Coin Carbon Cap – PoW cryptocurrencies ranked by energy efficiency
371–380 of 381 posts
Re: Coin Carbon Cap – PoW cryptocurrencies ranked by energy efficiency
#372Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think Ethereum 2.0 is currently demonstrating at scale that proof of stake works fine and can be secure against hordes of very incentivized hackers trying to cheat. That should hopefully bury the whole proof of stake is centralized argument. The notion of centralization has its roots in a different concept: permissioned vs. permissionless blockchains. Ethereum (1 and 2) and Bitcoin are both permissionless in the se…
> I think Ethereum 2.0 is currently demonstrating at scale that proof of stake works fine and can be secure against hordes of very incentivized hackers trying to cheat. That should hopefully bury the whole proof of stake is centralized argument. This is really shakey ground to prop up an argument in favor of cryptocurrency: AFAICT no cryptocurrency ever dies until people stop trading it, which virtually never happens…
In think your point of view is a bit comparable to late stage skeptics arguing against dot com companies 20 years ago. They were mostly right and yet the FANG companies booted (or rebooted) straight out of that. So clearly they were also wrong. Very wrong. Because those companies are now worth trillions. Looking at what came out of that bubble, it is hard to argue that there was nothing there. Of course there was. But of course there were many failures as well and lots of investors backing the wrong companies for all the wrong reasons. But the technology from that era bootstrapped a multi trillion dollar industry.
The blockchain space is very similar. Lots of obvious scams, naive companies, poorly thought through business ideas, half-assed technology, etc. And lots of investors getting rich on being there early and losing other people's money (which, lets face it, is how that greed fueled behavior works). It's a symbiotic relation ship between mediocre investors and mediocre entrepreneurs. That hasn't changed in the last 20 years. That bubble is going to pop at some point. But that does not mean it will drag all blockchains with it.
The thing with Ethereum is that is mostly not directly dependent on VC cash. And that's one of it's strong points. The wider ecosystem is of course. But people like Vitalik Butarik and his friends are not reporting to anyone financed by a VC because they are already financially independent. That's also the reason they have been moving slowly and carefully with Ethereum 2 for years rather than rushing it to market in a few months. They've been talking about proof of stake and sharding for years already. Before the first bitcoin bubble even (four years ago or so).
Blockchains are as strong as those running them. Ethereum 2 right now looks like it is happening and has staying power and will have quite a bit staked among quite a few users. I'd argue most of the Ethereum 1 value is actually based on that future potential.
Re: Coin Carbon Cap – PoW cryptocurrencies ranked by energy efficiency
#373https://www.reddit.com/r/Stellar/comments/nbqfey/since_co2_e...
Re: Coin Carbon Cap – PoW cryptocurrencies ranked by energy efficiency
#374Earlier quoted context omitted.
> I think Ethereum 2.0 is currently demonstrating at scale that proof of stake works fine and can be secure against hordes of very incentivized hackers trying to cheat. That should hopefully bury the whole proof of stake is centralized argument. This is really shakey ground to prop up an argument in favor of cryptocurrency: AFAICT no cryptocurrency ever dies until people stop trading it, which virtually never happens…
I'm talking about it scaling; not about the value of the token. Ethereum 2 tackles scalability through PoS and sharding. Hence the reported energy advantage. Ethereum 2 will be one of the largest proof of stake networks once it launches both by market value and by number of users and validators. The longer that stays up without incidents; the better. The market value means that every known angle towards possibly abus…
Even in cases like stablecoins where investors are provably losing millions of dollars on repeat oweing to fundamental design faults of the underlying protocol, the coins continue being traded nonetheless. The coins are still worth money despite the many instances of clear technical failures — “being worth money” appears to be the sole arbiter of “validity”.
How can the underlying tech really be disproven? Cryptocurrency is an effectively unfalsifiable technology. You could be selling a one-wheeled tricycle, and investors would still trade it based on one narrative or another. That is more or less the case with PoS.
Re: Coin Carbon Cap – PoW cryptocurrencies ranked by energy efficiency
#375Earlier quoted context omitted.
That is one of the important points point made by jtoomin in the first post of this thread: the energy consumption of a PoW blockchain if not proportional to the number of transactions. This means we could have everyone, everywhere, using a PoW blockchain with the same percentage of energy consumption as today (although it would probably rise as price would arguably also rise as demand increases, but it would eventua…
Didn't bitcoin have the chance to double their transactions-per-second for a constant amount of power consumption, in the form of Segwit2x, and decide not to do so? The fact Bitcoin could be more efficient and chooses not to isn't really an improvement over being unable to be more efficient IMHO - in fact arguably it's worse.
It's easy to increase the block size, but it's very unlikely it would ever be decreased again, so it makes sense to wait until there is no other option.
Re: Coin Carbon Cap – PoW cryptocurrencies ranked by energy efficiency
#376Earlier quoted context omitted.
> there are many ways of running a lottery that don't involve burning tons of electricity in the process You need something to be the limiting factor on the amount that you can try to win such a lottery. With proof of work, it's electricity. (assuming everyone is about as efficient as each other) Early on, they talked about it being proportional to cpu-time. That has become more abstract since.
The limiting factor can be the price of the lottery ticket. (It seems the most obvious limiting factor, by the way.)
I haven't heard of any cryptos that require you to risk your coins to mine. Sounds like a neat gimmick, but hard to implement.
Re: Coin Carbon Cap – PoW cryptocurrencies ranked by energy efficiency
#377Are there any coins with a reasonable transaction cost? It seems shocking to me the USD-normalized cost per transaction given that the actual cost should be near zero. Visa/MC has a cost of like $.25+some percent so I suppose represents the cost of having a trusted oracle with fraud, review, etc. This seems like it should be the standard to beat for whether a currency can actually be used for anything normal and nece…
In fact it's being used in several projects where people send each other micropayments of just a couple cents, like twetch.app
Re: Coin Carbon Cap – PoW cryptocurrencies ranked by energy efficiency
#378Earlier quoted context omitted.
Larger blocks means that they take longer to propagate across the network, meaning there is a much longer period where two or more miners might find alternative "next blocks", which could be exploited by tricking miners into including a different transaction in each split of the chain. This means that you basically have to wait much longer before you can be sure that your transaction will not be reversed. On top of t…
This is all complete nonsense.
Re: Coin Carbon Cap – PoW cryptocurrencies ranked by energy efficiency
#379Are there any coins with a reasonable transaction cost? It seems shocking to me the USD-normalized cost per transaction given that the actual cost should be near zero. Visa/MC has a cost of like $.25+some percent so I suppose represents the cost of having a trusted oracle with fraud, review, etc. This seems like it should be the standard to beat for whether a currency can actually be used for anything normal and nece…
Look at the website OP linked. The first one, Bitcoin SV, has a median transaction fee of just $0.0001 In fact it's being used in several projects where people send each other micropayments of just a couple cents, like twetch.app
Re: Coin Carbon Cap – PoW cryptocurrencies ranked by energy efficiency
#380Earlier quoted context omitted.
Unique node lists (UNLs) are simply lists of nodes someone provides that they think meets their standards. Everyone can publish an UNL, it doesn't give any power or requires any privilege. If you run a node you can use one or many UNLs or make you own. There are 3 UNLs published at the time of writing. https://xrpl.org/technical-faq.html#what-are-unique-node-lis... >Ripple CTO claimed XRP might be more decentralized…
>Unique node lists (UNLs) are simply lists of nodes someone provides that they think meets their standards. Everyone can publish an UNL, it doesn't give any power or requires any privilege. If you run a node you can use one or many UNLs or make you own. doesn't using your own UNL basically equate to a hard fork in the event that the nodes don't agree?
Short answer: No, if one or a few dont agree they are just ignored. If the majority (>50%) does then it halts and if a quorum is reached (>80%) it could fork.
long answer: Its complicated. Under normal conditions nothing happens but in edge cases (large node outages/physical disconnection/like if and undersea cable is cut) it could fragment.
This can be avoided if the core of the nodes mostly has each other on the UNL. But since we cant and most importantly should not enforce that its encourages to create and publish an UNL if you think the existing UNLs are not good. Its also encourages to use an UNL with large overlap to other UNLs This leads to the assumption that almost everyone uses one of the published UNLs with minor changes (mostly additions) else if you had mayor changes you would publish an UNL to convince other to also drop/add specific nodes (after all if you have a reason you probably want to tell everyone)
Since the UNLs overlap the real nodes UNLs should too and forking is not possible with large overlap. On a high overlap it could only halt if too many nodes are separated/offline which is the wanted behavior rather than making uncertain progress.
There is a amendment coming (most likely) for negative UNL where nodes can signal that they lost contact to a node and temporary remove it form the UNL. This would reduce the risk of halting if large percentage of nodes are temporary lost. Instead of 20% it would tolerate more nodes to go offline before the network would halt. It basically adjust the 80% quorum requirement down with every node that goes offline but has a minimum of 60% of the original 100%. 60% is the minimum to prevent forking/fragmenting again. only 51% would be needed if the UNLs would had perfect 100% overlap, so its a bit higher to compensate for the fact that UNLs dont have 100% overlap.