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The AT protocol is the most obtuse crock of shit

urbanists.social

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Re: The AT protocol is the most obtuse crock of shit

#371

Post by s3p »

epicsponge wrote: post #64
pfraze wrote: post #54

Okay well. I work on Bluesky and helped build the AT Protocol. I'm sorry Sam differs with us on this, and I'm glad that Activity Pub is already there for him. However, Sam doesn't understand the ATProto very well and I want to clear it up a bit. Before I do, let me just say: Bluesky and the AT Proto are in beta. The stuff that seems incomplete or poorly documented is incomplete and poorly documented. Everything has m…

Hi, original author here. Some comments: > We sign the records so that authenticity can be determined without polling the home server, and we use a repository structure rather than signing individual records so that we can establish whether a record has been deleted (signature revocation). Why do you need an entirely separate protocol to do this? Email had this exact same problem, yet was able to build protocols on t…

> You're storing all of a user's post history on their own device in the case of an immediate outage. That's equivalent to Gmail storing all of your emails on your device in case you want to immediately pack up and move to another email provider.

In the world I currently live in, all my emails are stored locally on my devices. Also, text files take up little to no storage, so why does it matter?

Re: The AT protocol is the most obtuse crock of shit

#372

Post by thelonelygod »

pfraze wrote: post #54

Okay well. I work on Bluesky and helped build the AT Protocol. I'm sorry Sam differs with us on this, and I'm glad that Activity Pub is already there for him. However, Sam doesn't understand the ATProto very well and I want to clear it up a bit. Before I do, let me just say: Bluesky and the AT Proto are in beta. The stuff that seems incomplete or poorly documented is incomplete and poorly documented. Everything has m…

Not sure if you'll see this, but I work for an internal tooling startup and I'm trying to mess around with your API. Our tool has support for REST and python/js support with a limited set of libraries. I've been trying to figure out how to connect to the API via CURL so I can write some blogposts about building with y'all and I've been struggling.

I can get com.atproto.server.createSession to return me a token, but then when I try to transition into another endpoint (such as app.bsky.richtext.facet) I only get 404s. Is their any examples of using y'all with rest? Happy to take my question elsewhere if y'all have any places for folks to ask questions?

Re: The AT protocol is the most obtuse crock of shit

#373

Post by yamtaddle »

Spooky23 wrote: post #266
newswasboring wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My reaction whenever I see such headline is always "there must be an engineer out there who worked on this, I wonder how they feel about this". I had the same reaction today, opened comments and you were at the top. I love HN sometimes.

It must be great to wake up to some jerk shitting all over your work on the front page of HN. Fortunately not something ive had to experience!

Never doing anything of note pays off yet again!

(speaking for myself, not you, to be clear)

Re: The AT protocol is the most obtuse crock of shit

#374

Post by toddmorey »

pfraze wrote: post #54

Okay well. I work on Bluesky and helped build the AT Protocol. I'm sorry Sam differs with us on this, and I'm glad that Activity Pub is already there for him. However, Sam doesn't understand the ATProto very well and I want to clear it up a bit. Before I do, let me just say: Bluesky and the AT Proto are in beta. The stuff that seems incomplete or poorly documented is incomplete and poorly documented. Everything has m…

It's hard to remember sometimes every project is building both technology and community.

Technical merits of the different approaches aside... this is a calm, kind and well reasoned response to a rather, uh, emotional critique. Thanks for bringing the discourse back to where it should be.

Re: The AT protocol is the most obtuse crock of shit

#375

Post by JohnFen »

fatnoah wrote: post #300
sgtnoodle wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not having read the article, I got pretty far into your second paragraph before realizing you all aren't talking about configuring a modem over a serial link. It's funny because the "Hayes AT command set" protocol is also an obtuse crock. I was really hoping you were going to open my mind with some deep wisdom straight out of 1981.

I had the same reaction. It seemed really weird to get upset about such an old thing.

Nostalgic outrage is one of the more interesting forms of nostalgia.

Re: The AT protocol is the most obtuse crock of shit

#376

Post by JohnFen »

Spooky23 wrote: post #266
newswasboring wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My reaction whenever I see such headline is always "there must be an engineer out there who worked on this, I wonder how they feel about this". I had the same reaction today, opened comments and you were at the top. I love HN sometimes.

It must be great to wake up to some jerk shitting all over your work on the front page of HN. Fortunately not something ive had to experience!

While praise is best, I'd rather have my work be criticized than ignored. Nobody criticizes something that doesn't matter to them.

Re: The AT protocol is the most obtuse crock of shit

#378

Post by marumari »

lucideer wrote: post #338
vidarh wrote: post #322

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a great summary of what my concerns are as well. I'd maybe add one more point: * Improvements that'd layer cleanly on top of ActivityPub if they'd made any attempt at all. E.g. being able to "cheaply" ensure that you have a current view of all a given users objects is not covered in ActivityPub - you're expected to basically want to get the current state of one specific object, because most of the time that i…

Your added point fits in with the initial red flag for me - before I saw pfraze's (excellent) post here - that the vast majority of what I've read advocating for ATProto says very clearly: "Account portability is the major reason why we chose to build a separate protocol.". Account portability is in no way incompatible with ActivityPub. It's not built into the spec., but it's also not forbidden / prevented by the spe…

An unspecified "implementation detail" is essentially another way of saying that it doesn't work.

I've ported my account on ActivityPub a couple time, and it's a horrendous experience -- not only do I lose all my posts and have to manually move a ton of bits, but the server you port from continues to believe you have an account and doesn't like to show you direct links on there anymore.

The latter could probably be easily solved, the former needs to be built into the spec or it will continue to be broken.

Re: The AT protocol is the most obtuse crock of shit

#379

Post by sbarre »

thelonelygod wrote: post #372
pfraze wrote: post #54

Okay well. I work on Bluesky and helped build the AT Protocol. I'm sorry Sam differs with us on this, and I'm glad that Activity Pub is already there for him. However, Sam doesn't understand the ATProto very well and I want to clear it up a bit. Before I do, let me just say: Bluesky and the AT Proto are in beta. The stuff that seems incomplete or poorly documented is incomplete and poorly documented. Everything has m…

Not sure if you'll see this, but I work for an internal tooling startup and I'm trying to mess around with your API. Our tool has support for REST and python/js support with a limited set of libraries. I've been trying to figure out how to connect to the API via CURL so I can write some blogposts about building with y'all and I've been struggling. I can get com.atproto.server.createSession to return me a token, but t…

There's a Discord server for Bluesky/ATProto developers. I would try there.

https://discord.gg/3srmDsHSZJ

Re: The AT protocol is the most obtuse crock of shit

#380

Post by neilalexander »

Jolter wrote: post #272
pfraze wrote: post #54

Okay well. I work on Bluesky and helped build the AT Protocol. I'm sorry Sam differs with us on this, and I'm glad that Activity Pub is already there for him. However, Sam doesn't understand the ATProto very well and I want to clear it up a bit. Before I do, let me just say: Bluesky and the AT Proto are in beta. The stuff that seems incomplete or poorly documented is incomplete and poorly documented. Everything has m…

Please consider renaming your protocol to something that is possible to Google for.

It is literally the first result for "atproto", "at proto", "atprotocol" and "at protocol" on Google. How much more Google-able would you like it to be?
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