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Clair Obscur having its Indie Game Game Of The Year award stripped due to AI use

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Re: Clair Obscur having its Indie Game Game Of The Year award stripped due to AI use

#371

Post by akimbostrawman »

theshrike79 wrote: post #331
akimbostrawman wrote: post #320

Earlier quoted context omitted.

regardless of the definition of the word. i don't think anybody would call a game indie that has tens of millions in production budget, over 300 developer working on it and a movie deal before it was even released.

So under ten million max then? What's the maximum developer count? Do outsourced assets count, if so, how? By the amount of people who directly worked on the assets by the outsource company or the whole headcount?

just admit you have no idea about indie games. for many years now it has been clear what is NOT an indie game and 7 figure production budget (marketing not included, most indie games don't even have those outside of social media) with hundredth of people working on it is exactly that. just compare them to any other indie game before if you want to educate yourself about something before posting.

they had a whole orchestra of the size of whole indie game studios for the music alone, does that seem like indie?

Re: Clair Obscur having its Indie Game Game Of The Year award stripped due to AI use

#372

Post by surgical_fire »

CamperBob2 wrote: post #362
surgical_fire wrote: post #355

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you tried reading a history book you would find numerous examples. Of course, I am presuming you can read. I lean on optimism.

It takes only three words to say, "I got nothin'." Try some Strunk & White.

My optimism was unfounded, I see.

Expect the worst and you will never be disappointed.

Re: Clair Obscur having its Indie Game Game Of The Year award stripped due to AI use

#373

Post by defrost »

CamperBob2 wrote: post #345
queenkjuul wrote: post #337

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's extremely tiring how people pretend like there's no difference between these technologies. The comments on the article are the epitome - "oh they used a computer to make a computer game, the horror" Just a cudgel to shut down discussion

There is no difference. What about a dungeon hack game that uses generated mazes? Random level generators put level designers out of work, but you never saw anyone carrying signs and carrying on about those.

When did random level generators advance to the stage of generating rich background art in the style of long term DeviantArt contributors simply by rolling a few PRNGs ?

Was that before or after real people had their work scraped w/out permission or acknowledgement?

Describing these things as having no difference appears delibrately obtuse.

Re: Clair Obscur having its Indie Game Game Of The Year award stripped due to AI use

#374

Post by xboxnolifes »

blackbrokkoli wrote: post #13

Is anyone else detecting a phase shift in LLM criticism? Of course you could always find opinion pieces, blogs and nerdy forum comments that disliked AI; but it appears to me that hate for AI gen content is now hitting mainstream contexts, normie contexts. Feels like my grandma may soon have an opinion on this. No idea what the implications are or even if this is actually something that's happening, but I think it's…

LLM hate for use in art has been pretty mainstream from the start. The difference in criticism between use in code generation and use in art generation is palpable. I dont think anyone took kindly to the discourse of movie producers buying actor likeness rights and having perpetually young old actors for all future movies.

Programmers criticized the code output. Artists and art enjoyers criticized cutting out the artist.

Re: Clair Obscur having its Indie Game Game Of The Year award stripped due to AI use

#375

Post by itishappy »

dathinab wrote: post #370
itishappy wrote: post #363

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Who bans line smoothing algorithms? Do you have a link?

you are failing to get the point it's an (maybe the most) extreme example of something which is "gen AI" but not problematic and as such a naive "rule" saying "no gen AI at all" is a pretty bad competition rule design

I get your point. I don't get who you're arguing with.

You're saying banning line smoothing algorithms for ethical reasons make no sense. I totally agree!

I'm wondering if this actually happens.

Re: Clair Obscur having its Indie Game Game Of The Year award stripped due to AI use

#376

Post by ryandrake »

foundddit wrote: post #264
spuz wrote: post #32

There is a small irony that the Indie Game Awards rejects nominations of games using AI but The Game Awards does not. It is independent teams of developers who are less likely to be able to afford to pay an artists who may be able to produce something of value with AI assets that they otherwise would not have the resources for. On the other side, it is big studios with a good track record and more investment who are…

It's the same thing as local restaurants being picky about using organic and environmentally sustainable ingredients while big chain corporations have a preference for low cost ingredients that strip the environment bare. The big corporations could afford organic stuff, but their aim is to just get a product out there and get it done cheaply. The local restaurant can't often compete on price alone, so they sell thems…

This makes the most sense to me. I expect BigCorps to maximize profit and destroy their product to the point that it's slop. I don't expect indie developers or people "doing it for the craft" to make (or use) slop.

Re: Clair Obscur having its Indie Game Game Of The Year award stripped due to AI use

#377

Post by JohnnyMarcone »

rowanG077 wrote: post #335
MattRix wrote: post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s also a valid reason to be against it!

I disagree, this is the worst reason to be against it. It's choosing horses over trains. Manual labor over engines, mail over e-mail. It's basically purely egotistical, placing something as fleeting as your current job over the progress of humanity.

That's a much easier stance to take for people who are not facing loss of income. If we had wealth redistribution mechanisms in place, I think more people would be pro ai.

Re: Clair Obscur having its Indie Game Game Of The Year award stripped due to AI use

#378

Post by CamperBob2 »

defrost wrote: post #373
CamperBob2 wrote: post #345

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no difference. What about a dungeon hack game that uses generated mazes? Random level generators put level designers out of work, but you never saw anyone carrying signs and carrying on about those.

When did random level generators advance to the stage of generating rich background art in the style of long term DeviantArt contributors simply by rolling a few PRNGs ? Was that before or after real people had their work scraped w/out permission or acknowledgement? Describing these things as having no difference appears delibrately obtuse.

Describing these things as having no difference appears delibrately obtuse.

And pulling entirely-new classes of IP rights out of thin air doesn't?

Re: Clair Obscur having its Indie Game Game Of The Year award stripped due to AI use

#379

Post by rendx »

ctoth wrote: post #338
latexr wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From the submitted article: > "When it was submitted for consideration, representatives of Sandfall Interactive agreed that no gen AI was used in the development of Clair Obscur: Expedition 33. In light of Sandfall Interactive confirming the use of gen AI art in production on the day of the Indie Game Awards 2025 premiere, this does disqualify Clair Obscur: Expedition 33 from its nomination." Whatever placeholder you…

> “witch hunt” is most often used by bad actors attempting to discredit legitimate investigations). By that logic, "fake news" is now unusable because Trump weaponized it, despite the term accurately describing a real phenomenon that existed before and after his usage. "Gaslighting" would be suspect because it got picked up by people dramatizing ordinary disagreements. Every useful term for describing social dynamics…

> "Gaslighting" would be suspect

Gaslighting would be simply incorrect, since gaslighting refers to an elaborate scheme of making somebody doubt their own perception/sanity. It a a severe form of abuse, requires an ongoing relationship with power dynamics (it cannot happen from a single instance of interaction), and typically results in long-term PTSD for the victim(s).

Agree on the capturing. Watering down terms is highly unfortunate for everyone.

Re: Clair Obscur having its Indie Game Game Of The Year award stripped due to AI use

#380

Post by skibidithink »

latexr wrote: post #129
skibidithink wrote: post #21

The AI witch hunt claims its first victim, apparently over some placeholder textures. https://english.elpais.com/culture/2025-07-19/the-low-cost-c... > Sandfall Interactive further clarifies that there are no generative AI-created assets in the game. When the first AI tools became available in 2022, some members of the team briefly experimented with them to generate temporary placeholder textures. Upon release, insta…

From the submitted article: > "When it was submitted for consideration, representatives of Sandfall Interactive agreed that no gen AI was used in the development of Clair Obscur: Expedition 33. In light of Sandfall Interactive confirming the use of gen AI art in production on the day of the Indie Game Awards 2025 premiere, this does disqualify Clair Obscur: Expedition 33 from its nomination." Whatever placeholder you…

Conceding our vocabulary to bad actors is Orwellian.
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