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Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

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Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#371

Post by narag »

prepend wrote: post #344
narag wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lots of comments that didn’t read the article... I didn't read it either... because I'd read a bunch of other articles and watched videos about the problem a couple of months ago. IMHO the root cause is that it's impossible with current legislation/courts practice to deter this kind of behaviour. Specifically: * Many of the perpetrators are minors * Stealing a car, depending on cirsumstances, is a misdemeanor * There…

Auto theft in Maryland is a felony. What are thieves being charged with that’s not a felony?

Sorry, it's been a couple of months and I can't remember the details. Is there a different threshold for minors? I don't know your legal system and maybe I "translated" what I was hearing with ours in mind. Or the article was about another state.

I do remember that the police officers were very clear that they can do nothing. Even if the arrest the kids, the DA won't prosecute them.

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#372

Post by Zpalmtree »

hoofhearted wrote: post #160
local_crmdgeon wrote: post #140

The City of Baltimore has repeatedly demonstrated that they will do anything besides try to change the behavior of the population. It's a failed city, and luckily the model is being exported to places like SF, LA, and DC. Why should we punish people who repeatedly commit crime anyway? Fuck it, why do anything? Let's sue Kia instead, maybe we can get a payday

It’s a little early to be drinking isn’t it? The city is suing to recover the money they spent on all the police efforts expended because Kia cut corners to reduce costs.

Do you think Kia's cut corners are causing a theft spree in Korea?

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#373

Post by forgetfreeman »

Convolutional wrote: post #185

I should point out to those not from the US that this is how Americans view the US. There is a lot of crime, the government and NGOs are on the side of the criminals etc. It is up voted to the top as well, with agreement in the replies, this is how Americans view the US. The US incarcerates more people than China, despite China having more than four times as many people, but the view obviously is the incarceration ra…

This is how who views America? You're grossly over-generalizing.

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#374

Post by giantg2 »

giantg2 wrote: post #111
aardvarkr wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here’s the link that I posted above with data showing the before and after. It’s quite stark just how big of a spike there has been in theft. https://usafacts.org/data-projects/car-thefts

Not exactly the data I was looking for. This is very niche and not from a more comprehensive level. However, the city level data seems to show that some cities are not seeing a higher spike, but others are. Without any real analysis, this seems to indicate that there are other factors at play than simply Kias being easier to steal.

Why are people disagreeing with this? If you run an experiment looking at a variable change and it doesn't change much in some places but changes a lot in others, then wouldn't this prove that there are other variables at play - that it couldn't possibly be that single variable itself?

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#375

Post by giantg2 »

jameshart wrote: post #200
giantg2 wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“The dramatically increased rate of Hyundai and Kia theft in Baltimore has required city and police resources that would not have been needed but for Hyundai and Kia’s deliberate failures,” I'd like to see the data here. Is there any indication that the crime wouldn't be present in other areas of life? Would the people committing these crimes be law-abiding citizens if not for the temptation of these cars being easie…

They might be committing other crimes, but at least they would not be speeding around in stolen Kias and Hyundais. That seems like a win. Easily stolen cars lead to nuisance behavior that affects far more than the immediate victim of the theft.

That depends. It's likely less of an issue if they know they can steal a car without confrontation than say car jacking or robbery, which carry a higher risk of people being hurt.

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#376

Post by anon84873628 »

ravensfan69 wrote: post #233
kevinthew wrote: post #226

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is data on the Kia/Hyundai problem that is unique to these makes because they cut corners on safety features that are standard across industry -- I don't know why your anecdote of people getting carjacked is relevant at all?

> "Theft and violence reigns supreme in a lawless urban wasteland" > "How are these anecdotes relevant?" This is a tremendous leap in logic, but I am suggesting that Baltimore's problems can and do exist wholly independently of the engineering standards of Korean automakers

Ok. I mean, we've all seen The Wire. But the problem with Kia and Hyundai is happening in other cities across the country, and is well documented on social media. There absolutely is something special about these particular makes, so discounting it just doesn't make sense.

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#377

Post by inconceivable »

lesuorac wrote: post #324
inconceivable wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

this is also seemingly the strategy for anti-gun manufacturer efforts. so far they don't seem to be successful.

Can you clarify? Afaik, lawsuits again gun manufacturers are actually successful [1]. [1]: https://apnews.com/article/sandy-hook-school-shooting-reming...

oh right, i forgot, the mass shootings stopped.

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#378

Post by taffronaut »

endisneigh wrote: post #56
taffronaut wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't follow the reasoning that inherently easily repairable cars are easily stolen. Cars have shipped for decades with steering and in some cases transmission locks. These required physical key and programmed fob to be present in order to start and drive. Security was down to the quality of the engineering of those components. I don't see how it hampered modification to or ability to repair the rest of the car.

you disagree that a car that's more reparable is more easily stolen? imagine a car with screws on the door to be swapped, and another car without them. you don't think the car with the screws would be easier to steal?

Yes I do. Your door screws are a bad example. My car door hinges are secured with bolts not accessible when the door is closed. I have given some examples of security features which don't impact repairability and you've ignored them.

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#379

Post by aksss »

MavisBacon wrote: post #338
aksss wrote: post #325

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would suggest that something rhymes in the how prosecutorial discretion and bail policies are implemented in each of these places, though my point isn’t to compare one city to the other aside from them all being examples of “one reaps what one sows” at a practical policy level.

Baltimore is one of the most entrenched cities in US on a number of levels. It’s kind of ridiculous you are comparing the hyperwoke follies of SF and Portland with the outright despair and corruption in Baltimore. We have not reaped what we have sown, we hardly have a shot

The longevity of a city's sad state doesn't seem to have any bearing on the dynamic of "bad policies delivering bad outcomes". I feel like this is the third time saying it so don't worry about a fourth, but the comparison was limited strictly to that equation.

The character of the bad outcomes certainly changes with longevity, such as entrenchment, as you mention. The fixes must also be different. I'm not disagreeing with you that these cities and their situations are entirely different.

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#380

Post by ttscar »

hardware2win wrote: post #6
alexb_ wrote: post #5

How is it Hyundai's fault that people steal cars? It's acting as if theives are some force of nature that we can't control or something. You prevent theft by putting theives in jail. It's not complicated.

Consider reading the article The concerns are valid >Certain Kia or Hyundai models can be stolen using a screwdriver and a USB charging cord. >Cleveland, St. Louis and Seattle are among the other cities that started suing the the car companies earlier this year. Baltimore’s lawsuit says the companies “failed to keep up with industry standards,” and claim it was a result of business decisions made to reduce costs and…

Then punish the thefts. I don't think you people have any common sense. So glad I'm not in the US.
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