Apple warns suppliers to follow China rules on 'Taiwan' labeling • Hacker News Board

Re: Apple warns suppliers to follow China rules on 'Taiwan' labeling

#381

Post by cromwellian » Fri, Aug 05, 2022, 8:28 PM UTC

pphysch wrote: post #323

Aunche wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> China is more than willing to manipulate cultural messages with money, so we need some kind of cultural counter to that. No we don't. China may act peeved that foreign companies are virtue signalling, but they'd secretly relish at the opportunity of finding an excuse to boycott or ban these foreign products, so that their wealth stays circulating in their domestic economy. Look at what happened to Nike and H&M afte…

> Look at what happened to Nike and H&M after they voiced concerns about Xinjiang. A global company that wastes resources engaging in hysterically overblown State Department propaganda is a company that compromises the credibility of its leadership to make intelligent strategic decisions. We're out of the unipolar era, and companies that are stuck it in it will get outpaced.

I think Google proved you can live and thrive without the China domestic market.

Re: Apple warns suppliers to follow China rules on 'Taiwan' labeling

#382

Post by cromwellian » Fri, Aug 05, 2022, 8:30 PM UTC

trasz wrote: post #311

chmod600 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's some nuance here. We have free speech in the US. Freedom means choice, so there's still an obligation to act morally. China is more than willing to manipulate cultural messages with money, so we need some kind of cultural counter to that. For instance, see how China manipulated the NBA and Activision Blizzard during the Hong Kong protests.

>China is more than willing to manipulate cultural messages with money Compared to a country where companies literally buy congressman, and freely manipulate public opinion for the highest bidder?

But competing messages are allowed so while the rich manipulate public opinion, they are not unitary and other voices are still heard, wealthy battling wealthy and large social movements too.

These false equivalence’s are really tiring. China’s control of public speech and media is on a wholly different plane.

It’s not even remotely comparable to manipulation in the West.

Re: Apple warns suppliers to follow China rules on 'Taiwan' labeling

#383

Post by drc500free » Fri, Aug 05, 2022, 8:33 PM UTC

josephcsible wrote: post #363

drc500free wrote: post #352

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Someone with alpha-gal can absolutely eat meat. Nothing is stopping them from chewing and swallowing meat. It would be a terrible idea, with drastic consequences. But they absolutely can.

Sure. What I was trying to distinguish was between something that would cause real harm for reasons outside of your control, versus something that goes against some principles you made up for yourself but with no other consequences.

When Gaddafi was overthrown, they sodomized him with a bayonet before shooting him. There are serious consequences to having your populace hate you.

Re: Apple warns suppliers to follow China rules on 'Taiwan' labeling

#384

Post by lucasjans » Fri, Aug 05, 2022, 8:45 PM UTC

leephillips wrote: post #38

What’s wrong with the original title? The re-written title here makes no grammatical sense and misrepresents the story.

Agreed. This new title strikes me as washing away the true meaning of what's happening.

There's no mention of Taiwan, which is is specifically related to.

Who can rewrite titles on hackernews? Can we get an explanation who made the change and why?

Re: Apple warns suppliers to follow China rules on 'Taiwan' labeling

#385

Post by GauntletWizard » Fri, Aug 05, 2022, 8:48 PM UTC

Jugurtha wrote: post #41

BiteCode_dev wrote: post #25

I have a friend working for a company whose biggest clients are in the Emirates. One of said client is the government, and it is asking them to buy some very specific equipment, knowing fully well this equipment is only sold in Israel. However, the Emirates cannot trade with Israel, and refuse to pay for any equipment labelled as coming from this country. Calling one of the officials, they asked for a solution. They…

Yes. Some do it in Marseille, France. Citizens of many countries would be in big trouble if they have a stamp from Israeli customs on their passports. Customs apparently issue a separate document not to put a stamp on the passport as a result. This enabled many tourists who are "not supposed" to go there to nonetheless go there.

I was annoyed by this - I wanted the stamp as a souvenir. The first time I went to Israel I got the "stamp on a sticker" thing, but the second time I just asked and they explained the reasoning, I affirmed my intent, and they stamped it.

That passport is since expired (it only had 3 years on it, at time of stamping), and my new passport book will get me wherever I happen to go. The souvenir sits safely in my safe.

Re: Apple warns suppliers to follow China rules on 'Taiwan' labeling

#386

Post by sys_64738 » Fri, Aug 05, 2022, 8:53 PM UTC

This all is highlighting the dangers to public companies about political positions potentially destabilizing the business. Part of the responsibility of C level execs is to shield the shareholders from such uncertainty. AAPL should not be dependent on any single region for product and the political climate & COVID restrictions are prime examples why businesses now need to dramatically shift their supply chain dependencies to dilute the risk.

Re: Apple warns suppliers to follow China rules on 'Taiwan' labeling

#387

Post by sys_64738 » Fri, Aug 05, 2022, 8:58 PM UTC

Pulcinella wrote: post #5

earthboundkid wrote: post #3

Why is this interesting? Taiwan has to compete in the Olympics as Chinese Taipei or whatever. Yeah, any place that China can influence, it makes Taiwan call itself China.

Taiwan calls itself China. The official name is literally the Republic of China. Both China and Taiwan agree that there is just one China, but disagree about what formal unification would or should look like. Edit: The USA also agrees that there is one China, at least officially, though it’s not like the US doesn’t like to change its mind frequently. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_Communiqué

The Republic of China is or was the official name. The mainlander terrorists overthrew the legitimate government and that government fled to Taiwan. Some revisionism of history now has mainland China the "legitimate" China all due to Tricky Dicky visiting in 1972. The government of mainland China if full of contradictions.

Re: Apple warns suppliers to follow China rules on 'Taiwan' labeling

#388

Post by rjzzleep » Fri, Aug 05, 2022, 9:04 PM UTC

eevilspock wrote: post #374

spookie wrote: post #360

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A link [1] referenced in your supporting evidence suggests it is but a remnant of the Chinese Civil War. But even then, Taiwan's constitution does state that a vote may be held in order to change such territorial claims. This only made it in the 7th revision, in 2004 [2]. I would also like to make it clear that mainland China is the only one that has ever put these claims (except for Mongolia) into practice. [1] http…

2004? That's nearly 20 years ago. Taiwan until around 1990 froze into place representatives from all the mainland provinces in its legislature, thereby effectively nullifying the democratic voice of the people who lived on the island. Taiwan's "外生人", those born on the mainland and who fled to Taiwan at the end of the civil war, took over the government, suppressing the views and interests of the "Taiwanese", the Chin…

I don't think you can compare this to Russia and Ukraine at all. Russia (at least the western part) and Ukraine is Slavic. Ukraine and Russia were one country for 450 years and before the beginning of the 20th century that current nationalist movement did not exist. Ukraine literally means borderlands in old Slavic language.

If anything, it was the Slavs in that region that expanded eastward and resettled conquered territories e.g. Tatars(Crimea) to the eastern parts.

Taiwan was inhabited by Austronesians, some of which were butchered by the dutch when they first drove them out, then by Portuguese, later by the Japanese (for a while a lot of Taiwanese considered themselves Japanese, while others on that Island fought of the invaders in the east) and sometime in between all that Hakka and other Han Chinese settled the island.

After loosing the civil war as you know Chiang Kai-shek settled there while running a brutal dictatorship where the first thing he did was take all the local currency and reissue his own. I think the biggest giveaway on how problematic Taiwans history with China is, is that some of the biggest treasures that Mao tried to destroy are in the national history museum in Taipei.

I agree with you that Taiwan never accepted changing it's own constitution(i.e. passports are still issued as RoC, not as Taiwan), but you absolutely cannot compare Ukraine to Taiwan. Neither in geography nor in history.

Re: Apple warns suppliers to follow China rules on 'Taiwan' labeling

#389

Post by eevilspock » Fri, Aug 05, 2022, 9:24 PM UTC

rjzzleep wrote: post #388

eevilspock wrote: post #374

Earlier quoted context omitted.

2004? That's nearly 20 years ago. Taiwan until around 1990 froze into place representatives from all the mainland provinces in its legislature, thereby effectively nullifying the democratic voice of the people who lived on the island. Taiwan's "外生人", those born on the mainland and who fled to Taiwan at the end of the civil war, took over the government, suppressing the views and interests of the "Taiwanese", the Chin…

I don't think you can compare this to Russia and Ukraine at all. Russia (at least the western part) and Ukraine is Slavic. Ukraine and Russia were one country for 450 years and before the beginning of the 20th century that current nationalist movement did not exist. Ukraine literally means borderlands in old Slavic language. If anything, it was the Slavs in that region that expanded eastward and resettled conquered t…

My point is about the hypocrisy all around, not about making perfect comparisons between all these situations.

Re: Apple warns suppliers to follow China rules on 'Taiwan' labeling

#390

Post by SpicyLemonZest » Fri, Aug 05, 2022, 9:36 PM UTC

CogitoCogito wrote: post #359

SpicyLemonZest wrote: post #312

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It just doesn't seem useful to adopt a concept of "neutrality" so strong that no international organization meets it.

Once again you're over-complicated this. The organization could have invited Taiwan to participate and asked them what they'd like to be called. That would certainly satisfy those questioning the organization's neutrality.

It would satisfy them because they think Taiwan is an independent country, and not satisfy China because they don't agree.

Of course, you and I know that China is wrong and Taiwan really is an independent country! But that doesn't mean it's neutral to say so.