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Apple says iPhones will switch to USB-C chargers to comply with new EU law

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Re: Apple says iPhones will switch to USB-C chargers to comply with new EU law

#371

Post by neuralRiot »

danpalmer wrote: post #19

It's sad that it took legislation to make this happen, but I can see why. I worked in a pseudo-Apple-store during the height of the 30-pin dock connector and I sold so many cases, speaker docks, charging cables, and all sorts of weird accessories that were built for the 30-pin connector. Then Apple switched to Lightning. It was better in every. single. way. And yet people got burnt. There was so much hardware that wa…

> t's sad that it took legislation to make this happen

Every time this topic comes up i still don’t understand what problem is this legislation supposed to solve. We’re not talking about infrastructure standarization like a gas pump, an electrical outlet or a lightbulb (which has hundreds of standards BTW) but a simple cable. Are we making laws just to accommodate consumer’s convenience now?

Re: Apple says iPhones will switch to USB-C chargers to comply with new EU law

#372

Post by stouset »

danpalmer wrote: post #90
dagmx wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Something I found interesting when discussing this with my wife.. All my friends are tech heads and champing at the bit to have usb-c in their iPhones. But when she asked me why people were mad about the switch to usb-c it took me by surprise. Then she showed me a lot of online responses from non technical people who see the change of port as annoying and wasteful because now all their stuff won’t work without adapte…

Absolutely. USB-C appeals to techies, people with an engineering mindset, because it's an elegant solution. It's one connector, with graceful handling of different use-cases from charging, through peripherals, to high-speed high throughput data transfer. But practically speaking, I've bought several HDMI adapters, had a hard time choosing a mouse that had USB-C a few years ago, have bought a new charger, lost MagSafe…

It's not even an elegant solution.

Having one port profile front for multiple technologies (USB, USB-PD, DisplayPort, Thunderbolt), and multiple versions of those technologies, with the cables being random able/unable to support any particular matrix of them, has been a usability nightmare.

Also on a purely functional level the actually-a-male design of the Lightning plug has made it—in my opinion—a far superior physical plug than the looks-male-but-is-female-in-disguise design of the USB-C plug.

Re: Apple says iPhones will switch to USB-C chargers to comply with new EU law

#373

Post by hot_gril »

scarface74 wrote: post #369
hot_gril wrote: post #352

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You care when it stops working one day because Apple changed something (maybe intentionally). Out of a combination of spite and cheapness, I've only ever bought unlicensed cables for several years, and this is the price I've paid over time.

So how well are the USB C cables going to work that follow the minimum “mandate” that doesn’t require cables to support data at all? How well are they going to work when people pick up a “USB C” cable and wonder why they aren’t seeing video when they connect their phone to their TV?

Not very well, but you can buy decent cables from a variety of manufacturers for cheap, and there isn't this one license-holder (Apple) out there trying to take a big cut from that. If someone wants to make a good Lightning cable for cheap, first they have to break the law by skipping the licensing deal, then they have to get around Apple's own mechanisms.

Re: Apple says iPhones will switch to USB-C chargers to comply with new EU law

#375

Post by scarface74 »

hot_gril wrote: post #373
scarface74 wrote: post #369

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So how well are the USB C cables going to work that follow the minimum “mandate” that doesn’t require cables to support data at all? How well are they going to work when people pick up a “USB C” cable and wonder why they aren’t seeing video when they connect their phone to their TV?

Not very well, but you can buy decent cables from a variety of manufacturers for cheap, and there isn't this one license-holder (Apple) out there trying to take a big cut from that. If someone wants to make a good Lightning cable for cheap, first they have to break the law by skipping the licensing deal, then they have to get around Apple's own mechanisms.

It doesn’t prevent “ewaste” if phone makers (mostly low end Android phone makers) still bundle shoddy cables, stores are still allowed to sell shoddy cables, etc.

And USB C is not free of licensing requirements

https://electronics.stackexchange.com/questions/450494/are-u...

A “good” USB C cable that supports all of the things I said - high speed data, video over USB, etc - costs around $15. The same price as an Anker Lightning cable.

A random USB C cable doesn’t support video over USB - something I need for my portable secondary display.

The iPads with USB C already support this. I have no reason to believe that the next iPhone won’t.

Re: Apple says iPhones will switch to USB-C chargers to comply with new EU law

#376

Post by Ferrotin »

scarface74 wrote: post #108
falcolas wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sorry, but I don't see how we can lay the blame for corporations cutting corners on completely unrelated legislation. I get that there can be unintended consequences with passed legislation, but these seem too disconnected to be relevant. As in, there have been substandard USB-C cables since USB-C first came out. The existence of those cables can't be laid at the feet of requiring Apple to use USB-C on the one re…

> I'm sorry, but I don't see how we can lay the blame for corporations cutting corners on completely unrelated legislation. You mean the same legislation that can enforce USB C can’t enforce a minimum standard for USB C: - must support USB 3 speeds - must support video over USB and a certain minimum standard (this is a standard) - etc?

You’re already free to buy a phone with those features, without worrying about extra chargers.

Re: Apple says iPhones will switch to USB-C chargers to comply with new EU law

#377

Post by lesuorac »

crazygringo wrote: post #183
djvdq wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was thinking the same about both connectors. And then I bought an iPhone. I never broke a USB-C connector nor socket in few years of heavy usage on few devices, but I needed to buy new lightning cable because the pins have worn out after less than a year of just connecting the cable to iphone.

That's extremely unusual -- I've used Lightning cables daily for years without any issue at all. Whenever I would notice a cable not working (after about a year and a half), the culprit was always dust buildup inside the Lightning port preventing the plug from entering fully. Clean it out with a toothpick for 15 seconds, and then good as new. If you were using an original Apple cable, that's bizarrely bad luck. I can…

I think a lot of it is how they use the cable.

My mother goes through cable like candy. I'll buy a pack of 10 and give her 8 and I won't even be done with my cables by the time they stop working.

Re: Apple says iPhones will switch to USB-C chargers to comply with new EU law

#378

Post by least »

stefan_ wrote: post #337
lrvick wrote: post #96

As someone that deeply detests Apple and would never give them money, I will admit the lightning connector is superior in durability, inspectability, and safety than USB type C in virtually every way. The real crime here is that Apple insisted on patenting the design and keeping it for only themselves, forcing the rest of the industry to adopt an inferior connector and ultimately force it on them too. Classic Apple.

It's also forever limited to USB2 speeds, state of the art year 2000, and can't do half the things that USB-C does. Of course that's easier to make, but don't worry, the patents notwithstanding, nobody wanted it anyway.

One can lament the inability to adopt and develop a superior connector without disagreeing that USB-C is the future. I think USB-C is better but it's not because the physical connector is good. It's worse in every way. It's also worth noting that there was a usb3 lightning connector in the 2nd generation iPads Pro.

Re: Apple says iPhones will switch to USB-C chargers to comply with new EU law

#379

Post by lesuorac »

nvahalik wrote: post #219

> Joswiak also claimed that the proprietary Lightning cable and the USB-C cable would not exist if Apple had agreed to the EU original demand of using the older Micro USB charging cable which had poor reliability and could easily be damaged. So... what happens when USB-C no longer makes sense anymore? Will they have to keep using it no matter what? Wait for the law to change?

Eh, that's the wrong take about the guys statement.

The actual take should've been [Citation Needed].

Re: Apple says iPhones will switch to USB-C chargers to comply with new EU law

#380

Post by jlokier »

djvdq wrote: post #127
lrvick wrote: post #96

As someone that deeply detests Apple and would never give them money, I will admit the lightning connector is superior in durability, inspectability, and safety than USB type C in virtually every way. The real crime here is that Apple insisted on patenting the design and keeping it for only themselves, forcing the rest of the industry to adopt an inferior connector and ultimately force it on them too. Classic Apple.

I was thinking the same about both connectors. And then I bought an iPhone. I never broke a USB-C connector nor socket in few years of heavy usage on few devices, but I needed to buy new lightning cable because the pins have worn out after less than a year of just connecting the cable to iphone.

I have two broken USB-C cables next to me. They just wore out and broke. They have only been used to charge my phone. To be fair, it's not the metal connector which broke, it's the plastic parts, but still, that's enough to make the connector flimsy.

I also have a phone with a broken USB-C port (data signals don't get through). This phone was effectively bricked when the display stopped working. It still has files on it I'd like to read, but I can't read them because the USB-C data on it isn't working to use remote debugging, and also means the HDMI out feature doesn't work.

I have another phone where the USB-C port works but its charging is intermittent, probably because it isn't making a reliable connection. Probably due to matter accumulated in the port, as the connection does feel slightly less solid than it should be, but it's a pain to clean it out. A toothpick is slightly too large. I've tried various methods of cleaning it out but the problem persists, and I wonder if it's really matter in there, or if something is wrong with the metal parts inside.

These are just my anecdotes, and I don't have anything that uses Lightning to compare with. But I have read claims that USB-C is a very robust, long-life connector, and my experience doesn't give me as much confidence in it as those claims suggest.

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