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President Obama calls on every American to learn code

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Re: President Obama calls on every American to learn code

#371

Post by brandonbloom »

pearjuice wrote: post #267
brandonbloom wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What the fuck is this shit? They really pumped billions in marketing!? I work for Code.org. "Billions" couldn't be any further from the truth. We operate on a shoestring. Everybody in these videos participated because they care about education, not because we paid them.

Yes, you work for Code.org but I doubt if the president is involved you get the fine numbers.

Doubt whatever you want. I'm telling you a fact: Nobody bribed anybody in either political party to participate in our campaign in any way. Code.org runs with a tiny team and an astonishingly small budget. It's the easiest lobbying job anybody has ever had to do ever.

"Hey, computers are the future."

"Yeah, you're right. And my constitutes know that too!"

"Great, do you want to be in a video that will give you exposure for supporting our great cause?"

"Sure!"

Re: President Obama calls on every American to learn code

#372

Post by kamaal »

oxplot wrote: post #364
kamaal wrote: post #360

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>I think the value of learning to code is learning how to break down complex problems into simpler steps How is that any different than any other branch of engineering? Repairing a car engine requires thinking and application of effort that is the very same as that required in programming/debugging. Same with building a house. Or fixing tube lights.

For exactly his last point: it costs nothing to code. You only need time (which you would need to do any other activity). If you make mistakes, you can start over with press of a button. You can do it anywhere, any time and increasingly using any device. Summary: accessibility.

>>it costs nothing to code.

For whom? For us, yes it costs nothing.

For other people, they still have to buy a computer. Get an internet connection. And I will be very frank with you, programming is not the same as building web pages. Learning stuff like embedded systems(Which actually teaches true programming, which is of some real value in the real world compared to cat picture sharing sites) costs money in IDE's, hardware investment and other components.

Learning programming costs money, and some one has to teach the kids. Its not like those kids can download a Python tutorial and get going. Or even adults for that matter. Why should any one do that. We don't learn mechanical engineering, why do we expect others to show such deep interests in our areas of work.

Without good problems to solve and the right approach to teaching taken. Programming is as boring as Math.

Which brings me to the point. If you are teaching Math well, you have already taught kids problem solving. If you haven't, how is teaching another Math like subject in the wrong way going to be of any help.

Re: President Obama calls on every American to learn code

#373

Post by kamaal »

meeks wrote: post #370
kamaal wrote: post #362

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>But a basic 'literacy' in programming would have at least let her know there was a better way... That has very little to do with programming and much to do with skills like analysis, reasoning, problem identification and thinking in the direction of automation(Reduction of human effort). Let me as you a simple question. If learning programming teaches you to naturally thing about automation. Why haven't programmers…

Programmers have been automating "programming itself" through the creation of higher level languages (ASM->OOP) and through things like libraries. Programmers are always thinking about how to automate the automating. The entire notion of abstraction could be thought of as automation. Literacy in programming does help people recognize ways of reducing human effort. I believe it fundamentally changes the way you think…

>>Literacy in programming does help people recognize ways of reducing human effort.

Literacy in any equivalent domain, which uses significant level of Math helps you recognize ways of reducing human effort.

Programming is one such domain.

>>I believe it fundamentally changes the way you think especially in areas of analysis, reasoning and problem identification.

We already have a subject to take care of that. Its called 'Math'. If you are not teaching Math properly, merely replacing with an abstract domain of Math and teaching it equally badly won't cause any reasonable impact.

What's more learning nearly anything well, encourages analytical skills, reasoning and problem identification. Law, medicine, accounting, teaching, farming, nursing, personal finance etc etc the list is endless.

Re: President Obama calls on every American to learn code

#374

Post by downer90 »

MaggieL wrote: post #17
bluthru wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Working with the congress that has the lowest approval rating in history, and the congress that has passed the least amount of bills will do that to you.

Rating Congress by "number of bills passed" is as smart as rating coders based on number of lines of code written.

Best comment ever.

The exact same words had formed in my mind, and then there they were, already written out for me.

Re: President Obama calls on every American to learn code

#377

Post by jmspring »

How about rather than asking everyone learn to code, we encourage everyone (skilled or not) to maybe pick up a trade or other skill with marketable options.

Not everyone has the skill set to code, just like some don't have the dexterity to metal work. Maybe we should be encouraging continual education and learning something new.

There is way more to civilization than "coding".

Re: President Obama calls on every American to learn code

#378

Post by gaius »

bpyne wrote: post #119
badman_ting wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you agree that teaching people to code will result in more professional software developers, which seems reasonable to me, we'll have more of them and the cost of any one of them will be reduced. And again, the skill thing is diminished because we all suck at figuring out who the talented developers are. I'm not saying we should hoard the coding knowledge or whatever -- that cat is already out of the bag. But if t…

I doubt President Obama came up with the campaign on his own and I very much doubt "pushing down labor costs for software development" is even on the list of reasons. Labor costs may ultimately come down, but it won't be due to some devious collusion between the IT industry and him. It's more likely that this campaign to encourage programming is aimed at multiple problems from a better understanding of the tools nece…

Most likely his motivation is the ACA website debacle. What he fails to grasp tho' is that it's not a technical problem.

Re: President Obama calls on every American to learn code

#379

Post by elheffe80 »

chii wrote: post #352
trhaynes wrote: post #334

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On Mac: select files, copy, switch to text area, paste. Actually, I'd be surprised if this didn't work on Windows, too...

For this particular example, the creators of the OS has thought of the function, and implemented it. But what about a slightly different one? E.g. I have two folders, each a bunch of files. Are there any files that are not in both folders?

diff -r dir1/ dir2/

edit: I did not know this- I just posted it because it is but one answer. For what it is worth, I agree with you- basic knowledge of programming is something everyone should know.

Re: President Obama calls on every American to learn code

#380

Post by charlesju »

grellas wrote: post #217

Speaking as a non-coder, but as one who did minimal things with programming-like higher-level stuff ranging from the old DOS batch files to VBA and some dabbling with SQL, I am curious whether real engineers believe the idea of broad literacy in coding truly would be valuable and, if so, how exactly. I am not speaking as a skeptic, just as one who does not readily see the point and wants to know. Of course, we are in…

Programming is absolutely useful on all levels of your understanding.

1. More programmers

There is going to be subset of people that will discover a new passion for programming through introductory courses. There are a lot of very smart people that never would have thought they could be programmers without the proper serendipitous encounters with the subject.

2. Cursory knowledge is useful for your career

Even if you decide not to pursue programming as a career, understanding the basics of how computer programs work can help you in many ways in many walks of life. A lot of careers use computer programs on a daily basis, by building some of your own programs perhaps this will help you become more proficient at using other people's programs.

Additionally, a lot of careers in the future are going to involve pseudo-programming skills such as Excel. Knowing how to program has helped me grasp concepts like pivot tables, excel functions (SUM, AVG, IF, etc.) more easily.

Finally, understanding what computer programs are will help you understand high level strategies for what your company can or cannot do to accomplish goals with computers. Knowing what to build is just as important as knowing how to build.

3. Cursory knowledge is useful for life

Programming is a great way to think about problem solving at large. It teaches a lot of generic techniques that can be applied to all problems in life. Breaking up problems into smaller pieces makes it easier to digest. Applying a couple conditional statements can quickly showcase the logical outcomes of a situation.

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