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Kenvue stock drops on report RFK Jr will link autism to Tylenol during pregnancy

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Re: Kenvue stock drops on report RFK Jr will link autism to Tylenol during pregnancy

#371

Post by foxglacier »

ejstronge wrote: post #307
foxglacier wrote: post #298

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> what other sentient entity is available for consultation? Surely you don't mean what you imply there? Not being sentient or available for consultation don't justify harming a person. A mother absolutely has a moral responsibility not to cause lifelong harm to the sentient entity her baby will later become. You wouldn't say excess alcohol consumption during pregnancy is only up to the mother's decision about her own…

>You wouldn't say excess alcohol consumption during pregnancy is only up to the mother's decision about her own body when there are adults walking around with terrible lives because of fetal alcohol syndrome. I would - because the alternative means we are locking up current human beings to act as incubators for potential, future humans

Wow, that's a pretty extreme view. They're locking themselves up voluntarily and also locking their baby up. The baby is helpless but not the mother. If she didn't want to and somehow still recklessly got pregnant, she could always get an abortion which may be just a pill from the pharmacy once she missed a period, or more involved if slower. It's a deliberate choice to be responsible for somebody else's life.

Re: Kenvue stock drops on report RFK Jr will link autism to Tylenol during pregnancy

#372

Post by smt88 »

gtowey wrote: post #266
beefnugs wrote: post #253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

With the current political climate, I think we are more likely to find the Health Department promoting cigarettes as a healthy way to relax.

I don't blame you for being too frustrated by RFK to look into him, but this isn't quite his brand of stupidity.

He's obsessed with "pollutants" in the broadest possible sense. That's why he crusaded against environmental pollutors for most of his adult life.

He also rejects germ theory in favor of the idea that disease is caused by environmental pollution getting into the body.

That's why he supports a return to (his broken understanding) of "natural" living.

Re: Kenvue stock drops on report RFK Jr will link autism to Tylenol during pregnancy

#373

Post by sandworm101 »

jazzyjackson wrote: post #169
sandworm101 wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He was legitimately put into a position of power by the american political system. And this is an article by the BBC, probably the most respected news source on the planet. Crazy is now the norm, the leading voice. It must be confronted.

what you resist persists

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhyme-as-reason_effect

Re: Kenvue stock drops on report RFK Jr will link autism to Tylenol during pregnancy

#374

Post by thisisit »

spchampion2 wrote: post #4

Judging from the comments I've seen, nobody believes this because RFK has completely shot his credibility, and I don't blame them either. But it turns out there may actually be some emerging evidence to support this. This recent Harvard meta-analysis [1] from just last month looked at 46 different studies and suggested that there may actually be something happening here although it's not conclusive. Correlation but n…

> Nobody should be making policy on this yet, but it's the kind of thing that I would allocate some research dollars to if I hadn't just fired all of the competent researchers.

Yes but that is the whole RFK brand. He and his supporters always try to have their cake and eat it too. Claim something, things go wrong and blame others for misconstruing RFK's comments.

The way this is going - RFK is going to make claims based on this paper and when people get harmed, he and his supporters will claim that people who followed RFK's assertion didn't hear him correctly. He clearly said the policy was based on this paper and people should have done more research and read this paper. See this paper says there is correlation and not causation. So, you cannot blame RFK for this mishap.

Re: Kenvue stock drops on report RFK Jr will link autism to Tylenol during pregnancy

#375

Post by fooker »

CamperBob2 wrote: post #286
fooker wrote: post #280

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You could get a Nobel prize or two by proving this statement. How we pass on acquired traits to offspring is not well understood at all. We know there’s a mechanism, but not how it works or how selective it is.

So having rehabilitated the Luddites, HN is now moving on to Lysenko. Peachy.

You not knowing something doesn’t make it not exist.

https://www.cuimc.columbia.edu/news/study-shows-how-effects-...

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC4377509/

https://www.brown.edu/news/2016-12-12/famine

Re: Kenvue stock drops on report RFK Jr will link autism to Tylenol during pregnancy

#376

Post by johnisgood »

Spivak wrote: post #275
johnisgood wrote: post #255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do not disagree. Ultimately, it is "pick your poison[1]". [1] Or others will pick it for you (control, regulation, whatever). You said "some people", which is true. I do not experience euphoria from opiates and I am sure I am not alone with this. In my case it is a blessing because I do have an addictive personality. Some other people do not get psychologically addicted to opiates despite euphoria. There is a great…

I think the stronger point of what you're saying is if you can set yourself to avoid addiction—you have a time limited dose, you have no means of acquiring more—then opiate painkillers are the safest option in terms of potential damage to your body. There's no avoiding it when it comes to some people's chronic pain but it's a tragedy we've ruined the reputation for opiate painkillers because they were prescribed for…

Thank you. This is what I essentially meant. See, this is what I meant by someone being able to express my thoughts better than I could ever hope for, so again, thank you!

Re: Kenvue stock drops on report RFK Jr will link autism to Tylenol during pregnancy

#377

Post by johnisgood »

kelnos wrote: post #283
johnisgood wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We all know about opiates No, I do not think we do, because it causes none of the side-effects associated with NSAIDs, and it is even safer than acetaminophen, i.e. there is no risk of hepatotoxicity whatsoever. The only side-effect is euphoria. Please do not mention respiratory depression here, that is a non-issue, it matters as so much as liver failure matters with acetaminophen overdoses. Opiates are safer than…

Abuse and misuse of opiates is the key problem though. "Just don't abuse them" isn't a solution. As far as I understand, ibuprofen and acetaminophen are not addictive, while opiates are. Opiates are only the best option if we ignore addiction, but we can't seriously do that. AFAICT, I don't tend toward addiction, but I would much prefer ibuprofen or acetaminophen over opiates; I know that I can use those responsibly…

I am sorry it made you feel fuzzy. I did not say it works for everyone. My grandma gets delirious from Tramadol, for example. Many people are just simply pain-free on it without getting "high", let alone delirious. I personally do not experience these mental symptoms of opiates so I have no first-hand experiences. I know what euphoria is like, I have taken MDMA, but opiates works more peripherally for me, even the ones that are supposed to pass the CNS greatly.

Of course, I think, ultimately it is for you to decide whether it is worth the risk (feeling fuzzy) or not. It is not for me to decide what works for you. :)

Re: Kenvue stock drops on report RFK Jr will link autism to Tylenol during pregnancy

#378

Post by johnisgood »

AndyPa32 wrote: post #277
johnisgood wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some people have it. Some do not. I have taken very large amounts of opiates before and I have never ever experienced nausea from them. I think you are not likely to experience it at lower doses from say, codeine or hydrocodone either, but honestly, it varies by individuals. It would suck if I experienced nausea, and it would equally suck if I experienced euphoria from opiates, because I have an addictive personality…

The risk of NSAID ulcers can be vastly reduced by Pantoprazole (Protonix®)

I know, and there is something called Venter (sucrate). Combining both works best.

Re: Kenvue stock drops on report RFK Jr will link autism to Tylenol during pregnancy

#379

Post by piker »

kelnos wrote: post #299
piker wrote: post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Always surprises me as an American in the UK how hostile the UK is to paracetamol. You buy it in like 300-pill packages in the US, and I've literally never heard of anyone having a single accidental over-dose. I'm not sure I've ever heard of anyone intentionally overdosing on it, but I guess I can't rule that out since I'm aware of who 1-2 people personally have taken "a handful of pills". The efficacy window of driv…

> Always surprises me as an American in the UK how hostile the UK is to paracetamol. This is so funny because there's a post in another subthread by someone from the UK saying the same thing about Americans being hostile toward it. I've only been to the UK a few times, but I feel like it's a funny meme that people in the UK unhesitatingly suggest and take paracetamol for everything . I guess that's not really true, o…

I’m more referring to the fact that it’s treated like a controlled substance here and sold in limited quantities from behind the counter. It’s the same treatment the U.S. gives to Sudafed which is an input to meth as I understand it.

Re: Kenvue stock drops on report RFK Jr will link autism to Tylenol during pregnancy

#380

Post by piker »

tialaramex wrote: post #263
piker wrote: post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Always surprises me as an American in the UK how hostile the UK is to paracetamol. You buy it in like 300-pill packages in the US, and I've literally never heard of anyone having a single accidental over-dose. I'm not sure I've ever heard of anyone intentionally overdosing on it, but I guess I can't rule that out since I'm aware of who 1-2 people personally have taken "a handful of pills". The efficacy window of driv…

It doesn't make much sense to think of efficacy windows for driving, it's not a medical intervention. Besides US traffic deaths are crazy high by UK standards.

I believe the numbers normalize a bit when you adjust for the fact that everyone drives in the U.S. and tends to be alone when driving. So it’s like accident per mile driven and you see it’s around the same. But in the UK many fewer people drive as a proportion of the population and especially those who are more dangerous (e.g. young, old, disabled, drunk) tend to opt out here due to the availability of mass transit which doesn’t work in the U.S.
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