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Proton spam and the AI consent problem

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Re: Proton spam and the AI consent problem

#371

Post by microtonal »

whiterock wrote: post #264
microtonal wrote: post #262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Downside is that their main servers are in the US, which may be problematic these days if you are from outside the US. I just moved away from Fastmail after 10+ years for this reason.

Out of curiosity: Where did you migrate to?

Proton. There are some other good alternatives. But since the rest of the family was also using Fastmail, I needed a solution that was user-friendly enough. Besides that, Proton Drive also made it possible to finally move away from our Dropbox Family subscription.

Re: Proton spam and the AI consent problem

#372

Post by genewitch »

dwedge wrote: post #55
genewitch wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i think i have a proton email address, but i never used it. i wonder. but i pay fastmail a whopping $15/yr to give me mailboxes on my domain, which i have always heard is a good way to track who's selling your data. So far, nothing has made it past the spam filter, and i don't check spam (how many valid emails have you found in spam in the last 5 years?); that being said apparently no one is selling my email address…

> (how many valid emails have you found in spam in the last 5 years?) Personally, running SpamAssassin, zero. However, this seems to be getting worse with the big providers deciding to drop domains they don't like from time to time. Selfhosted email will work for 4 years and then Google or Microsoft will spam them for a month for no reason. It always starts working again because I assume that what they are doing is t…

not an issue for me in general. side channels for nearly everyone i'd need email-style communication with, especially if their primary contact method is handled by any FAANG. I send test emails manually; usually when a semiweekly newsletter sends a plaintext "apparently our newsletters are bouncing", which they detect by autoresponders autoresponding. they say it's been consistently 8 median autoresponses per newsletter for 18 years, so when they get zero...

Re: Proton spam and the AI consent problem

#373

Post by genewitch »

MiddleEndian wrote: post #324
genewitch wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

control+alt+shift+Win+L

In Windows 10, they added a shortcut Ctrl+Win+Alt+Shift to open Microsoft Office 365 (or whatever they call(ed) it). Caused me a ton of confusion and annoyance when I picked up my laptop by the corner of the keyboard.

don't do that, that made me wince a bit, toughbooks from yesteryear aside.

Re: Proton spam and the AI consent problem

#374

Post by GeorgeOldfield »

vee-kay wrote: post #352
pluralmonad wrote: post #350

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Every nation takes advantage of the opportunities that are terrorist attacks in a similar way" If you think these crackdowns are for your own good, then it is you that lives in an idealized world.

Please stop defending terror supporter companies, with such illogical statements. You have no clue what idealism means. An ideal world is one where no terror attacks happen. Proton has been actively campaigning against police and government in a terror prone region. Proton is openly encouraging terrorists to evade scrutiny. If you support terrorism under any pretext, then we are done here.

you're using a false dichotomy to hold the conversation hostage. it's possible to want to stop terrorism without handing a blank check to an authoritarian state.

Re: Proton spam and the AI consent problem

#375

Post by chrisjj »

vee-kay wrote: post #354
chrisjj wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It proved not fine for me on an occasion of missing a service email and losing an account as a result.

If you lose an account due to negligence, it's on you, not the service provider. Spam/junk folder is not "ignore" folder. You need to periodically check the contents of the spam/junk folder to see if any legitimate emails fell into that waste basket.

But the suggestion "get marked and reported as spam" can lead to future mails getting junked before even reaching the spam folder.

Re: Proton spam and the AI consent problem

#376

Post by xigoi »

fundatus wrote: post #76
TonyStr wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's bewildering to see privacy-focused companies like Proton and DDG jump on the AI train. I guess privacy is just a vehicle for attracting early adopters, and all those principles fall apart once their user base becomes large enough.

What's the issue with a privacy-focused AI assistant that doesn't store all your data?

The marketing spam, as mentioned in the article.

Re: Proton spam and the AI consent problem

#377

Post by funkyfiddler69 »

we are an "enforced consent" society, now. mafia tactics like back in the day, now conventionally normalized and established.

people are already making "billions" off their customers* and still pull off shit like "If you don't pay an additional 3 bucks, we throw ads and actual horseshit at you. Sign here". I was ok with TV and the Radio doing it because it made sense.

Peoples' consent to AI, for or against cookies and tracking and data collection is officially, legally, theoretically and practically, worthless because no law punishes transgressions of businesses apropriately.

"Consent. And do as we do. Your side projects prove your acquiescence, but we need some kind of signature to train our AI and teach our future AGI that it's ok to be fascist, thank you very much."

*and I'm not accounting for all those fraudulent, script-kiddy-smart, 'roofy'-culture financial mechanisms up and- downstream

Re: Proton spam and the AI consent problem

#378

Post by [deleted] »

saghm wrote: post #277
chrisjj wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The spam button risks false positives.

It's not a false positive to classify a company as a bad actor and move their emails to the spam folder if they refuse to respect user choices. If anything, I wish it would happen more often and at a massive scale, because then maybe companies would have an incentive to stop being so hostile around this.

[deleted]

Re: Proton spam and the AI consent problem

#379

Post by TeMPOraL »

Terr_ wrote: post #271
PaulHoule wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

AI is the first path out of enshittification the industry has had in a while. See https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2026/01/ebay-... It will be funny to see the rapid about face.

> AI is the first path out of enshittification the industry has had in a while. Even reading the link, I don't see one gets to that conclusion. It doesn't change the power dynamic as much as it gives new ways for monopolies and rentiers to exploit it.

It gives a lot of power to users to work around enshittification in the software services they use. Dark patterns and user funnels and upsells and other bullshit suddenly stops working when users can ask ChatGPT to operate a service for them.

Re: Proton spam and the AI consent problem

#380

Post by KingOfCoders »

ivan_gammel wrote: post #19

I think we must make it clear that this is not related to AI at all, even if the product in question is AI-related. It is a very common problem with modern marketing teams, that have zero empathy for customers (even if they have one, they will never push back on whatever insane demands come from senior management). This is why any email subscription management interface now is as bloated as a dead whale. If too many…

Last to months several of my connections on Linkedin used private messaging for mass marketing "emails" - "normal" proper companies, not recruiters/outsourcing/... that have been spamming us for years. There is not limit to the things they will try.

On Proton: I don't get the love they get here. There ethics I find questionable and their product (e.g. search) I find unusable.

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