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A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now

mstdn.social

381–390 of 531 posts

Re: A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now

#381

70 years ago a fridge would cost $250-$400 - about a months salary, that's about $4k in todays money. If you pay $4k for a fridge instead of $400 today you can get one with a fair amount of gadgets too.

> 70 years ago a fridge would cost $250-$400

That looks right. Here's the start of the fridge section in the 1950 Sears spring/summer catalog to give an idea of what it was like then [1]. Here's the start of the freezer section [2].

[1] https://christmas.musetechnical.com/ShowCatalogPage/1950-Sea...

[2] https://christmas.musetechnical.com/ShowCatalogPage/1950-Sea...

Re: A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now

#382
post #20

Very true. Many solid comments deriding the current generations of wifi-enabled (and randomly disabled when they shut off the servers) carp, but the seventh comment down nails it: >> "capitalism breeds innovation" haha Indeed, in many areas, 'capitalism' has not produced innovation that benefits anyone using the products, but merely increases the ratio of cash extracted from buyers in return for reduced value provide…

What system do you recommend instead?

Well-regulated capitalism, with strong anti-trust regulations and enforcemet.

The idea of a "free market" is an absolute fallacy.

Every market has some set of rules and regulations. At the definitional level, it is irrelevant whether the regs are written, spoken, or tacitly understood, or whether they are enforced by law or self-imposed limits. Without regulation, no market lasts.

The question is what regulations exist and how they are enforced.

With very little regulation, markets coalesce to monopolies; the strong/wealthy get stronger & wealthier, and buy out or force out the smaller players. Even without explicit collusion among large players, they have the ability to sustain predatory practices to kill upstarts or buy out any promising ones. With collusion, they can enforce predatory low quality and high pricing on entire nations.

Which is what we see here. The barriers to entry are high and the competition is so little that the entire appliance market has been massively enshittified — there is literally only crap available (unless you want to go full professional restaurant or hotel equipment). Even multiple different brands are literally made to the same specs in the same factories. I don't recall the details, but this was the case over a decade ago when we last looked for appliances, when it was bad enough that we found a couple new-old-stock from a previous mfg year of some units we knew were good. And I repair them when they need maintenance b/c it's only worse.

This is only one of many industries, and tech is even worse, where incumbent positions and insane piles of capital effectively kill off any upstarts.

Anti-trust needs to be a LOT stronger, more clear, and rapidly enforced.

Re: A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now

#383

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Fridge is a box of cold stuff. I don't need much more than that. The entire premise of TFA is essentially that you're wrong.

I would rather not require the use of my FIDO key to obtain an ice bream sandwich.

not really to do with keys etc.

boxes with different humidity levels.

shelves: slideout, adjustable height, rotating

humidity control/air circulation

lighting

door panel-only opening (saves energy)

utility of door-back shelf space

It's a lot more than "a box full of cold stuff".

Re: A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now

#384
post #353

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The only thing $7k buys you is a nice brand name and maybe slightly more solid construction than a much cheaper unit.) Typically you also get: more BTUs, better simmer control, easier repairability (due to construction design). I'm not arguing it's worth the money (which is why I got my $15k stove from craigslist for $2k :)

more BTU: BTU on a gas stove is ridiculous — they are so lossy that the flame pattern is a bigger deal. better simmer control: even a lot of expensive gas stoves have fairly bad simmer repairability: I regrettably own a fancy Thermador stove that is hard to repair — extracting the crappy ignition units requires a special tool that has been discontinued. If you want excellent temperature control, get a Breville Contro…

> You do not want 15000 BTU/hr delivered to your pan for any purpose other than boiling water

Wok afficionados may differ with you here. I get by on 10k BTU/hr.

Re: A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now

#385

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not bullshit, my parents had the same fridge from when I was born until I graduated from college.

The claim was not that your parents’ fridge lasted 25 years, it was that appliances in general lasted 25 years. If that was true, manufacturers would have been advertising 25, or least 10, 15, 20 year warranties to win customers. Nobody putting their money where their mouth is is a better signal than anecdotal data.

But the claim you called BS wasn't that they had 25 year warranties, just that they last 25 years.

As rule my Grandparents had stuff that was out of warranty, but having repairs done was cheaper than replacement. By my parents time things got replaced every 5-10 years.

Re: A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now

#386
post #32
post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

See: Samsung fridges. A huge touchscreen and a water pump/ice maker that will fail in <5 years are standard.

But they also do entirely plain units that last well with no 'extras' - their commercial units are also great and easy to repair. But most people want to spend as little as they can so avoid the commercial units.

Agreed on your points. Much like Samsung make domestic TVs and domestic fridges (and microwaves and toasters, and a bunch of other stuff), Samsung also makes their commercial line, which is, visually, almost identical, except that it will lack one or two features (no internet connectivity, no requirement to connect to WiFi so that your water filter works), or have a slightly less efficient motor, or metal blades on a fan that increase the energy consumption by 0.05% per year. And you can only buy those devices through dealers, and they cost about 50% to 150% more in price.

Re: A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now

#387

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why does everyone keep their veggies in the fridge, do you buy them in bulk? Basic veggies like onions, tomatoes, cucumber I eat fast enough to just keep on shelves and in regular rotation, and all more special plants are anyway bought for a certain meal in mind so they're used within a day or two. My fridge does have a veggie section but I use that for beer.

1. Ants, cockroaches, and flies invade one's apartment fairly regularly, and will stay if you leave food for them. 2. Inconvenience of going to a grocery store every day. 3. Unavailability of non-basic ingredients within a short distance of one's home. I can walk to a nearby store to get some carrots or cabbage, but if I want bitter melons, black radishes, or oyster mushrooms, I have to drive to a different neighborh…

Good points, although you don't have to go shopping every day in any case. Tomatoes last a few weeks, onions and garlic a month or two. Carrots and cabbage are rare enough that I only buy them for specific meals.

I live in a city flat where there is no risk of ants or cockroaches, and even fruit flies are only around in the summer months. So I guess I just don't have the same problems as others.

Re: A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now

#388
post #49
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But they also do entirely plain units that last well with no 'extras' - their commercial units are also great and easy to repair. But most people want to spend as little as they can so avoid the commercial units.

This is it - high quality stuff is often still made, but it's expensive and/or has other downsides that you really do need to be aware of. For example, commercial equipment is often bullet-proof and long-lived, but it can be louder than you'd want in a home kitchen. Commercial dish washers have no noise insulation, get hot, but can wash dishes so fast they can crack them from the temperature changes. Commercial ovens…

Commerical dishwashers are better called dish sterilizers. Unlike home dishwashers they are not built to get dishes clean (other than what a minimal rinse does). You have to pre-wash everything if you want it to come clean.

Re: A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now

#389

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I get a little tired of repeating this, but there are some good reasons why fridges (and most appliances) are the way they are now: * Strong regulation on energy use by appliances (modern fridges are much, much more efficient than ones from 70 years ago) * Extreme competition from companies all over the world * Consumers who care more about convenience and cost above all else, and reliability basically not at all The…

> The other problem is really with consumers. Nobody ever wants to admit that they make bad choices, but this is the most important explanation for why a lot of stuff sucks. If people were willing to pay more for a reliable refrigerator, that's what would get made. In empirical fact, their actual priority is cheapness, so that's what they get.

Except that there's basically no way to know which products are going to be more reliable!

You can use price as some kind of signal, but it's only loosely correlated. Manufacturers use a dizzying array of different model numbers that change constantly, so it's impossible to buy a model that's been in the field long enough to have a meaningful track record.

You can probably figure out that some brands are basically always junk, but even the brands that do make higher quality products also sometimes make junk, so good luck...

Re: A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now

#390
post #312

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You mean Xeet from your fridge?

(I read this as "exit from your fridge". I LOL'ed - what happened that you got inside the fridge to begin with??? :))

How else would you survive a direct blast from a nuclear bomb? (I am referencing the absolutely absurd scene from Indiana Jones and the Crystal Skull)
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