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I Am An Object Of Internet Ridicule, Ask Me Anything

theawl.com

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Re: I Am An Object Of Internet Ridicule, Ask Me Anything

#371

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ageism is dumb, and I rally against it now as an adult as much as I did when I was 15. > "but I seriously haven't really heard someone over the age of 30 or so make snarky remarks about how so-and-so is such a hipster douchebag" Maybe that's because you surround yourself with people who have similar outlooks? That doesn't mean that all people over 30 are above high school bullshit. And it certainly doesn't mean that…

When I was under 30 or so I was ageist - I felt that most under 28 or so had a long way to go before they become human beings. Obviously, I was the exception to that rule, but even at that age I knew that my contemporaries lacked in maturity. Except... then I reached my 30s. And realized that I was not, in fact, an exception to that rule. I was perhaps worse, because I was aware of it and somehow thought I was above…

Nietzsche says something similiar:

From http://www.gutenberg.org/files/4363/4363-h/4363-h.htm

Quoting at length because it's hard to extract the pith:

In our youthful years we still venerate and despise without the art of NUANCE, which is the best gain of life, and we have rightly to do hard penance for having fallen upon men and things with Yea and Nay.

Everything is so arranged that the worst of all tastes, THE TASTE FOR THE UNCONDITIONAL, is cruelly befooled and abused, until a man learns to introduce a little art into his sentiments, and prefers to try conclusions with the artificial, as do the real artists of life.

The angry and reverent spirit peculiar to youth appears to allow itself no peace, until it has suitably falsified men and things, to be able to vent its passion upon them: youth in itself even, is something falsifying and deceptive. Later on, when the young soul, tortured by continual disillusions, finally turns suspiciously against itself—still ardent and savage even in its suspicion and remorse of conscience: how it upbraids itself, how impatiently it tears itself, how it revenges itself for its long self-blinding, as though it had been a voluntary blindness!

In this transition one punishes oneself by distrust of one's sentiments; one tortures one's enthusiasm with doubt, one feels even the good conscience to be a danger, as if it were the self-concealment and lassitude of a more refined uprightness; and above all, one espouses upon principle the cause AGAINST "youth."—A decade later, and one comprehends that all this was also still—youth!

Re: I Am An Object Of Internet Ridicule, Ask Me Anything

#372

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem with any collection of people though, is popular opinion is rewarded, unpopular opinion is shot down. That means people tend to go with the crowd - hivemind.

"That means people tend to go with the crowd - hivemind." Or you know, standard social dynamics that have existed since our ancestors first figured out how to vocalize opinions . The very silly label you are giving it serves no purpose other than to vilify it for the sake of making yourself out to be superior. Lots of people disagree with you, meaning you do not get to enjoy having lots of people agree with you, mean…

Yes it's nothing new, but the internet has vastly accelerated the phenomenon. If you post some idiotic comment, and 1,000 people agree with you, that's quite a powerful feedback loop.

Re: I Am An Object Of Internet Ridicule, Ask Me Anything

#373
post #177
post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He expected to be criticized for what he saw was the performace: writing stories. He did NOT expect to have his "Hey I'll type anything for you" sign completely hidden, and therefore the pictures about him to be taken completely out of context. In real life, you can see something like that, and then walk around until you see the sign and have better context, and be less dismissive or confused. When all you have is a…

Oh I see, you're saying that he was an artist who's art was MISUNDERSTOOD! Well, that changes everything: In other cases, people understand 100% what artists are trying to do. No performance artist in their right mind can be expected to take into account that others might misunderstand his/her performance.

No, his art is not being misunderstood in the least. That would have required an iota of effort on the part of the mindless haters.

No, they (and apparently you) think that forming harsh judgment about the person based on a few superficial details, without any regard for the attempt at art whatsoever, is somehow okay. That the person is attempting art is just being used as an excuse for indefensible behavior.

Re: I Am An Object Of Internet Ridicule, Ask Me Anything

#374

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The article mentions Reddit being the place where C.D. Hermelin was textually abused for being a hipster; or more accurately, accused of being a hipster solely because he was using a typewriter. Reddit is the only place where the internet nerds in discussion come from. Reddit however is not made up of internet nerds. Reddit is made up of average joes who know enough about computers to register at facebook and reddit.…

Reddit was primarily made up of hipsters who all migrated there to circle jerk from /r9k on 4chan Hipsterdom doesn't even exist anymore, VICE/dov charney declared it dead in 2007. This guy brings a typewriter to the park to get attention and it worked.

Oops I didn't read the entire article. /ignore

Re: I Am An Object Of Internet Ridicule, Ask Me Anything

#375
post #223

Hipster-hate strikes me as just another thinly veiled form of bullying, and it's interesting to see how readily internet nerds - the people who are disproportionately to have been bullied in the past - engage in it. Look! He's different! Let's make assumptions about his motivations and get him! It's also interesting to see how many times Reddit (and other communities) fly into a rage-fest because of lack of context,…

Hipsterism itself is thinly-veiled bullying - it's essentially "I'm cool and you're not". It's like before Apple became really popular, some users exhibited a 'smug field', where they considered themselves better people for using this elite product, being part of those 'in the know', and were just better than you. I have an aunt who was like that, who would mock me for not using Apple... yet she couldn't articulate w…

> Pre-internet communities were far from unicorns and rainbows. Conformity was much more strongly required.

Yes, but if someone took an embarrassing photo of you, you could move to another city and be done with it. There's no escape from internet ridicule. I honestly don't know if I'll be able to handle the world of Google Glass & co where no public faux pas will be forgotten - at least the OP was out there in the public by his own choice. :/

Re: I Am An Object Of Internet Ridicule, Ask Me Anything

#377
post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"it's interesting to see how readily internet nerds - the people who are disproportionately to have been bullied in the past - engage in it." My theory has been that the downtrodden are pissed because they're on the receiving end, not because it's wrong, evidenced by many examples of them engaging in the same behavior when the opportunity presents itself. Whether it's immigrant minorities or geeks/nerds, the pattern…

It's simpler (and more universal) than that: tribal identity is based on ascribing virtues to the tribe -- and vices to others -- based not on objective reality but based on their own values. "We do the things that we perceive as good for reasons we perceive as good. They do the things that we perceive as bad for reasons that we perceive as bad." And the teasing/bullying of members of other tribes is just a core huma…

But then the next question is, why does the geek tribe pick on the hipster tribe as nastily as it does? I don't see the same amount of _personal_ hatred against bankers, or people who do sports to the extreme. Weren't hipsters the least likely to pick on geeks (me)? Is that why they're now at the bottom of the pecking order? I don't see how a difference in values alone explains it.

Re: I Am An Object Of Internet Ridicule, Ask Me Anything

#378

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This article is about someone who suck his neck waaaay out, and got his head bashed in for it. Don't do that. No. No no no no no no no. You're saying what happened to him was justified, or that it should be expected. This is wrong. Nobody should have to change their life to avoid being abused. Instead, we as human beings should stop the abuse. Here are some examples of your position put in other situations: Don't d…

Yes. Yes yes yes yes yes . Instead, we as human beings should stop the abuse. you can't be serious. Tell me, how do you intend to elevate the bottom 0.1% of humanity? If you pretend like it doesn't exist, you will get burned. If you didn't know and you got burned, then you have my sympathies, but there is nothing that can be done.

What you are advocating is the continued abuse of victims because they should have known better. Your defense of this is that you can't do anything to prevent bullies or abusers. Here's why that's wrong.

1. 'there is nothing that can be done'

There's lots of things that can be done; they're just not things you care about, or things you want to help with. That doesn't mean things can't be done.

We can educate people on why bullies exist, how to identify them, and how to stop them. We can show in the real world the effect of bullying, and the effect of stopping it. They do this now in small programs for some schools, but it needs to be expanded.

We can also lead by example. As adults (well, some of us are adults anyway) we can show bullies and victimizers that what they do is not acceptable, and we can hold them accountable for their words and actions. Not only can we address them specifically, and treat each other with respect, 45 states have laws on cyber bullying. If common human decency doesn't work, we can report them to law enforcement.

2. 'the bottom 0.1% of humanity'

Bullying exists in all walks of life in different ways. And i'm not talking elevating, i'm talking educating, and protecting other people. There is nothing wrong with trying to protect vulnerable people.

Why would you advocate that people should be hurt? Whether they 'pretend it doesnt exist' or not, it's still wrong, and because there's something wrong going on, we need to work to make it right, not just throw up our hands and say "oh well thats what happens when youre a hipster" !!!

Re: I Am An Object Of Internet Ridicule, Ask Me Anything

#379
post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Mozart's the canonical example of somebody who didn't have to practice for years." I'm assuming the parent was referring to information presented in the book Outliers, which provides a counter-argument to this

You are correct. In fact, I just drove x-country and Outliers was one of the books I listened to on the way. I haven't had the time to cross-check much of the information, as I just took most of what Gladwell wrote as fact (even if this was just an opinion).

[deleted]

Re: I Am An Object Of Internet Ridicule, Ask Me Anything

#380

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's very presumptuous of you to assume that "hipsters" don't actually enjoy the things they do.

If they actually enjoy what they're doing, and not the feeling of being 'counterculture', then they're not being "hipsters". It's pretty simple.

No true Scotsman would do something he didn't actually enjoy.
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