it follows you anyway

If you want to buy a home you have to pay it, even if you’re past the seven years window. Or at least that’s what USAA did to us. I had a credit card debt of about $700 after a failed startup that, when I called TD, I was unable to pay. It was “written off.” The debt was from 2015 and I was purchasing a home in the spring of 2023 and despite the balance having been written off 8 years ago, USAA demanded it be settled…

It sounds like you had a judgement against you. Judgements don't go away, and are enforceable. You probably could have had the judgement vacated.

Re: Credit card debt collection

#387

Post by vladgur »

As a counterpoint, I live in the US and I use credit cards exclusively. Why?

* Amex with 6% cashback on groceries

* Visa with 5.25% cashback on gas

* Visa that adds 2 years or more to manufacturers warranty.

* Credit cards with promotions that end up paying for my family trips around the country and abroad. E.g airline miles or transferable points that are equivalent to $500-$1500 per promotional period

I see no point in using debit cards except for the rarest event of me getting some cash out of ATM

Re: Credit card debt collection

#388

Post by NoMoreNicksLeft »

Workaccount2 wrote: post #361
giraffe_lady wrote: post #353

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All forms of exploitation are incredibly valuable for those with the power to benefit from them.

...but it's not exploitation. Your head is thinking about bad debt, but bad debt is only a tiny fraction of total debt. It certainly makes for excellent highly memorable emotionally charged stories, which is why we are here, but the fact of that matter is that overwhelming majority of debt is paid off and bears actual fruit. Even debt like student loans, which gets almost universally panned, is still good debt. The R…

[dead]

Re: Credit card debt collection

#389

Post by NoMoreNicksLeft »

specialist wrote: post #252
nologic01 wrote: post #159

It is in this domain, of broken promises and broken people that you can establish what a society is really made of. Graeber's Debt is obligatory reading (alas not easy to read) if you want to dig into the painful history of debt relations between humans. The post provides excellent insights into the odious side of consumer finance. It feels like a follow up with ideas about reform would not be wasted effort: Once thi…

Debt: The First 5000 Years rewired my brain. Debt crisis followed by debt relief is historically normal. Prompting Graeber to wonder if capitalism is inherently unstable. Maybe capitalism somehow requires debt relief (eg jubilees, bankruptcy). Then we should codify it. Instead of continuing to treat them as unanticipated, unfortunate one-offs. Our recurring bubbles and bailouts seem to be keeping with Graeber's thesi…

I am quite rabid as far as libertarians go, but even I acknowledge the necessity of bankruptcy protection.

Without it, lenders can lend to anyone regardless of whether it's likely to be paid back, or even whether or not it's possible for them to pay it back. Then those lenders turn around, and demand that all of society pays for debt enforcement through the court system (or in extreme scenarios, through punishment).

Lenders have a responsibility to only extend credit in narrow circumstances, or they need to lose protection for it. The easiest way to do that is with bankruptcy. Borrowers are still discouraged from using it (it's limited to once every 7 years, and punishes besides), so there's little moral hazard there.

Lenders that are businessmen rather than scammers are more than capable of the diligence necessary to avoid bad loans (and the few that are inevitable are a cost of doing business). Lazy, incompetent, or unethical lenders deserve the losses incurred from those practices.

I don't think any of this is a mark against capitalism.

Re: Credit card debt collection

#390

Post by dylan604 »

philwelch wrote: post #383
dylan604 wrote: post #375

Earlier quoted context omitted.

First, I didn't say "don't give cash to homeless people" because I do have a very different interpretation of being homeless. The view you take sounds like you've been privileged enough to have never been homeless yourself. I promise you will think of homelessness in a very different manner if you ever have the misfortune of being homeless. I specifically modified the comment to call out addicts. I have on multiple o…

> First, I didn't say "don't give cash to homeless people" Sorry, I meant “you” in the general sense, not you personally. > The view you take sounds like you've been privileged Stuff it with the personal comments. > I have on multiple occasions helped someone out that was facing some very difficult decisions because of not having a place to stay. I have as well. And in my experience, at least with street people, it’s…

>> The view you take sounds like you've been privileged

>Stuff it with the personal comments.

s/privileged/(fortunate|lucky)/

Wasn't meant to be an aggressive comment. A poor choice of words.

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