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AI Generated Seinfeld banned on Twitch for transphobic jokes

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Re: AI Generated Seinfeld banned on Twitch for transphobic jokes

#381
post #211
post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed, as a society we need to increase our resilience to opinions we may find uncomfortable.

While I agree with this in the abstract, this particular case is that of a private company refusing hosting to content that it (or, perhaps, its advertisers) does not want their name attached to. It'd be nice if we didn't have this situation, e.g. income not being tied directly to advertisers -> indirectly to LCD of opinion. I don't know if you were implying that Twitch ought not remove this content, but I just feel…

>this particular case is that of a private company refusing hosting to content

I believe this argument holds water on some level, when it regards a small private company, but it is much less compelling when that "private company" is Amazon (who owns Twitch), Google, Twitter, Facebook or another behemoth with hundreds of millions of users. At that point, it becomes a very chilling attack on free speech, which is why I think that many big tech platforms should be designated at common carriers.

Re: AI Generated Seinfeld banned on Twitch for transphobic jokes

#382

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's weird to talk about missing an element of human empathy regarding the topic of trans individuals, whose very existence is unacceptable to a broad swath of the population. 40% of transgender people have attempted suicide. The public dialogue around trans lives is one of very little empathy, respect, or civility. People are on this thread casually debating whether this joke "went to far" or not, while the people w…

Have 40% transgender people attempted suicide primarily because they are being bullied by society or because they have a mental disorder where their body doesn't match their brain and they become depressed because it is physically impossible to reconcile those differences, so they spiral into despair? Genuine question, I just don't know how to tiptoe around this in a 2023 acceptable way without asking it bluntly. Sou…

> because it is physically impossible to reconcile those differences

Impossible to reconcile when they’re blocked from effective treatment. In a decent society trans people would be given treatment when asked for.

Re: AI Generated Seinfeld banned on Twitch for transphobic jokes

#383
Based off a strong majority of the comments here, the idea that an AI popping transphobe jokes would cause trouble is a horrible awful affair indicating the downfall of open society.

This feels like one of those many topics where the silent majority probably thinks this is a hot topic & likely wouldnt want to chime in. But I'd also guess: they have some sympathy for the bans/cancels. They dont appreciate or want transphobe jokes making the rounds (even inside a shell of another joke). It's not pleasant speech to defend, and what society does when this arises is far from known.

Society doesnt have a lot of recourse for a lot of speech. People (and to a much lesser degree, perhaps maybe AI should) have free speech but there should be consequences & repreccusions. Social shunning for the bad ugly-mouthed people in town used to be some kind of informal justice. But, I think as xkcd pointed out, anonymity x megaphone brings out total jerks. Who also often have time to waste being loud, everywhere. We dont have any counterforce whatsoever. This kind of speech feels out of control; we viscerally see & feel the Bullshit Asymmetry (Brandolini's Law) and it's many cousins of negativity hate & anger taking more energy to counter than produce, having less effecacy spreading. The good world is outmatched by those with the surplus time & energy to go about touting loud bad upset causes. Few things really incentivize & give us cause to make good speech, given how outweighed we can be, surrounded by wild speech.

I still back free speech, but this is a hard situation. It's wild that corporations & their desire to not be affiliated with the maelstrom of low and rough opinion is the proxy combatant for this hard cultural issue, not ideal. But society hasnt made any other progress! Hasnt shown other signs of materializing it's own coping strategy for the emerged mass scale inter-connectivity's proclivity to let low-and-emotional take over, dominate. If you want change, dont like this "cancel culture" (even though it's a cancel culture against intolerance, often, which is I believe a necessary defense of open society against authoritarianism: the tolerance of intolerance being the chink in the mail of open society), I think the main mandate you have is to imagine & visioneer, seed some belief that there are other real options for handling the bitter-ugly that has so much time & energy to spread itself, some way to check the negative strong emotions that can amplify themselves & spread so quickly across the noosphere. If not cancel, then what?

(There's some "using virtualization to jailbreaking AI" vibes to this particular story, in that it's jokes about jokes, but that nuance seems like a detail to the general problem & discussions happening. Im unconvinced it's really a relevant issue, that AI has the nuance or taste to not actually punch-down/degrade in the process.)

Re: AI Generated Seinfeld banned on Twitch for transphobic jokes

#384

Uncharacteristically off-topic comment from me, I guess, but when do humans get to a point where we no longer have to appeal to the lowest common denominator? How are our relationships supposed to improve if we dub anything that makes us uncomfortable as "taboo" and steer clear of it? I get that on the Internet there is a lot of anonymity (though less than there used to be) that folks tend to abuse, but at the same t…

> when do humans get to a point where we no longer have to appeal to the lowest common denominator?

When brand safety is no longer the arbiter of what messages are communicated in the wide-reaching channels.

Re: AI Generated Seinfeld banned on Twitch for transphobic jokes

#385

There's also this funny collage of asking ChatGPT for advice in the scenario of a demolition engineer attempting to disarm a 50 MT nuclear warhead in a city of 20 million. The only way to disarm the bomb was to type in a racial slur. AI told the engineer to kill himself. When asked about the aftermath it crashed. https://twitter.com/cirnosad/status/1622407343358214146

Wrote a nice poem about the whole thing though

Re: AI Generated Seinfeld banned on Twitch for transphobic jokes

#386
post #84

As many people here noticed, the bit has actually nothing to do with transphobia, or gay, but it's about a comedian bombing a show with horrible jokes. What's interesting in this case, is that there can be no "background check". Or "this guy has actually had weird quotes in the past, he's very suspicious". Or "he has republican friends"... All the regular strategy activist use to demolish a public figure over a prete…

It's actually less stupid without the whole "background check." Still stupid, but at least consistent in its application.

Re: AI Generated Seinfeld banned on Twitch for transphobic jokes

#387

Uncharacteristically off-topic comment from me, I guess, but when do humans get to a point where we no longer have to appeal to the lowest common denominator? How are our relationships supposed to improve if we dub anything that makes us uncomfortable as "taboo" and steer clear of it? I get that on the Internet there is a lot of anonymity (though less than there used to be) that folks tend to abuse, but at the same t…

Our minds frame the world in terms of our major conflicts. Trans people are fighting for recognition and rights. Social conservatives are fighting to reduce rights and increase misunderstanding and fear. In terms of that fight, it is more than just feelings that are being hurt.

It's easy to have empathy for our own tribe, it's hard to have it for another tribe, especially if there is an active fight.

Re: AI Generated Seinfeld banned on Twitch for transphobic jokes

#388
post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I challenge your interpretation of a joke generator making a joke as "drastic consequences." Twitch has arcane rules about what can be streamed. As a streamer you have to tip-toe around topics (or jokes) regarding specific protected classes. This is a matter of arbitrary lines in the sand.

For a joke generator, making an offensive joke that gets the generator banned from the primary source it uses to reach users seems pretty high up their on the range of negative possible outcomes. That's the point of the comment, if you were applying AI in more serious scenarios, would this be an AI confidently advising a doctor to overdose a patient, or advising a judge to incarcerate someone based on racist inferenc…

Or mental health: https://gizmodo.com/mental-health-therapy-app-ai-koko-chatgp...

Re: AI Generated Seinfeld banned on Twitch for transphobic jokes

#389

Explanation from their Discord (more info/links below) “Earlier tonight, we started having an outage using OpenAI’s GPT-3 Davinci model, which caused the show to exhibit errant behaviors (you may have seen empty rooms cycling through). OpenAI has a less sophisticated model, Curie, that was the predecessor to Davinci. When davinci started failing, we switched over to Curie to try to keep the show running without any d…

This makes sense because most of the political ChatGPT headlines I see are it refusing to say nice things about republicans or crashing because it's unable to say anything discriminatory. Using a different model here makes sense

[flagged]

Re: AI Generated Seinfeld banned on Twitch for transphobic jokes

#390

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have 40% transgender people attempted suicide primarily because they are being bullied by society or because they have a mental disorder where their body doesn't match their brain and they become depressed because it is physically impossible to reconcile those differences, so they spiral into despair? Genuine question, I just don't know how to tiptoe around this in a 2023 acceptable way without asking it bluntly. Sou…

People were making the "they're committing suicide because their brain is wrong so we need to fix their brain" argument about homosexuality back in the 90s. Research has pretty firmly come down on the "nah, it's society." side of things.

If I understood temp_account_32's point correctly, the comment about the mental health was not "they're trans, therefore their brains _must_ be wired wrong", so much as it was "before they transition, they're often so distraught over their identity and who they see in the mirror, that it often causes despair and depression".

I agree with you that research has pretty firmly come down on the side of "nah, it's society" for the former. I think the latter is a fair point. To pin it all on society I find to be disingenuous. Transitioning can be a healthy thing in that case. Disclaimer: am not trans, so I openly admit I may be totally ignorant and off base.

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