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Amazon's Ring and Google's Nest reveal the severity of U.S. surveillance state

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Re: Amazon's Ring and Google's Nest reveal the severity of U.S. surveillance state

#371

Post by rsync »

wredcoll wrote: post #328
user3939382 wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right if you’re not a mouthpiece for the US State Depts horrific foreign policy you’re a Russian propagandist. My family fought in every war going back to the Revolution and I think our policy on Russia is complete shit. AFAIC we started the whole conflict.

> AFAIC we started the whole conflict. Is this talking point still being paid for? I haven't seen it in a while, but I guess I don't keep track that closely. What are the other russian provided talking points these days?

I would direct you to George Kennan[1] and his 1997 NYT article where he said, among other things:

"... expanding NATO would be the most fateful error of American policy in the entire post-Cold War era. Such a decision may be expected to inflame the nationalistic, anti-Western and militaristic tendencies in Russian opinion; to have an adverse effect on the development of Russian democracy; to restore the atmosphere of the cold war to East-West relations, and to impel Russian foreign policy in directions decidedly not to our liking ..."

Is it your position that he was paid for, or in some way disingenuously held, this view ?

I don't have strong opinions on this topic but I note with interest that there seem to be contrary viewpoints that aren't not puppets/trolls.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_F._Kennan

Re: Amazon's Ring and Google's Nest reveal the severity of U.S. surveillance state

#372

Post by wredcoll »

StopDisinfo910 wrote: post #313
wredcoll wrote: post #308

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If we're nitpicking, is it queue or cue?

I guess it's cue like on cue but it's late on a Sunday. You will have to excuse my brain. It wasn't a nitpick by the way. I deeply resent American using "the West" like if my own country and culture was somehow fungible in their experience. They are not. We don't have that much in common. That doesn't include a legal tradition, or a conception of what freedom of speech should be, neither does it include values or his…

It would probably help if you made a more specific point rather than just ranting in very vague terms.

Grouping terms like "the west" can be broad enough to include over half of all living humans or so narrow that it applies to a small village.

It is, admittedly, not a particularly useful term, but it's not like americans are reaponsible for it.

Re: Amazon's Ring and Google's Nest reveal the severity of U.S. surveillance state

#373

Post by joquarky »

shevy-java wrote: post #197
oceansky wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Someone commented on a HN threads on just de-googling and he couldn't even pick up his kids without a gmail or apple account. Just not using it is really unrealistic for the average person at this moment

While that may be true, people need to start somewhere. Otherwise the future will just be even more sniffing done by private entities. Do we want a sneaky Skynet that looks more like 1984?

The guy who is obsessed with using Lord of the Rings to name his companies certainly does want that.

Re: Amazon's Ring and Google's Nest reveal the severity of U.S. surveillance state

#374

Post by 1718627440 »

StopDisinfo910 wrote: post #303
dhbradshaw wrote: post #218

I really like this passage: >It is always the case that there are benefits available from relinquishing core civil liberties: allowing infringements on free speech may reduce false claims and hateful ideas; allowing searches and seizures without warrants will likely help the police catch more criminals, and do so more quickly; giving up privacy may, in fact, enhance security. > But the core premise of the West genera…

I would like it a lot better without the mention to the "West", which, as usual, is a code word for: "I want to pretend my point extend outside the USA but I have absolutely no knowledge of how true that is. I don't intend to do any research because that would demand efforts from me so bear with my casual imperialism". Queue the purely American historical lesson following.

Greek philosophy did not happen in the USA and actually predates it quite a bit.

Re: Amazon's Ring and Google's Nest reveal the severity of U.S. surveillance state

#375

Post by pear01 »

whattheheckheck wrote: post #354
pear01 wrote: post #311

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Get money out of politics (reverse citizens united) and enact term/age limits for all public offices. These problems will be solved. Most Americans agree on most things. Don't let the politicians who benefit off of dividing us fool you. An agenda that focuses on reform outside of the usual finger pointing game of partisan politics and promises to enact these reforms without fear or favor will win. Any such agenda mus…

Does the next coalition have any money?

What point are you attempting to make? Or are you one of a minority of people that refuses to see the difference between (say among other things) the unrealized gains of someone like a Musk vs someone's working class parents saving up for retirement?

Citizens United litigated a very specific issue. It was only an issue because Congress had actually passed some meaningful campaign finance reform after many painful years (really decades) of effort. The court essentially kneecapped it overnight on a 5 to 4 basis. Get money out of politics commonly means get dark/pac/corporate money out of politics, not individual donors well within long established FEC limits that these pacs are designed to circumvent.

Again, billionaires live by different rules. This doesn't just apply to taxes, criminal justice, etc it applies to the foundation of our democracy - free and fair elections. What could be more in keeping with the best of American traditions than ensuring our elections are as egalitarian as possible?

Re: Amazon's Ring and Google's Nest reveal the severity of U.S. surveillance state

#376

Post by jeffrallen »

jb1991 wrote: post #50
kgwxd wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The rampant crime is largely made up.

Compared to other major western countries, the US has a serious problem with violent crime in particular.

And quality of life crimes. In my country, I can get a package left on my property and it is not stolen.

Re: Amazon's Ring and Google's Nest reveal the severity of U.S. surveillance state

#377

Post by unethical_ban »

tokyobreakfast wrote: post #271
hermannj314 wrote: post #252

We have a branch of government called Congress, here are some things they used to do that made it a crime to read your mail or listen to your phone calls. 1. Postal Service Act of 1792 2. Electronic Communications Privacy Act (ECPA) of 1986 Anyway, Facebook can read your DMs, Google can read your email, Ring can take photos from your camera. We can very easily make those things a crime, but we don't seem to want to d…

Everyone has known Google reads your email since day one. In the early days they would spin it as a good thing: "that's why the spam filtering is great!" Why is everyone suddenly outraged Ring has access to your footage? These cloud-connected cameras...hosted on someone else's servers. It's literally how they work. "But I didn't think they would use the video in a way I didn't personally approve after giving it to th…

People are waking up too late, so don't support them, rather ridicule them and tell them their newfound awareness is futile?

Re: Amazon's Ring and Google's Nest reveal the severity of U.S. surveillance state

#378

Post by joquarky »

jjulius wrote: post #306
jasonjayr wrote: post #253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They require a phone that can log into an App store, so unless parents can work around that, then yes?

Nonsense. My kid just started kindergarten this past year - I've never been required to log into ParentSquare through a GMail address and I have only ever accessed it through a browser on a laptop. (Damn, I failed at my attempt to stop posting.)

The web is no better than phone apps when it comes to data gathering. Maybe the data is a little fuzzier, but you can be assured it's being gathered all the same as it is in phone apps.

Re: Amazon's Ring and Google's Nest reveal the severity of U.S. surveillance state

#379

Post by joquarky »

rolph wrote: post #298
oceansky wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He needed to verify his identity via an app at pick up time, and needed an gmail/apple account as part of the process. I don't remember which app.

bring my kids now or i will call the police and you will be charged with abduction.

You must have a complexion on the lighter side if you think calling the police is the best solution to something like this.

Re: Amazon's Ring and Google's Nest reveal the severity of U.S. surveillance state

#380

Post by weaksauce »

zugi wrote: post #269
roywiggins wrote: post #267

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the security/liberty tradeoff is actually often a false promise. You can end up trading away liberty for nothing at all. I don't like buying into this, even to say "liberty is better, we should do that instead" because it implicitly concedes that you would really get the security on the other side of the bargain. And if you don't get the security you were promised, it's too late to do anything about it.

> " Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety " -- Benjamin Franklin The key phrase is "a little temporary safety". 250 years ago people understood that the "security" gains were small and fleeting, but the loss of liberty was massive and permanent.

basically the patriot act was a big piece of temporary safety that never produced any.
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