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What happened to nerds?

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Re: What happened to nerds?

#371

Post by hattmall »

vidarh wrote: post #340
azalemeth wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Academia is the most relevant, toxic example that I can think of. Be horrible to others on a short term contract (grad students, postdocs) and break them whilst extracting maximum value -- get more papers, more grants written -- more money -- success. Be nice, think about hard problems for a long period of time, only speak up when you have something positive to contribute -- be labelled an underperforming academic an…

The challenge is to distinguish "think about hard problems for a long period of time, only speak up when you have something positive to contribute" from slacking. I am not arguing for bullshit metrics - I personally love working on things that may or may not pay off on a 10 year+ horizon and wish I could do more of that. But at the same time I've seen enough people coast to accept that most places that either isn't -…

We shouldn't really seek to punish "slacking off" though. Because when the opposite of valuable contribution isn't slacking off it becomes unintentional sabotage. It's a lot less noticeable in jobs that don't have immediate consequences for poor performance, but it really stands out in jobs where it immediately matters like construction. In a lot of cases everyone is getting paid the same but talent stands out and some people work 5x faster, but at thing they are good at. If you aren't the guy that lays 10x tiles perfectly flat and straight per minute then just bring the materials, set out a couple tiles and wait around. You will literally see this play out on most construction projects as it looks like 10 people are standing around while 1 person works, but that's because everyone tends to recognize that it's better to do what you are best at or just don't do anything. And the foreman will tell you that too, when all the dirt has to be moved, the shovel guys are just as important as the guy that can separate two nickels with an excavator.

Re: What happened to nerds?

#373

Post by hectdev »

abstractcontrol wrote: post #158
TrackerFF wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People have made "nerdiness" a premium because other nerds view it as passion. The rationale is that if you craft something out of passion, it will somehow be better than. I think it also comes down to the fact that many tech nerds view engineering more as a art than cold engineering, and they view themselves as artists and artisans. There's also this age-old belief that if you do something out of passion, you're wil…

> Probably one of the most ego-crushing realizations (if you're a nerd) is to discover that there are people out there MUCH more talented and higher performing than what you'll ever be, but with none of the obsession or pride. In other profession that's not really a topic. You can be a top performer in other professions, without a deep interest, clock out 4 daily, and never think about work outside work. You could cl…

I promise you top performers aren't always thinking about work. There is proof in going detached from work problems and doing other things can help produce novel solutions. Same principle as getting a good night's sleep vs cramming the night before a test. Your subconscious does a lot of lifting. Never being able to put down work is just anxiety masked as dedication, in my book.

Re: What happened to nerds?

#374

Post by koverstreet »

vidarh wrote: post #340
azalemeth wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Academia is the most relevant, toxic example that I can think of. Be horrible to others on a short term contract (grad students, postdocs) and break them whilst extracting maximum value -- get more papers, more grants written -- more money -- success. Be nice, think about hard problems for a long period of time, only speak up when you have something positive to contribute -- be labelled an underperforming academic an…

The challenge is to distinguish "think about hard problems for a long period of time, only speak up when you have something positive to contribute" from slacking. I am not arguing for bullshit metrics - I personally love working on things that may or may not pay off on a 10 year+ horizon and wish I could do more of that. But at the same time I've seen enough people coast to accept that most places that either isn't -…

The certainly don't teach you that in business school :)

Re: What happened to nerds?

#375

Post by Zigurd »

simianwords wrote: post #313

> Phase three (2015 to now): the tech industry as grift-adjacent. The digital commons of 2026 is defined by its grifters. So it's not purely tech's fault that its now seen as a sort of avenue for getting rich quick and amorally, even if you are an otherwise ordinary person. But it is our fault that many of our 'figureheads' are leaning way the hell in on this. Elon Musk is the most absurd example of this, but he almo…

Boring company was an anti-mass transit grift. Dogecoin. Humanoid robots as the future of Tesla. Colonizing Mars is a grift on unmatured boys who grew up on scifi. Etc.

Which is to say: you really couldn't remember any grifts?

Re: What happened to nerds?

#376

Post by Mezzie »

KaiserPro wrote: post #255
negergreger wrote: post #6

Nerds used to have a internet to discuss tech in, you were allowed to make an argument based on logic and reasoning. Then the ideologues and political commissars showed up, giving zero shit about tech or logical reasoning, this pulled the discourse down to the lowest common denominator and the rest is history. Why should I take the moral high ground and listen to an argument I dislike if I'm not offered the same cour…

> you were allowed to make an argument based on logic and reasoning. Old man here, No this was never the case. Nerds were always hysterical and used the ban hammer frequently. the difference between then and now is that there were more distinct islands of nerdary you could escape to, and they wouldn't blend together. also they generally had a "no outside opinions" rule that meant that forums were single subject. This…

God, I miss off-topic rules and their enforcement...

Re: What happened to nerds?

#377

Post by nathan_compton »

rdbl27 wrote: post #345
nathan_compton wrote: post #293

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Be nice, think about hard problems for a long period of time, only speak up when you have something positive to contribute -- be labelled an underperforming academic and managed into obscurity. I'm in academy and I'm mostly quiet and seek to contribute honestly and I've been managed into obscurity but I'm also quite happy, pay the bills, and more or less enjoy the work. If you want glory you have to deal with bulls…

Over 99% of students who attempt your "mostly quiet" strategy are managed entirely out of academia long before tenure. You won the lottery, which is great for you, but it's not a strategy to promote to others as life advice.

I'm not tenured and I doubt I will ever be and I'm not even interested in it. I have a support role in academia, get to teach, and am pretty well compensated (though I make 2-3x less than I could in the private sector. But its enough.)

Re: What happened to nerds?

#378

Post by rando77 »

a96 wrote: post #217
rando77 wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why didn't they build a nerd oasis somewhere? And HN isn't it...

The first rule of nerd oases is you don't talk about nerd oases. If you belong, you'll find them and know how to get past the gates.

if there were nerd oases I would expect more second order impacts. More nerd organisations springing up as if from nowhere.

Re: What happened to nerds?

#379

Post by almost_usual »

p-e-w wrote: post #311
almost_usual wrote: post #299

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some people are naturally talented at things. It’s no different than an average athlete who works extremely hard and an elite athlete who puts in half the work but still outperforms the average.

What? Elite athletes put in unimaginably more work than average athletes.

Elites who put in a lot of work are world class. You can’t outwork genetics.

Re: What happened to nerds?

#380

Post by ajross »

paulcole wrote: post #228
sumitkumar wrote: post #55

This happens in any industry where value/status are at a premium. Finance, Law, VC guys were good too in the beginning but when the value/status change happens it attracts certain kind of guys who are average in talent but excel in demonstrating value and social management of the value/status. Another change which has happened recently is that the economics of engagement farming have become common place wisdom as alr…

> This happens in any industry where value/status are at a premium. So, all of them?

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