Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Illegal host, electric shocks, slugs, leaks and no support – How Airbnb failed

medium.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

371–380 of 427 posts

Re: Illegal host, electric shocks, slugs, leaks and no support – How Airbnb failed

#371

Post by steveBK123 »

smachiz wrote: post #363
stickfigure wrote: post #262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's unreasonable to expect AirBNB to enforce your HOA rules. That's a private contract between you and your neighbors.

I'm not sure that's true... 99% of dwellings in, say, NYC are Condos, Coops or Rentals - and all buildings have management agents (or acting as your own as an individual for a building) on file with the NYC Department of Buildings. Requiring a letter explicitly allowing a listing from the managing agent on record prior to publishing the listing wouldn't be particularly onerous. Of course their listings would drop dra…

Agreed. Exactly my point.

These tech platform marketplaces are willing to do lots of AI/ML hocus-pocus & throw bodies at things like targeted ads, onboarding new suppliers (drivers/landlords), whatever helps their KPIs, etc.. but not on following the law/rules. That is because it would reduce sales, knowing that they are implicitly allowing illegalities on their market places.

Re: Illegal host, electric shocks, slugs, leaks and no support – How Airbnb failed

#372

Post by dbttdft »

hidelooktropic wrote: post #12

When I alerted AirBNB about a safety issue, they responded that they had completed their investigation (which apparently did not involve talking to me) and said the hosts were "elite" and basically took their side. AirBNB is not safe. https://www.businessinsider.com/airbnb-faces-thousands-sexua... https://feeneylawfirm.com/airbnb-spends-millions-to-keep-sex...

Nothing written here makes me feel unsafe about taking my daughter and wife to an Air BNB. Just what on earth is this non-sequitur, "ergo company unsafe" [10 billion upvotes]. There is nothing here even explaining how this is any worse than hotels. Yes, sleeping in some random person's house is inherently less safe than hotels (slightly) but we already knew that. So then what actual tangible point am I missing here? What do you even expect the company to do about it? This entire post and its context just seems like a Simpsons episode where Homer yells at the mayor and demands that it stop raining. I haven't have and don't plan to ever use Air BNB, by the way.

Re: Illegal host, electric shocks, slugs, leaks and no support – How Airbnb failed

#373

Post by omgomgomgomg »

Nextgrid wrote: post #236
omgomgomgomg wrote: post #126

Oh my, oh my, how the tune has changed on hn and social media on this and uber. Whereever people sense they can make a buck or save a buck, laws amd regulations be damned. I have never swayed an inch off my view. I knew first hand how this affects housing prices and wear, I live in a severly affected area and pay the price for it, literally. Same for uber. Neither is cheaper than the previous thing, hotel offers bett…

> Whereever people sense they can make a buck or save a buck, laws amd regulations be damned. A lot of us would like lower prices as long as nobody is negatively affected. Laws and regulations aren't automatically just by design because they're laws, sometimes they're outdated or the result of lobbying/regulatory capture. There's a lot wrong with Uber such as how they treat their drivers/customers, etc, but I doubt m…

I agree there are laws that need reviews, ammendments and I would even go as far and say it is not my laws, we are all born into the system and have to suck them up.

However, here nothing has been disrupted, rhe meddalions are stronger than ever in Europe. So all the little savings here by using uber will cost more in the long term now that the taxi cartell has been reinforced. Same for hotels.

At least taxi drivers know safety protocols, same for hotels.

So the fallout goes beyond of what people think.

If this stuff comes at the cost of pretend customer service or exploitation of work forces or customers, the regulatory hammer should be, swift and heavy hitting.

We are far from this as a society, the exploiters can use their ill gotten funds to pay for legal defense. The bit of damage done to society and people finds no representation. Try ripping of a bank or take from the rich and your life will be disrupted before you can do a ten count.

Re: Illegal host, electric shocks, slugs, leaks and no support – How Airbnb failed

#374

Post by aliqot »

therealdrag0 wrote: post #367
aliqot wrote: post #354

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can give me an 80% product, and I won't be impressed. You can give me that same 80% product, but consistently, and I'll be your best customer. AirBNB can be great, but wow they can be very bad, and at the end of the day I'm too old for that type of shit. Holiday Inn Express might have beds fit for a Baggins, but everything down to the fold of the sheets and the pen/notepad is the same every time, and I cansure ap…

Were your airbnbs at the same price point as a hotel? There can be a big difference between a 60$ and 120$ Airbnb.

I'd estimate the AirBnB post-fees was roughly 40% higher than HIE post-checkout. I chose to stay there because it was a great location, and like the idea of paying a person rather than a corp. For the record, this was a metro area, there was ample access and selection for corporate alternatives, if anything was not to my liking I'm sure I could have gone somewhere else easily.

Nice people, but just not what everyone might have in mind as far as accommodations go. Or maybe it is, who knows.

Re: Illegal host, electric shocks, slugs, leaks and no support – How Airbnb failed

#375

Post by mcculley »

Spooky23 wrote: post #172
mcculley wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It started as being intended for VC, right? I remember YC being an investor and Paul Graham saying great things about the founders. Certainly they must have been counting on growth. Did they plan to just capture every airbed? Or to do to hotels what Uber did to taxis (both good and bad)?

I don’t know. In the absence of specific details, I try to be generous in my assessment of founders. I imagine that it could have pivoted in many directions. That’s really the tragedy of AirBnb. It seems like a platform that could have been more.

I am not asking about the founders. I agree we should be generous when considering their experience. I am asking about the investors. They put money in at some estimation of total addressable market.

Re: Illegal host, electric shocks, slugs, leaks and no support – How Airbnb failed

#376

Post by omgomgomgomg »

jfzoid wrote: post #178
omgomgomgomg wrote: post #126

Oh my, oh my, how the tune has changed on hn and social media on this and uber. Whereever people sense they can make a buck or save a buck, laws amd regulations be damned. I have never swayed an inch off my view. I knew first hand how this affects housing prices and wear, I live in a severly affected area and pay the price for it, literally. Same for uber. Neither is cheaper than the previous thing, hotel offers bett…

> Just because some tech bros with sexist issues can make an app and a service without customer service does not mean jack shit. this is an ad hominem attack and not helpful -- Kalanick's personal problems are separate from Uber's product and services

It was not just him, it was on a wide scale, he was dismissed because it all hapoenednon his watch, unless I am grossly mistaken.Guy is not fit to run a business, if he is not in jail for breaching laws with his products, then somebody should be sent to the slammer for sexaul assault, wouldnt you agree this is crossing the last and final taboos in society and law? Sexual misconduct is punishable by prison in the us. I opine that this is morally worse than running a brothel, the women do not sign up for the sex part and the salary is worse than a strippers. If these men are desperate for sex, they should be looking for it elsewhere.

Top management of banks and such at least have the courtesy to simply pay for an escort not associated in any way with the business. Most of them even simply live a solid family life. You will be hard pressed to find such misconduct in the classic instututions.

Re: Illegal host, electric shocks, slugs, leaks and no support – How Airbnb failed

#377

Post by omgomgomgomg »

gverrilla wrote: post #182
omgomgomgomg wrote: post #126

Oh my, oh my, how the tune has changed on hn and social media on this and uber. Whereever people sense they can make a buck or save a buck, laws amd regulations be damned. I have never swayed an inch off my view. I knew first hand how this affects housing prices and wear, I live in a severly affected area and pay the price for it, literally. Same for uber. Neither is cheaper than the previous thing, hotel offers bett…

In my own regional experience (southwest brazil) both uber and airbnb's are cheaper than taxis/hotels. As they say "price is king".

Sure thing, used to be like that in Europe, too, give it some time, they will come around.

Price is king is a relative palavra, if it were unconditionally true, then squatting and car theft would be the ultimate solutions.

I know, these are not very legal, but the same can be said for uber and airbnb, they carefully select to be just as illegal as they can before having to deal with some serious consequences.

They are not pure anarchist disruptors, they are calculating cowards and they calculated to waste investors money from the get go.

If history shows anything, the first and dominating self driving taxi fleet will not be teslas or ubers.

They have announced their visions harder than they are working on a solution, esp ueber.

Re: Illegal host, electric shocks, slugs, leaks and no support – How Airbnb failed

#378

Post by denton-scratch »

Dylan16807 wrote: post #331
denton-scratch wrote: post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's reasonable for AirBnB to verify that their hosts are in compliance with the law. I am a landlord: I let a single house, to a family. New regulations came in on 1st September, requiring the property to be registered. I already had a valid gas safety certificate, expiring in 2 months, and an electrical safety certificate good for two more years. Registration also required an energy performance certificate, which I…

> local regs ban holiday lets in homes that are suitable for residential use. Is that the same as banning holiday lets in homes entirely? What does a house or proper apartment that's not suitable for residential use look like?

This is a University town. It's stuffed with student accomodation, a.k.a. "homes in multiple occupation".

Yes, I think it's roughly like what you said: the Council doesn't want holiday homes in this town. Housing is expensive here, because in addition to two universites, it has a cluster of big hospitals. But we still need inexpensive housing for the multitude of low-paid wokers those institutions require.

Tourists are a boon for some places, but this town would work better with less tourists (few of the tourists buy anything, and most of them don't stay overnight anyway - they just want a selfie in front of an old building).

[Edit] Not exactly; an old-fashioned couch-surfing isn't ruled out. Nor is am apartment let for less than 90 days a year. But anything that could be an attempt to get around student-housing regulations is probably banned, because that's heavily regulated.

Re: Illegal host, electric shocks, slugs, leaks and no support – How Airbnb failed

#379

Post by omgomgomgomg »

SapporoChris wrote: post #189
omgomgomgomg wrote: post #126

Oh my, oh my, how the tune has changed on hn and social media on this and uber. Whereever people sense they can make a buck or save a buck, laws amd regulations be damned. I have never swayed an inch off my view. I knew first hand how this affects housing prices and wear, I live in a severly affected area and pay the price for it, literally. Same for uber. Neither is cheaper than the previous thing, hotel offers bett…

>>"uber is literally outlawed in half of europe." Uber is banned or partially banned in UK, Bulgaria, Czech Republic, Denmark, France, Germany, Hungary, and Italy. Eight countries out of forty-four of the European countries.

Perhaps I should have said EU. Or market.

Either way, outside of madrid, you will have a hard time to find an uber in Spain, which is a complicated country.

Let us do the math. EU has 450 million people, Europe has 740, give or take.

Deduct the Russian market from that, they are out over there.

It was banned then unbanned in places, fe Turkey.

In switzerland, the owe 150million in taxes, not clean solution, is it. In other words, it is worth it to them to operate there having to pay that restrospectivelly, I dare you, try to steal 150m from the Swiss and see how that goes.

Your list leaves plenty to be desired, it does not contain Greece and the Netherlands and Finland, and Belgium.

So 740 m minus

RU has 140m population, of which 100 to 110 m live in the european part.

660m left

Minus Germany and Uk, this leaves us with

510 million, by now, we have excluded almost the entire us population and the countries with most purchasing power for sure.

France, italy and lets say half spain is Nother 130m, leaving us with 380m.

This is half of whole Europe and half of the european union and we are not through yet.

Next most populated country would be ukraine, I would say legal or not, their serives are currently disrupted there by ongoing events.

In other words, europes best economies do not wanna hear about uber and there was no popular uprising about it.

They should take the hint and stay away.

Theybare venditor non grata, that is a horrible business result after a decade of operations.

Re: Illegal host, electric shocks, slugs, leaks and no support – How Airbnb failed

#380

Post by jamiegreen »

wcarron wrote: post #343
jamiegreen wrote: post #269

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>You mean a hotel? Hotels are not inadequate for longer stays. If someone desires the comforts of a home, they can move there and actually rent/buy a home. What about a middle ground. If I go somewhere for 2-4 weeks? For that length of time I kind of want a proper kitchen, which I won't get in a hotel, but obviously it is not long enough to actually rent/buy a home.

This is exactly the entitlement I am speaking of. You want to go somewhere for an extended period. You want a proper kitchen. Your expectation is that the residents of a town or TheMarket should just... accomodate your desires? Regardless of their housing market, QoL, infrastructure, etc.? Sheesh, jamie. I typically eschew using this term, but someone taking a 2-4 week vacation is already highly privileged to be able…

So much judgement in one post.

1. I am not saying the market/residents have to accommodate anything, I am simply stating my preference that if I have to travel for 5+ days I would rather have a full kitchen. If the residents don’t want to provide it, fine. If many other people feel as I do, then that’s kind of what markets are for.

2. I don’t typically take 2-4 week vacations, but I sometimes do travel for work for extended periods.

I recognise being able to travel at all is a privilege but having a personal preference for a full kitchen I don’t really think warrants such a judgemental response.

Post reply on HN