Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Figma and Adobe abandon proposed merger

figma.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

371–380 of 1001 posts

Re: Figma and Adobe abandon proposed merger

#371

Post by rchaud »

_fat_santa wrote: post #301
jan_Inkepa wrote: post #248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also that their cancellation window has limits on both sides - I told them more than six months I advance to cancel my renewal and the refused and toll me to call up again in a particular 30 day period close to the expiry date...

When your business has to depend on subscription engineering like this, it means the underlying product is not good enough to stand on it's own feet.

> it means the underlying product is not good enough to stand on it's own feet.

Adobe CC not strong enough? That's not it.

Subscription retention practices like this are to juice quarterly numbers to delight analysts on the earnings calls. If Adobe was a private company this level of lock-in desperation wouldn't be necessary. We'd still be able to buy the software once like we used to.

Re: Figma and Adobe abandon proposed merger

#372

Post by pier25 »

spaceman_2020 wrote: post #210
madeofpalk wrote: post #6

Excellent news. I think there should be more products, more companies, and more competition. Adobe just buying up it's competition will only ever directly hurt consumers. See also, "Adobe says the FTC is looking into its subscription cancellation practices." https://www.theverge.com/2023/12/15/24003532/adobe-says-the-...

imo, Adobe is falling behind. Photoshop's generative AI is substantially worse than what I can get from models on Tensorart/CivitAI + an upscaler. It's way easier to produce something that can go live right now without much editing in CivitAI -> Upscale in Magnific -> Add to Canva.

I couldn't care less about AI in Photoshop but I'd love AI in Illustrator to generate vector stuff.

Re: Figma and Adobe abandon proposed merger

#373

Post by [deleted] »

mbesto wrote: post #274
raiyu wrote: post #149

Anyone else think this has nothing to do with the regulatory agencies but instead the market has dramatically shifted in the past 15 months in terms of valuations and this is a nice cover to cancel the deal? Figma still gets $1B "investment" without giving up any equity or control and Adobe gets to walk away from a massive $20B fee. Adobe makes $17B a year in revenue, they would need some pretty strong growth out of…

> Adobe makes $17B a year in revenue, they would need some pretty strong growth out of Figma to justify the price tag especially after valuations came down. That's not it works. 1. Adobe is at $19B in revenue 2. Adobe's market cap is $272B and just shy of its ATH. 3. Acquisitions, especially at this level, are usually paid with debt and equity, not just cash. 4. The proposed acquisition smells of both one for value (…

[deleted]

Re: Figma and Adobe abandon proposed merger

#374

Post by peyton »

bomewish wrote: post #194
madeofpalk wrote: post #6

Excellent news. I think there should be more products, more companies, and more competition. Adobe just buying up it's competition will only ever directly hurt consumers. See also, "Adobe says the FTC is looking into its subscription cancellation practices." https://www.theverge.com/2023/12/15/24003532/adobe-says-the-...

Totally agree. I resent the fact that they’d try cash out that way. At least ipo or something. More fragmentation is good for preventing monopoly.

If Adobe’s a buyer at $20b, they’re a buyer at $20b. I don’t see how selling stock to the public along the way increases fragmentation or prevents monopoly.

Re: Figma and Adobe abandon proposed merger

#375

Post by pier25 »

gigglesupstairs wrote: post #261
the_mitsuhiko wrote: post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It could. XD is dead but maybe this might inspire Adobe to revive it.

They will be forced to now, isn't it? I am sure they wouldn't want to start from scratch. But have to admit, XD was nothing as compared to Figma right now.

XD never took off. If Adobe wants to get into the UI market they would need to go back to the drawing board and start from scratch. If you're starting with a failed product you're most likely going to fail again.

Re: Figma and Adobe abandon proposed merger

#376

Post by whywhywhywhy »

cantSpellSober wrote: post #205
madeofpalk wrote: post #6

Excellent news. I think there should be more products, more companies, and more competition. Adobe just buying up it's competition will only ever directly hurt consumers. See also, "Adobe says the FTC is looking into its subscription cancellation practices." https://www.theverge.com/2023/12/15/24003532/adobe-says-the-...

What Adobe product is intended to compete with Figma, Adobe XD?

I'd bet they're hoping to just have an AI alternative by 2025

Re: Figma and Adobe abandon proposed merger

#377

Post by [deleted] »

JadoJodo wrote: post #218

While I do see this as great news (for all the reasons others have outlined), I wonder how this will impact VC in the future; If the current goal is for companies to get VC money, burn that cash for years and years and years, and then have a huge IPO or acquisition (that makes it all worth it), it would seem regulatory issues would start to scare away investment.

[deleted]

Re: Figma and Adobe abandon proposed merger

#378

Post by kozikow »

jen20 wrote: post #198
kozikow wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's also always a private equity market that is often a middle ground between IPO and acquisition. And in my feeling, I've seen PE getting more active in tech last year (maybe just because valuations went down).

PE universally has the worst possible outcomes for all sides of a deal besides the PE firm themselves.

Just because the acquired company falls into the "can't justify higher rev multiple thanks to synergies with the acquiring company" and "not successful enough for the IPO".

If there was no options in that niche, the market objectively would be a lot tougher.

Re: Figma and Adobe abandon proposed merger

#379

Post by notnullorvoid »

Invictus0 wrote: post #345
samhuk wrote: post #292

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Force startups to aspire to create an actual product rather I'm getting on to 10 years in the software industry as an engineer at the moment and in my view this is one of its most disappointing and frustrating aspects. The whole software start-up scene just feels saturated with FIRE-obsessed individuals who prefer just about anything (money, vacation, travel, fame, ...) over company, product, real building, craftsm…

[flagged]

> Software engineers are mercenaries hired to create value for shareholders, and anything else is just delusion.

Value is a sustainable product, not some shovelware piece of crap. If the shareholders don't see that then that's their problem, and it's probably best to part ways and warn everyone you know from working with them.

Re: Figma and Adobe abandon proposed merger

#380

Post by jb1991 »

i_am_jl wrote: post #349
_fat_santa wrote: post #301

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When your business has to depend on subscription engineering like this, it means the underlying product is not good enough to stand on it's own feet.

That's the worst part, the products are great. $20/month is reasonable for PS/LR considering that yearly releases were retailing for $500+ in the CS6 era. Cloud storage and generative AI credits are rolled into those costs. New features are showing up again. Regarding Photoshop, there are no real alternatives. It's not that Adobe's depending on subscription engineering, it's creative pros 100% dependent on Adobe prod…

> Regarding Photoshop, there are no real alternatives.

Unfortunately, the same is true for Illustrator. There are competitors that have 95% of the features, but that remaining 5% is critical for serious professionals.

Post reply on HN