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Amazon doesn't 'employ' drivers, but hired firms to prevent them from unionizing

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Re: Amazon doesn't 'employ' drivers, but hired firms to prevent them from unionizing

#371

Post by up2isomorphism »

bfeynman wrote: post #2

This behavior of legal loopholes to discount workers should be made illegal. The definition of sub-contractor has got to change and/or have laws/policies in place that actually make sense in a sub contractor relationship. These are shell companies that spin up and exclusively deliver for amazon, they aren't gig workers delivering when they want, they have strict quotas.

Just buy from the physical store. Otherwise at the end of day you will choose a online retailer that successfully prevents unionization because it is more efficient and cheaper.

Re: Amazon doesn't 'employ' drivers, but hired firms to prevent them from unionizing

#372

Post by ffhhttt »

sharts wrote: post #367
bravura wrote: post #320

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is an interesting point. And perhaps worse yet, high quality doctors will have the freedom to move out of your state. I'm an American living and Germany and sadly, my GP who is also a personal friend of mine, will be shutting down their practice at the end of the year because their small practice simply isn't financially sustainable. They will instead start treating the prison population, which apparently pays m…

Prices could probably drop if the market was saturated with doctors. And the best way to do that would be eliminating medical-school debt.

I thought the limited number of residencies was the real bottleneck?

Re: Amazon doesn't 'employ' drivers, but hired firms to prevent them from unionizing

#373

Post by ffhhttt »

vkou wrote: post #285
geodel wrote: post #261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> in the top few percent for income in the US, and live in California (one of the highest tax states), and I happily pay them. Well, thats not surprising but at same time not default for most people. Universities have been leaning left since at least 60's and 70's . If all the people who attended university remained influenced by those ideas over the years. Most of the people with higher income and influential positi…

Education is incredibly strongly correlated with not voting republican.

In 2016 the split between college educated voters was 49-45 and the majority of white college graduates voted for Trump.

Some college educated white voters shifted to the Democrats in 2020 so the gap was a bit wider so I wouldn’t say “incredibly” unless you think 3% is incredible..

It’s a different matter for postgraduates though (62-37% in 2020)

Re: Amazon doesn't 'employ' drivers, but hired firms to prevent them from unionizing

#374

Post by ffhhttt »

finite_depth wrote: post #297
vkou wrote: post #285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Education is incredibly strongly correlated with not voting republican.

Although at this point that might be more class/intelligence signalling than any principled belief in social welfare. You don't have to support the poor to realize that it's a bad idea to support a mad death cult full of people who are toxic to your career.

White college graduates are almost evenly split between the parties..

Re: Amazon doesn't 'employ' drivers, but hired firms to prevent them from unionizing

#375

Post by ffhhttt »

finite_depth wrote: post #329
pessimizer wrote: post #321

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a religious belief, not an observation. Discounting all allegations of shenanigans, 45% of the Democratic Party primary voters supported him in 2016, and probably around or not much less than that in 2020. The man consistently polls as extremely popular (although that popularity took a hit after 2020), and is as old as dirt, along with a huge number of his voters. Your views of the situation disregard your ob…

I am a very dedicated Sanders supporter, and to say he "was nearly President" in 2016 is just not true. Yes, by the end of the primary he'd gained a lot of steam, but that was the end of the primary. Sanders was in a pretty hopeless situation delegate-wise by Super Tuesday, and only briefly polled within even ten points of Clinton. He was closer in 2020. But in 2020, Democratic primary voters got a very simple choice…

Clinton won 2016 in large part because of her overwhelming majorities in deeply red states which wasn’t that helpful during the elections.

Also because the Democratic primaries were objectively and transparently rigged.

IIRC wasn’t Sanders polling better against Trump than Clinton? Then again most conceivable candidates probably would have…

Re: Amazon doesn't 'employ' drivers, but hired firms to prevent them from unionizing

#376

Post by ffhhttt »

scoofy wrote: post #279
unyttigfjelltol wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The solution is to enforce the laws we have, not feign powerlessness every time some crackerjack claims to have identified a profitable loophole.

I think the real issue is the political problem that most people like the exploitation that is happening. When ride-sharing laws were changed in California to protect hired drivers, the counter ballot initiative passed easily.

Or maybe because proposition didn’t made a whole lot of sense and wouldn’t have improved the situation that drivers that much on average.

Re: Amazon doesn't 'employ' drivers, but hired firms to prevent them from unionizing

#377

Post by [deleted] »

Ekaros wrote: post #252
seanmcdirmid wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The real fix is to just stop tying benefit requirements to who the employer is and what the employee's full time status is. A lot of these problems go away with just universal healthcare, and providing benefits beyond pay via society rather than via companies.

Why not mandate things like healthcare no matter how many hours someone is employed. It might hurt some, but if these companies can not survive without workers, they will hire full time. And if they can not afford they don't deserve to exist.

[deleted]

Re: Amazon doesn't 'employ' drivers, but hired firms to prevent them from unionizing

#378

Post by bravura »

sharts wrote: post #367
bravura wrote: post #320

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is an interesting point. And perhaps worse yet, high quality doctors will have the freedom to move out of your state. I'm an American living and Germany and sadly, my GP who is also a personal friend of mine, will be shutting down their practice at the end of the year because their small practice simply isn't financially sustainable. They will instead start treating the prison population, which apparently pays m…

Prices could probably drop if the market was saturated with doctors. And the best way to do that would be eliminating medical-school debt.

I'm comparing to the best public healthcare system I'm personally familiar with (Germany) and saying:

* Medical-school debt is not a thing here. * Prices are low. * I know doctors who can't make a sustainable income to keep their small practices open.

Somewhat puzzlingly, for a handful of services, there can a medium length delay in getting an appointment because of how busy the doctors are.

This is definitely all much better than the situation is in Canada, where the typical person struggled even to get a GP, and friends with cancer would be forced to wait a life-imperiling year to get a routine scan that be the difference between life and death.

Re: Amazon doesn't 'employ' drivers, but hired firms to prevent them from unionizing

#379

Post by wildrhythms »

ROTMetro wrote: post #293
seanmcdirmid wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The real fix is to just stop tying benefit requirements to who the employer is and what the employee's full time status is. A lot of these problems go away with just universal healthcare, and providing benefits beyond pay via society rather than via companies.

We have socialized healthcare in the USA, we just deliver it at the emergency room, the worst possible place. The more we get people to realize that we already have this the more we can reduce the resistance to expanding it in a sane way. America 100% has socialized medicine. Go to the emergency room and you will be treated.

I went the ER, was treated, and was sent a bill that must get turned over to god knows who if I didn't pay it. They took an x-ray, a blood sample, sent me home, and I got billed $4,800.

Re: Amazon doesn't 'employ' drivers, but hired firms to prevent them from unionizing

#380

Post by wildrhythms »

up2isomorphism wrote: post #371
bfeynman wrote: post #2

This behavior of legal loopholes to discount workers should be made illegal. The definition of sub-contractor has got to change and/or have laws/policies in place that actually make sense in a sub contractor relationship. These are shell companies that spin up and exclusively deliver for amazon, they aren't gig workers delivering when they want, they have strict quotas.

Just buy from the physical store. Otherwise at the end of day you will choose a online retailer that successfully prevents unionization because it is more efficient and cheaper.

Workers are the physical store are also subject to these same issues. Consumer side activism doesn't work.
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