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YouTube suspends The Hill for playing clip of Trump denying election results

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Re: YouTube suspends The Hill for playing clip of Trump denying election results

#371

Post by bko »

vikingerik wrote: post #352
bko wrote: post #326

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You can even spin up your own sources and serve whatever you want,a right not afforded the average Chinese citizen. It's difficult when the backbone of the internet isn't available to you. For instance, AWS can be denied cutting off vital internet infrastructure we take for granted. Further payment processors like Visa can cut off access. Even banks could cut you off and even seize your funds if they got the direct…

And spinning your own service also fails once the upstream ISPs and DNS registrars also start banning you for wrongthink. That's coming too.

That's a good point. It just keeps moving upstream. I'm especially worried about the tie between big tech and the government. There's open communication between the two and the current administration is helping tech companies craft their "misinformation policy". On a certain level its inevitable. If you want to make sure people have reliable resources, someone needs to identify whats reliable and what's not (usually a three letter agency).

But when you have the white house openly call on a Swedish company to censor a popular podcaster, that's where I draw the line. Artists can pull their music, people can boycott, but the government shouldn't have their finger on the scale. That's exactly what the 1st amendment is about. If the state can declare something should be censored and it is (voluntarily though!) then it's no different than force. And when you exert that same pressure on upstream providers, you've essentially rebuilt the great firewall of China without any casualties.

Re: YouTube suspends The Hill for playing clip of Trump denying election results

#372

Post by DoItToMe81 »

jmull wrote: post #220
dayvid wrote: post #127

It's scary how many of the systems we were worried about in China (e.g. social credit system, censorship, etc.) are basically being created now in the west through the proxy of critical companies blocking access and/or working together.

I don’t get why people think youtube should be forced to host stuff they don’t want to host. Youtube should be socialized and forced to become a content-neutral storage? But why?!? We have the internet, where you can rent or run your own server and storage and post your conspiracy theory videos.

Youtube is a major information source for two billion people, that has largely supplanted the online 'public space' of video hosts. No other video site is remotely comparable, and it's not even feasible for the vast majority of individuals, companies or even governments to compete with it. Google also controls the largest search platform, so good luck growing that 'conspiracy theory video' platform.

I don't believe any entity should ever have the power to frame what is and is not acceptable to believe to such a large amount of the world, be it Google, Facebook or a government.

Re: YouTube suspends The Hill for playing clip of Trump denying election results

#373

Post by _yoqn »

jcranmer wrote: post #310
_yoqn wrote: post #248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[dead]

> - The Pennsylvania Supreme Court (not the legislature) changed their voting laws to accommodate widespread mail-in ballots and drop-boxes which was against the state constitution. And yet no one challenged the law until after the third election it had taken effect. Until after the results had come out. There's a doctrine called laches: you have to complain about things that wrong you when you find about them, and i…

You are right about the first part. You won't know you have a dead raccoon in your basement until it starts stinking. I was hearing the conservatives complain about the mass mail-in voting rules and Trump himself also, long before the actual election.

On your second point: If a state holds an election contrary to their constitution and it's proven that it was contrary to their constitution, the votes wouldn't be constitutional. In other words they're illegal. So wouldn't it be sensible to hear calls to count only the legal votes?

There are many, many more irregularities that are too numerous to list but here are a few:

https://rumble.com/vhj5at-2020-election-irregularities-compi...

Re: YouTube suspends The Hill for playing clip of Trump denying election results

#374

Post by rootusrootus »

freedomben wrote: post #28
cm2187 wrote: post #8

Quoted post unavailable.

For those of us who lived through the years of "selected not elected" it is a remarkable double standard. Or, being charitable, a remarkable reversal of opinion. (I tried to slip the expression "flip flop" in there as a joke since that was a popular and widely over-used term at the time too, but I couldn't make it work).

Let us just take a moment to remember that Gore conceded, as did Hillary. On the night of the election, in her case. Former President Trump still has not conceded. There is no double standard. Citizens thinking the election was rigged is one thing, but when the President of the United States refuses to respect the democratic process, it is a very big deal.

Re: YouTube suspends The Hill for playing clip of Trump denying election results

#375

Post by dgellow »

nemothekid wrote: post #357
another_story wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A bit different considering the west has alternatives which are not blocked, whereas China doesn't. You can even spin up your own sources and serve whatever you want,a right not afforded the average Chinese citizen.

You can do this in China too - just get a VPN. If you think a VPN is too high of a hurdle for the average Chinese citizen, I'd argue it's just as high for American netizens as well.

That’s illegal in China. You’re only allowed to use VPN approved by the government and only for some use-cases.

Re: YouTube suspends The Hill for playing clip of Trump denying election results

#376

Post by ekianjo »

jmull wrote: post #245
pokstad wrote: post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No one is arguing about YouTube being forced to do things. People are discussing how sad it is that YouTube has gone down that road.

It’s sad that youtube can choose what content to host? It’s sad that not everyone agrees with all the choices they make? Doesn’t seem sad to me. The alternative, where youtube cannot choose what content to host, seems sad to me.

> It’s sad that youtube can choose what content to host?

There is virtually no competition to youtube in the video streaming space (in terms of sheer reach and volume), so choices that youtube make have clear political implications on what voices get heard.

Re: YouTube suspends The Hill for playing clip of Trump denying election results

#377

Post by jrobn »

robjan wrote: post #363
jrobn wrote: post #351

Death and calamity is going to be the theme of the next 100 years and beyond. Climate change, mass displacement, cheap & effective propaganda, ignorance, resource contention, soil degradation, nuclear proliferation. We've only had nuclear weapons for 70 years. We used them to blow each other up on day 1. The odds are not in our favor that nuclear warfare will be contained.

Death and calamity has been the theme of the whole of history. We're still generally in a much better situation than 100 years ago, even better than 200 and so on.

What is your metric? We have weapons that can end our entire human species. Never before in the history of our entire planet was this even been a possibility. Its like living with a loaded gun to your head. Not to mention the impending climate related crisis domino effect we are going to face in the next 50 years. I'm sure having nuclear weapons will make that go smoothly.

Re: YouTube suspends The Hill for playing clip of Trump denying election results

#378

Post by Buttons840 »

dayvid wrote: post #127

It's scary how many of the systems we were worried about in China (e.g. social credit system, censorship, etc.) are basically being created now in the west through the proxy of critical companies blocking access and/or working together.

Some political websites have been blocked on the hosting level and even the ISP level. I can't defend these website's political views, but I can defend their right to at least host their website somewhere.

Re: YouTube suspends The Hill for playing clip of Trump denying election results

#379

Post by roenxi »

vikingerik wrote: post #352
bko wrote: post #326

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You can even spin up your own sources and serve whatever you want,a right not afforded the average Chinese citizen. It's difficult when the backbone of the internet isn't available to you. For instance, AWS can be denied cutting off vital internet infrastructure we take for granted. Further payment processors like Visa can cut off access. Even banks could cut you off and even seize your funds if they got the direct…

And spinning your own service also fails once the upstream ISPs and DNS registrars also start banning you for wrongthink. That's coming too.

I'm sceptical that is technically possible. If it was, it would have been deployed against the torrent websites by now. Despite countless attempts to shut them down, trackers are still easy to access with only basic technical knowledge and no specialist software.

Communication is even harder to block than torrent traffic. At least torrents have an unusual characteristic traffic pattern that could be checked for. Watching wrongthink videos over an encrypted connection doesn't even have that.

Re: YouTube suspends The Hill for playing clip of Trump denying election results

#380

Post by googlerx »

bko wrote: post #356
DoctorOW wrote: post #282

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you give an example? What's a view that's been eliminated?

Heres an example: Bari Weiss was fired for commissioning an op-ed by a US Senator Tom Cotton calling for the national guard to be called in to break up riots. Note that she did not write the essay, but merely commissioned it. They sometimes have op-eds from varying voices. NY Times apologized and said "This review made clear that a rushed editorial process led to the publication of an Op-Ed that did not meet our stan…

"Since March 1, 2021, she has worked as a regular columnist for German daily newspaper Die Welt." (Wikipedia)

Her career is alive and well.

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