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What does “shitty job” mean in the low-skill, low-pay world?

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Re: What does “shitty job” mean in the low-skill, low-pay world?

#371

Post by baybal2 »

selimthegrim wrote: post #173
baybal2 wrote: post #3

For the interest of HN reader demographics: The salary of experienced assembly line worker in South China has passed that of USA's central states few years ago, just before the CoVID. For places like Bangladesh, Vietnam, and Pakistan, working in a factory is quite a dream job, and a ticket to the middle class living. People who poo on "sweatshops" in Asia hardly realise that these sweatshops are better than 90% of al…

Can someone explain to me and maybe to great industrialist Shahbaz Sharif how Pak is supposed to compete with those two countries with a 20% lower literacy rate in comparison?

No post body was provided.

Re: What does “shitty job” mean in the low-skill, low-pay world?

#372

Post by [deleted] »

bluetomcat wrote: post #207
alexfromapex wrote: post #31

I think this article starts to touch on a topic area I don't hear much about but am extremely frustrated by: how modern work for a lot of jobs has become de facto indentured servitude. In the "When They Know They've Got You" section, they mention the real challenges of not being able to obtain a lawyer if things truly aren't fair. The average worker can't afford anything without taking on debt. Insurance is a scam in…

Let me give you a concrete non-US, Eastern European (Bulgarian) perspective on the scale of financial and career “shitness” that the majority of individuals, and even a sizable portion of the well-educated go through. From my privileged position as a remotely working software engineer for a western company who resides in a middle-sized town, I am able to observe the daily hurdles and fears of my friends and relatives…

[deleted]

Re: What does “shitty job” mean in the low-skill, low-pay world?

#373

Post by lazide »

pempem wrote: post #369
lazide wrote: post #244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uh no. The American Dream has been about the ability to work hard to better oneself, and work UP TO that after education or doing something unique (like making their own business work and be profitable). Not that anyone could move here and just get it everything by doing the minimum.

What is the 'minimum' when every single corporation is working to de-skill jobs so that they can cut wages, limit onboarding etc. We all work on or adjacent to embedded software for robots to replace people in these jobs so that they can go on to be 'free' to have a higher skill job doing....no one ever seems to know what. Except maintaining said robots.

It's literally always been that way. Every business tries to cut costs, or they become unprofitable. Every organization tries to mechanize/create repetitive process where they can to minimize the amount of skilled workers they need as part of it. Every organization tries to skrimp where it can.

I literally never worked for a company with an onboarding or training process until I got to a FAANG. At that point I had been in industry full time for ~ 13 years, and worked at everything from startups to established 200+ employee companies.

Everyone has been worried about 'automation' nuking the jobs since I was born, and outsourcing killing all industry too. First it was Japan that was going to own the world though. Then Outsourcing to India. Then China. And they had impacts. But somehow, everyone who is useful keeps working, and everyone actually seems better off. Hell, the 'maintain the robots as the only jobs left' was a 90's thing with worries about car manufacturing automation.

Back then, a lot of jobs were things like secretaries, gophers (task runners)/delivery workers, retail shopping workers, postal workers, etc. Now people use email and write their own documents, uber or ubereats what they want, have things shipped to their door. Quality of life is dramatically higher in every objective way I can see.

And if anything, there are waaaaay more jobs now, and people seem to be doing better everywhere. But they seem to hate everything and everyone way more, and FEEL poorer.

Re: What does “shitty job” mean in the low-skill, low-pay world?

#374

Post by dazc »

ryan93 wrote: post #318
dazc wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Pediatric oncology. ... Or criminal defense attorneys/prosecutors. Not detracting from the point but, in either case, this person is not going to be on the breadline as a consequence of quitting his/her job. They will get a similalrly high paying and high prestige job the next day.

What high paying jobs do doctors get that aren in medicine?

An oncolgy specialist can get many jobs as a doctor, although not as a specialist as such.

Outside of being an actual doctor, many more than a recently unemployed warehouse worker.

Re: What does “shitty job” mean in the low-skill, low-pay world?

#375

Post by Avshalom »

ceeplusplus wrote: post #342
Avshalom wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then you graduate again in december of 2019 and you lose another 2 years to whims of fate.

Don't get a degree in the arts then? What other industry needs a master's degree and a project portfolio to become unemployed or making $40k in an expensive city?

I mean my degrees are physics w/math-minor and geology

Re: What does “shitty job” mean in the low-skill, low-pay world?

#376

Post by Jcowell »

ceeplusplus wrote: post #342
Avshalom wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then you graduate again in december of 2019 and you lose another 2 years to whims of fate.

Don't get a degree in the arts then? What other industry needs a master's degree and a project portfolio to become unemployed or making $40k in an expensive city?

In December of 2019 it would be hard for everyone since COVID would ramp up, business shut down, and hiring freezes were in affect. It didn’t matter the degree you had.

Re: What does “shitty job” mean in the low-skill, low-pay world?

#377

Post by crate_barre »

oh_sigh wrote: post #299
standardUser wrote: post #295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Spending $2,500 on rent is insane" That's not normal, but it is simply what it costs to live in NYC or SF or London. I know tons of people who pay north of $2,500/month for decent (not fancy) apartments in central neighborhoods of those cities. And $3-$4k/month is very common for a single person.

Yes, and I would bet that those people you know paying $2500/mo are not earning $15/hr. And no, it is not simply what it costs to live in NYC, unless you think you absolutely must live in Manhattan below 96th st. This is like saying the cost of a car is $65,000, because the only car I accept is a BMW X5. Ok, if that is your standard, then yes a car will cost you $65k. But there are cars available for much cheaper, th…

Let me shock you by saying in some of these cities groups of people easily take out a 2500-3k rental. Either families or groups of workers.

Re: What does “shitty job” mean in the low-skill, low-pay world?

#378

Post by maxerickson »

lazide wrote: post #370
maxerickson wrote: post #339

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not uncommon in the US for parents to more or less kick their children out when they turn 18/graduate from high school. It's not the rule, and it's probably less common than it used to be. A few minutes later: "It's not uncommon" is going too far. It's certainly not unheard of.

I think you're misunderstanding my comment. Typically, folks move in with room mates. Or into communal living (like a dorm). Or in with a girl/boy friend. Or find a job near where they live (not try to live right next to a job). Or any one of many other situations which the poster seems to think are unacceptable, yet very common - and probably the best setup anyway, since it's not like they have any experience living…

My first comment was about the high cost of housing causing people with high paying jobs to take on roommates. Policy is a substantial factor in that outcome.

I took your comment as a reply to that topic, I guess I still don't understand what your point was in relation to that.

I also think we can take a look at what drives costs for less expensive housing. My small town is basically allergic to larger apartment buildings, I think probably because the people with control don't want them (vs any good reason). One project got cancelled with people talking, with straight faces, about the historic nature of a post war car dealership building. Another got refused because people were afraid of having low cost housing adjacent to a hypothetical business hotel (a business hotel proposed to be in the middle of a bunch of parking lots, it was ridiculous).

The second one there would have been conveniently located for people filling the low income jobs we are talking about!

Re: What does “shitty job” mean in the low-skill, low-pay world?

#379

Post by bluquark »

Rebelgecko wrote: post #286
dumpsterlid wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Or any law enforcement. Please don't equate healthcare workers with law enforcement. Healthcare workers have an astronomically harder job and actually make society a better place.

I think in terms of difficulty, law enforcement has much more skin in the game- both jobs have to deal with potential guilt from screwing up but if a surgeon misjudges a situation pretty much the worst outcome is that they get sued and in egregious cases lose their job. Whereas in law enforcement you're more likely to have adversarial interactions with armed people, drunk drivers, etc where your own life is in danger…

Prior to 2020, health work was probably safer, but since then over eighty thousand health workers have died of Covid worldwide: https://www.who.int/news/item/20-10-2021-health-and-care-wor...

If the world is unlucky enough to experience another pandemic someday, health workers will be expected to risk their lives once again during the period where no vaccines or good treatments exist.

Re: What does “shitty job” mean in the low-skill, low-pay world?

#380

Post by einherjae »

gruez wrote: post #352
seanmcdirmid wrote: post #312

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Europe, you could easily get that, except the car or driving part.

At half/third of the salary maybe.

Still better off if that third actually enabled living within driving distance of said job.
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