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Cloudlflare builds OAuth with Claude and publishes all the prompts

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Re: Cloudlflare builds OAuth with Claude and publishes all the prompts

#371

Post by JimDabell »

risyachka wrote: post #370
i5heu wrote: post #363

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Revealing against what? If you look at the README it is completely revealed... so i would argue there is nothing to "reveal" in the first place. > I started this project on a lark, fully expecting the AI to produce terrible code for me to laugh at. And then, uh... the code actually looked pretty good. Not perfect, but I just told the AI to fix things, and it did. I was shocked. > To emphasize, this is not "vibe coded…

If the guy knew how to properly implement oauth - did he save any time though by prompting or just tried to prove a point that if you actually already know all details of impl you can guide llm to do it? Thats the biggest issue I see. In most cases I don't use llm because DIYing it takes less time than prompting/waiting/checking every line.

> did he save any time though

Yes:

> It took me a few days to build the library with AI.

> I estimate it would have taken a few weeks, maybe months to write by hand.

– https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44160208

> or just tried to prove a point that if you actually already know all details of impl you can guide llm to do it?

No:

> I was an AI skeptic. I thoughts LLMs were glorified Markov chain generators that didn't actually understand code and couldn't produce anything novel. I started this project on a lark, fully expecting the AI to produce terrible code for me to laugh at. And then, uh... the code actually looked pretty good. Not perfect, but I just told the AI to fix things, and it did. I was shocked.

— https://github.com/cloudflare/workers-oauth-provider/?tab=re...

Re: Cloudlflare builds OAuth with Claude and publishes all the prompts

#372

Post by DonHopkins »

risyachka wrote: post #370
i5heu wrote: post #363

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Revealing against what? If you look at the README it is completely revealed... so i would argue there is nothing to "reveal" in the first place. > I started this project on a lark, fully expecting the AI to produce terrible code for me to laugh at. And then, uh... the code actually looked pretty good. Not perfect, but I just told the AI to fix things, and it did. I was shocked. > To emphasize, this is not "vibe coded…

If the guy knew how to properly implement oauth - did he save any time though by prompting or just tried to prove a point that if you actually already know all details of impl you can guide llm to do it? Thats the biggest issue I see. In most cases I don't use llm because DIYing it takes less time than prompting/waiting/checking every line.

[flagged]

Re: Cloudlflare builds OAuth with Claude and publishes all the prompts

#373

Post by theshrike79 »

risyachka wrote: post #370
i5heu wrote: post #363

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Revealing against what? If you look at the README it is completely revealed... so i would argue there is nothing to "reveal" in the first place. > I started this project on a lark, fully expecting the AI to produce terrible code for me to laugh at. And then, uh... the code actually looked pretty good. Not perfect, but I just told the AI to fix things, and it did. I was shocked. > To emphasize, this is not "vibe coded…

If the guy knew how to properly implement oauth - did he save any time though by prompting or just tried to prove a point that if you actually already know all details of impl you can guide llm to do it? Thats the biggest issue I see. In most cases I don't use llm because DIYing it takes less time than prompting/waiting/checking every line.

Do people save time by learning to write code at 420WPM? By optimising their vi(m) layouts and using languages with lots of fancy operators that make things quicker to write?

Using an LLM to write code you already know how to write is just like using intellisense or any other smart autocomplete, but at a larger scale.

Re: Cloudlflare builds OAuth with Claude and publishes all the prompts

#374

Post by kypro »

paxys wrote: post #10

This is exactly the direction I expect AI-assisted coding to go in. Not software engineers being kicked out and some business person pressing a few buttons to have a fully functional app (as is playing out in a lot of fantasies on LinkedIn & X), but rather experienced engineers using AI to generate bits of code and then meticulously reviewing and testing them. The million dollar (perhaps literally) question is – coul…

> Not software engineers being kicked out and some business person pressing a few buttons to have a fully functional app (as is playing out in a lot of fantasies on LinkedIn & X), but rather experienced engineers using AI to generate bits of code and then meticulously reviewing and testing them.

Why would a human review the code in a few years when AI is far better than the average senior developer? Wouldn't that be as stupid as a human reviewing stockfish's moves in Chess?

Re: Cloudlflare builds OAuth with Claude and publishes all the prompts

#375

Post by rienbdj »

i5heu wrote: post #363
rienbdj wrote: post #351

The commits are revealing. Look at this one: > Ask Claude to remove the "backup" encryption key. Clearly it is still important to security-review Claude's code! > prompt: I noticed you are storing a "backup" of the encryption key as `encryptionKeyJwk`. Doesn't this backup defeat the end-to-end encryption, because the key is available in the grant record without needing any token to unwrap it? I don’t think a non-expe…

Revealing against what? If you look at the README it is completely revealed... so i would argue there is nothing to "reveal" in the first place. > I started this project on a lark, fully expecting the AI to produce terrible code for me to laugh at. And then, uh... the code actually looked pretty good. Not perfect, but I just told the AI to fix things, and it did. I was shocked. > To emphasize, this is not "vibe coded…

> Revealing against what?

Revealing of what it is like working with an LLM in this way.

Re: Cloudlflare builds OAuth with Claude and publishes all the prompts

#376

Post by victorbjorklund »

rienbdj wrote: post #351

The commits are revealing. Look at this one: > Ask Claude to remove the "backup" encryption key. Clearly it is still important to security-review Claude's code! > prompt: I noticed you are storing a "backup" of the encryption key as `encryptionKeyJwk`. Doesn't this backup defeat the end-to-end encryption, because the key is available in the grant record without needing any token to unwrap it? I don’t think a non-expe…

That is how LLM:s should be used today. An expert prompts it and checks the code. Still saves a lot of time vs typing everything from scratch. Just the other day I was working on a prototype and let claude write code for a auth flow. Everything was good until the last step where it was just sending the user id as a string with the valid token. So if you got a valid token you could just pass in any user id and become that user. Still saved me a lot of time vs doing it from scratch.

Re: Cloudlflare builds OAuth with Claude and publishes all the prompts

#377

Post by JW_00000 »

i5heu wrote: post #363
rienbdj wrote: post #351

The commits are revealing. Look at this one: > Ask Claude to remove the "backup" encryption key. Clearly it is still important to security-review Claude's code! > prompt: I noticed you are storing a "backup" of the encryption key as `encryptionKeyJwk`. Doesn't this backup defeat the end-to-end encryption, because the key is available in the grant record without needing any token to unwrap it? I don’t think a non-expe…

Revealing against what? If you look at the README it is completely revealed... so i would argue there is nothing to "reveal" in the first place. > I started this project on a lark, fully expecting the AI to produce terrible code for me to laugh at. And then, uh... the code actually looked pretty good. Not perfect, but I just told the AI to fix things, and it did. I was shocked. > To emphasize, this is not "vibe coded…

I think OP meant "revealing" as in "enlightening", not as "uncovering something that was hidden intentionally".

Re: Cloudlflare builds OAuth with Claude and publishes all the prompts

#378

Post by JW_00000 »

sceptic123 wrote: post #63
diggan wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> these tools don't have actual understanding, and are instead producing emergent output from pooling an incomprehensibly large set of pattern-recognized data I mean, bypassing the fact that "actual understanding" doesn't have any consensus about what it is, does it matter if it's "actual understanding" or "kind of understanding", or even "barely understanding", as long as it produces the results you expect?

> as long as it produces the results you expect? But it's more the case of "until it doesn't produce the results you expect" and then what do you do?

Then you do that part yourself. You let AI automate the 20/50/80% (*) of work it can, and you now only need to do the remainder manually.

(*) which one of these it is depends on your case. If you're writing a run-of-the-mill Next.js app, AI will automate 80%; if you're doing something highly specific, it'll be closer to 20%.

Re: Cloudlflare builds OAuth with Claude and publishes all the prompts

#379

Post by otabdeveloper4 »

victorbjorklund wrote: post #376
rienbdj wrote: post #351

The commits are revealing. Look at this one: > Ask Claude to remove the "backup" encryption key. Clearly it is still important to security-review Claude's code! > prompt: I noticed you are storing a "backup" of the encryption key as `encryptionKeyJwk`. Doesn't this backup defeat the end-to-end encryption, because the key is available in the grant record without needing any token to unwrap it? I don’t think a non-expe…

That is how LLM:s should be used today. An expert prompts it and checks the code. Still saves a lot of time vs typing everything from scratch. Just the other day I was working on a prototype and let claude write code for a auth flow. Everything was good until the last step where it was just sending the user id as a string with the valid token. So if you got a valid token you could just pass in any user id and become…

> Still saves a lot of time vs typing everything from scratch

No it doesn't. Typing speed is never the bottleneck for an expert.

As an offline database of Google-tier knowledge, LLM's are useful. Though current LLM tech is half-baked, we need:

a) Cheap commodity hardware for running your own models locally. (And by "locally" I mean separate dedicated devices, not something that fights over your desktop's or laptop's resources.)

b) Standard bulletproof ways to fine-tune models on your own data. (Inference is already there mostly with things like llama.cpp, finetuning isn't.)

Re: Cloudlflare builds OAuth with Claude and publishes all the prompts

#380

Post by protocolture »

michelsedgh wrote: post #347
kentonv wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It took me a few days to build the library with AI. I estimate it would have taken a few weeks, maybe months to write by hand. That said, this is a pretty ideal use case: implementing a well-known standard on a well-known platform with a clear API spec. In my attempts to make changes to the Workers Runtime itself using AI, I've generally not felt like it saved much time. Though, people who don't know the codebase as…

The fascinating part is that each person is finding their own way of using these tools from kids to elders and everyone in between no matter what your background or language or whatever is

This. Lots of people talking up agents right now, but the conversational rubber duck thing hits the spot well for me.
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