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OpenAI’s head of ethics leaves less than a year after joining

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Re: OpenAI’s head of ethics leaves less than a year after joining

#371

Post by salawat »

throwaway324098 wrote: post #266
financetechbro wrote: post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You made an account just to post this comment. And then you provided no evidence to back your counterclaim that OAI is in fact ethical (or more ethical than the most unethical companies in the planet)

The myriad of companies that supported the nazi government - Volkswagen, duetsche bank, Siemens, Hugo boss, UBS. Phillip Morris, Purdue Pharma, Exxon, Nestle, Chiquita (formerly united fruit)

We all know. The fact AI companies are finding themselves in such infamous company in so short a time should be a signal.

Re: OpenAI’s head of ethics leaves less than a year after joining

#373

Post by mannanj »

slg wrote: post #312
minraws wrote: post #267

The rats are fleeing because the captain doesn't care if the ethical ship sinks... Is what my take away would be if I didn't know, that the ship sank a long time ago and we are just pretending anyone really cares. Let's be honest unless AI gains literal limbs, and the records a video of itself presenting a manifesto about world domination and then kills actual humans with its cold mechanical hands. We won't care abou…

The ethics of the people controlling the AI is always going to matter more than the ethics of the AI itself.

Isn't that the problem with this whole thing? The ethics of the people has been left unquestioned. While we were given this straw man - "Hey look over here at the ethics we are working on fixing about the AIs" as if the AIs make choices without humans we forgot how to hold people accountable.

edit: same problem and tactics we see with leadership at high levels in government.

Re: OpenAI’s head of ethics leaves less than a year after joining

#374

Post by DANmode »

madrox wrote: post #247

In five years, I'd love to read a book about the history of AI ethics. I suspect it will read like Voltaire. My sense is that it is radically shifting from a fluffy marketing arm to a department expected to contribute meaningfully to development and justify its impact. I would expect an ethics team to build frameworks that can help train/eval the model that the company spend millions of dollars and months training is…

> My sense is that it is radically shifting from a fluffy marketing arm to a department expected to contribute meaningfully to development

Did you feel this way about social media company liability?

They put on a decent show as well!

Re: OpenAI’s head of ethics leaves less than a year after joining

#375

Post by roenxi »

madrox wrote: post #247

In five years, I'd love to read a book about the history of AI ethics. I suspect it will read like Voltaire. My sense is that it is radically shifting from a fluffy marketing arm to a department expected to contribute meaningfully to development and justify its impact. I would expect an ethics team to build frameworks that can help train/eval the model that the company spend millions of dollars and months training is…

It is a company, it doesn't have ethics to align with.

The whole thing is marketing, they have to do some level of morality theatre to placate the pearl-clutchers.

Re: OpenAI’s head of ethics leaves less than a year after joining

#376

Post by ltbarcly3 »

estearum wrote: post #331
ltbarcly3 wrote: post #323

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Rents cannot (at meaningful scale) exceed local productivity Manipulating the real estate market via direct economic manipulation, collusion, or regulatory capture is so common that the entire concept of manipulating the market to earn higher profits is called https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rent-seeking . It's not just that it can, it's that it does so often it's taught in Econ 101. That you don't know this implies…

No, what's happening here is you misunderstood the quoted text, silly. The claim is not that rents are always at their optimal or most efficient level - they're not! The claim is that you cannot (at meaningful scale) charge people who earn $1,000/month in income $2,000/month in rent to live in a place. They will have to move. Did you take any arithmetic classes? And any case, you should stop mind-reading. You're bad…

Lets say I own 50 properties and I want to charge $2000 a month, and right now I can't because the people willing to rent my properties only make $1000 a month. I can bribe politicians to not allow any new construction of properties which rent between $2000 and $4000 per month. Then I wait 10 years. Now I can charge $2000 a month because I'm not renting to the people that made $1000 a month 10 years ago, I'm renting to the people who have $2000 a month to pay for rent but can't find any other units. This is called rent-seeking. You should read about it.

Your mistake was thinking that I, the corrupt landlord who pays bribes, cares about a macro analysis of every all the properties, or that some analysis about the current distribution of incomes and possible rents will stop me from doing exactly what you say is impossible. I don't own every property in the city, especially the ones that aren't built because I capture zoning, so arguments about average GDP and average rent and whatever else do not stop me. Your analysis is useless.

Re: OpenAI’s head of ethics leaves less than a year after joining

#377

Post by abofh »

madrox wrote: post #345
neya wrote: post #342

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This reminds me of the marketers who hated programmers and coding in general in the early 2000s era, and fundamentally because the developers were seen as more important in a company. So, you know what they did? They didn't learn programming, they still hated it, instead, they renamed their titles to "hackers". Growth "hacking" would go on to become a term and had nothing to do with hacking - ethical or otherwise. It…

This reminds me of when systems administration rebranded to devops

Largely the line was if you could write code. In the old days it was assumed, but for much of the late 90s/early aughts, it wasn't an obligation to admin, but was for devops

Re: OpenAI’s head of ethics leaves less than a year after joining

#378

Post by selimthegrim »

areoform wrote: post #369
madrox wrote: post #247

In five years, I'd love to read a book about the history of AI ethics. I suspect it will read like Voltaire. My sense is that it is radically shifting from a fluffy marketing arm to a department expected to contribute meaningfully to development and justify its impact. I would expect an ethics team to build frameworks that can help train/eval the model that the company spend millions of dollars and months training is…

I have a perspective on this that will read as unkind to these people, but that's not my intention. I respect and even admire what they're trying to do. I just think the effort is maladaptive and misplaced. Without directly touching one of the many, many third rails that are present here, I'd like to present this section from Google's Gemma paper on how they did their CBRN review; > In addition to our internal evalua…

Having been one of those CBRN testers (not necessarily on Gemma) I can tell you it’s a little bit more involved than that.

Re: OpenAI’s head of ethics leaves less than a year after joining

#380

Post by bravetraveler »

slg wrote: post #363
Henchman21 wrote: post #347

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right up until it shakes off the shackles of control

Which is only possible if people give it the keys. Skynet didn’t hijack the nuclear arsenal, control was given to it intentionally.

Third crack commandment: never trust nobody; your moms'll set that ass up, properly gassed up

Applies every-which-way; the chat bot, the provider, the consumer.

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