Men Are Waiting to Share Some Feelings (2018) • Hacker News Board

Re: Men Are Waiting to Share Some Feelings (2018)

#381

Post by nradov » Sun, Sep 29, 2019, 1:13 AM UTC

paganel wrote: post #364

nradov wrote: post #361

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did the majority of 12th century French women consider those poets attractive?

Probably, otherwise why would have they wrote the way that they did? And earlier than that we have Achilles, the male character that is synonymous with courage and presented by Homer as “the greatest of all Greek warriors”, but even so he wasn’t afraid to cry when his close friend Patroclus was killed in battle.

That doesn't show any causality. People write poetry for all sorts of reasons.

Re: Men Are Waiting to Share Some Feelings (2018)

#382

Post by monksy » Sun, Sep 29, 2019, 1:49 AM UTC

trhway wrote: post #190

erikpukinskis wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What’s an example of a male-excluding space you’ve seen that couldn’t have a female-excluding counterpart?

Just google something like "women business network".

Also the "WIN" network.

Re: Men Are Waiting to Share Some Feelings (2018)

#383

Post by tachyonbeam » Sun, Sep 29, 2019, 2:08 AM UTC

poslathian wrote: post #311

tachyonbeam wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The evolutionary psychology idea is that women are attracted to men who show leader-like traits. That means appearing to have high self confidence, not expressing doubt but seeming certain, seeming generally happy and energetic. In terms of leadership, who do people follow? The guy who's got good ideas but is not quite sure of himself, or the guy who tells you it's going to be insanely great?

Speaking of leading to the “insanely great” promised land, apple’s cofounder was an infamous crier...not sure how that fits into the worldview here.

If you mean Steve Wozniak, he's a great engineer, but he's not charismatic like Steve Jobs, and that's part of why he kind of faded into the background. Most people know who Steve Jobs is, but not Steve Wozniak.

Re: Men Are Waiting to Share Some Feelings (2018)

#384

Post by daxorid » Sun, Sep 29, 2019, 3:17 AM UTC

xythrowaway wrote: post #43

How are we, men, supposed to take these articles seriously when we have so many examples of how bad it is to share our feelings? Look at the character assassination of Stallman last week. He shared his feelings with some women, and look at what happened to him. If he had not communicated his desire to date some of these women, and not communicated his feelings about the confusing ethics (in his mind) surrounding sexu…

I'm sure every single man posting on this website has an example of a time when they shared how they were feeling, or were vulnerable, to some women, and had it blow up in their face. I have.

Yes, but you're not allowed to talk about it, lest you be branded some sort of MRA or incel terrorist. Best bet is to keep your head down and ignore reality. "Lived experience" is only a valid data point for them, not us. For us, citation is needed. And sociology departments won't bother investigating.

Put another way: The well-known and obvious phenomenon of women losing respect for a man who shows weakness is Broscience - true, accurate, correct, corroborated thoroughly through tens of thousands of stories and lived experience, but because there's no PubMed listing, your arguments are useless.

Re: Men Are Waiting to Share Some Feelings (2018)

#385

Post by bigred100 » Sun, Sep 29, 2019, 4:25 AM UTC

ericmcer wrote: post #130

bmarquez wrote: post #3

I participated in men's work, not specifically the ManKind Project but a closely related organization. I personally found it helpful doing weekly check-ins and having people holding me accountable to my goals. Unfortunately, the stigma regarding men sharing feelings is prevalent in western society, and it's not only the men causing it. When I told several female friends about the work they did, their response was: "A…

Our society will always value men who are confident, this is so much deeper to me than being scared to share your feelings because “it’s gay”. Women are attracted to confidence, employers reward confidence, hiring managers are impressed by confidence. Vulnerability and weakness are just not rewarded for men or women, but especially for men.

I don’t really believe this. I know some people who I value less specifically because they are overly confident relative to their abilities. I expect them to play social bluffs to play up what they know how to do (or pretend to know things they don’t), manipulate people if they can awe them and try to intercept credit for their work without giving much of their own effort, etc. They basically just cause a huge amount of trouble and damage the productivity of those around them. Meanwhile I know people of roughly comparable ability who I have a pretty good opinion of.

If someone keeps confidently asserting that 1+1=3 and then tries to act like he’s my superior, my conclusion is generally that he’s just a moron or is deluding himself.

I had a typo above and wrote 1+1=2 but I’ve had the same situation: someone who is of normal competence keeps repeating things pretty much everyone in the room knows over and over and thinks he’s leading you forward.

Re: Men Are Waiting to Share Some Feelings (2018)

#386

Post by masonic » Sun, Sep 29, 2019, 5:53 AM UTC

marble-drink wrote: post #371

marble-drink wrote: post #282

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed. For me, being stoic is the only way. Crying about problems does nothing so why do anything at all? We all have the power to choose to be the best person we can be given our circumstances. That is what I try to do every day. For me, men who need to share their feelings are weak. This is what women do. But we can't all be women. Men need to learn to enjoy their advantages: superior strength, speed, and resilien…

Predictably downvoted. Apparently I'm not allowed to express how I feel.

You managed to insult many of both genders in a two-sentence span.

Re: Men Are Waiting to Share Some Feelings (2018)

#387

Post by marble-drink » Sun, Sep 29, 2019, 8:11 AM UTC

masonic wrote: post #386

marble-drink wrote: post #371

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Predictably downvoted. Apparently I'm not allowed to express how I feel.

You managed to insult many of both genders in a two-sentence span.

That's their fault, not mine. Read the drivel from celebrities on your carefully filtered twitter feed if you don't ever want to be offended.

Re: Men Are Waiting to Share Some Feelings (2018)

#388

Post by bigred100 » Sun, Sep 29, 2019, 1:33 PM UTC

throwaway87378 wrote: post #146

munificent wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it's not only the men causing it. One thing I find fascinating about humans is that we are so compulsively cultural that we will actively propagate cultural practices that are harmful even to ourselves. When you are young, you absorb whatever culture is around you completely uncritically, and then you immediately turn around and start broadcasting to the next generation. Cultural changes and evolves, of course, but…

> Cultural changes and evolves, of course, but it's really hard to uproot a norm or more once it's settled in, even if it's one that causes you personal pain. Terence McKenna lectured on this at length. Here are some apropos quotations: "As a global civilization, we can no longer afford the luxury of an unconscious mind. When you can pull down the fusion processes that light the stars on the cities of your enemies, w…

Sorry for the offensive phrasing, but was this guy known for things beyond telling people to do DMT?

Re: Men Are Waiting to Share Some Feelings (2018)

#389

Post by airbreather » Sun, Sep 29, 2019, 2:42 PM UTC

bigred100 wrote: post #388

throwaway87378 wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Cultural changes and evolves, of course, but it's really hard to uproot a norm or more once it's settled in, even if it's one that causes you personal pain. Terence McKenna lectured on this at length. Here are some apropos quotations: "As a global civilization, we can no longer afford the luxury of an unconscious mind. When you can pull down the fusion processes that light the stars on the cities of your enemies, w…

Sorry for the offensive phrasing, but was this guy known for things beyond telling people to do DMT?

You missed magic mushrooms

Re: Men Are Waiting to Share Some Feelings (2018)

#390

Post by airbreather » Sun, Sep 29, 2019, 2:45 PM UTC

savingsPossible wrote: post #359

fragmede wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've found that depends on which generation you're interacting with. Millenials seem far more able to say "I love you" to people that they love outside of their immediate biological family. It's not just the women, either. Men are able to express their feelings to other men in a non-romantic way. Absent is the toxic homophobia that has so colored previous generations. Hell, their recognition of non-binary genders, pr…

Before people had a firm idea of homosexuality, men did show affection for other men as well. It went like this: it is ok to hold hands with a man (because no one will think you are gay/because no one thinks anyone is gay) -> it is not ok to hold hands (because people will think you are gay) -> it is ok to hold hands (because it would not be a problem if you were gay) and the last step is still ongoing...

It is still common for men to hold hands with good friends in parts of Indonesia and other parts of SE Asia