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Flutter 2

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Re: Flutter 2

#371

Post by kroltan »

okamiueru wrote: post #337
kroltan wrote: post #314

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Looks like a very developer/product-owner-sided opinion, not being able to select text and other "trivial" things are what makes software tolerable and actually usable, as listed by sibling post by kevincox, I'll quote: > Yup. I would also like to open links in new tabs, view images, copy links, search on page, use browser extensions... Throwing away all platform conventions is a very heavy-handed and user-unfriendly…

I do appreciate your point of view on this, and I hope I did not come across as dismissive of your choice. If it was a thorough evaluation of the capabilities, and it did not seem able to provide the user interactions you needed, I'm sure that is then a reasonable enough basis. My knee-jerk reaction however, was to think this might have been made without properly evaluating the capabilities of the platform. If I head…

Fair enough, and sorry if I seemed a bit combative too.

However, I believe "this is a website" or "this is an app" is a perspective the user will take, despite what our intentions as creators were, and so, the safest bet would always be assume what is the norm for the platform, since the user would never be "disappointed" by that even if they expected an app-like feel. On the Web, (at least some, in my anecdata most) people expect to see Websites, even if highly interactive ones.

I have not tested Flutter in a mobile application so I wouldn't be able to tell if it feels par to the course with other mobile applications, so it might be viable if you only need "AndroidiOS" portability.

Re: Flutter 2

#372

Post by eseidelGoogle »

danShumway wrote: post #297
mdoms wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just visited flutterfolio.com. The very first thing I tried to do is enter a username and Tab to the password field. But Tab just catapulted my input focus to the browser address bar. I mean, come on.

The accessibility is a bigger concern, but flutterfolio.com also A) lags on my work machine when tabbing through fields B) doesn't handle HDPI screens well (the entire interface looks blurry) C) keeps fields visually indicated as selected even when I click outside of the browser (if I start typing, is it going to go into the field or not?) D) has a separate touch mode? Touch doesn't just work? Looked up another of th…

[Flutter Eng. Dir. here]

I really appreciate the feedback. We clearly have more work to do on the Web side of Flutter. Unlike the Mobile side which has shipped 100,000s of apps, the Web side may be up to like 1000. :) So many more issues to address as we work closely with more users to get their apps into production.

If you'd like to track progress on any of these, I'd encourage you (or anyone else reading) to please file issues at flutter.dev/support. We read (and try to address) each and every one which comes in via Github.

Re: Flutter 2

#373

Post by rubyn00bie »

I've been writing a desktop app using Flutter and couldn't be happier honestly. The widget pattern makes sense, the bloc library does what it's supposed to do, and just building an app is mostly on you. My blossoming love of Dart has also been a nice but welcome surprise. It has a couple weird spots and irritations, but so does literally everything else... It works well for the problem space its used in and has the necessary language features to get the job done without blowing off your feet.

Writing a desktop app _on_ and for Linux, that works on MacOS, and Windows ... and a web browser is beyond awesome. It'll probably work well on Android and iOS, with little effort, but I haven't even bothered to try yet. Before I add a dependency I will check out the code and run the demos (if there are some). I haven't had one fail or render strangely yet on a Linux desktop and nearly all of the existing packages were originally created/intended for a mobile device.

With web support, I personally have zero reason to ever write a line of JavaScript again. Why would I want to roll all my own basic widgets? I don't. Writing the logic for a performant and interactive list view, in JS and HTML, is woefully boring to me. I want a list view I can give data to and have a meaningful display of my data. I do not want to browse twenty different packages to find a list view that is the right mix of code I don't hate and features I actually want. I want that done because it's a solved problem, and takes time to solve right.

I couldn't be more excited for this release and future ones because Flutter is providing me a solution that fucking works.

Re: Flutter 2

#374

Post by peterstensmyr »

qbasic_forever wrote: post #246
yagodragon wrote: post #112

We're all complaining about how js is a bad language, tooling is a mess, and how the web is fundamentally built for documents and makes it hard to create app-like experiences. Now, Google comes and creates a whole new UI toolkit from scratch, couples it with a very beautiful SDK and component framework and offers a far better programming language than js could ever be but we're still nagging. I was also pretty disapp…

History has shown us over and over again, always bet on the web. Sure you might not like JS as a language, you might find CSS confusing and full of warts, etc. but it's here and will be here 20, 50, and 100 years from now. We're not going to just sit up and throw away 25+ years of progress and history on the web overnight. Tech like java applets, flash, silverlight, etc. come and go like fads. Who knows if Google wil…

I generally agree with you, but I don’t think it’s unequivocally true. Facebook bet on the web/HTML5 for their iOS app, and Zuckerberg later referred to it as the company’s biggest mistake.

Re: Flutter 2

#375

Post by pvinis »

davidkuennen wrote: post #131

I created apps in cordova, react native and now flutter and I have to say flutter beats both by a lot. It's just been such a nice experience. I'm absolutely in love. My most successful app in flutter is https://stockevents.app if you want to try.

I just tried your app, and like the droppod.gg app and every other flutter app I've tried, there are obvious broken UI things. In the watchlist tab, with one item in the list, I am able to scroll and make the one item hide behind the navbar, and it's happy to stay like that.

These things are big obvious things that make me uninstall an app even if I want/need to use it. Again, I don't know if it's you or flutter that made this thing behave like that. But it makes me think flutter apps are all just one big mess.

Re: Flutter 2

#377

Post by luplex »

Does this mean that all those apps are coming/could come to Linux phones like the Pinephone and the Librem 5?

Re: Flutter 2

#378

Post by qbasic_forever »

eseidelGoogle wrote: post #98
sydd wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've tested on my phone (1yr old pretty good Android one) and the whole thing is very laggy runs with like 10fps. What about a11y? The whole thing feels like Adobe Flex in 2010. It solves a great deal of problems that the web had but introduced a plethora of others.

[Flutter Eng. Dir. here] Still relatively early days for Flutter Web, so I would not be shocked if it's not buttery everywhere. However, we would certainly love to learn more. fluter.dev/support has links as to how to file an issue if you're interested. https://flutterplasma.dev/ is one demo to try. We expect to be updating flutter.dev/web and flutter.dev/showcase to update more over time.

The plasma demo you linked runs at a stuttery 40fps on Firefox (ubuntu 20.10) on a quad core Ryzen 5 laptop. The fans immediately spin to max speed. I'm not impressed...

Here's a hard question, why is this surprising to you? What are you missing in development--is this a gap in testing? Are you hamstrung without support internally to bake this as long as it needs? Rather than double-down on extolling the virtues here, it's time to double-down on fixing the team and the product.

Re: Flutter 2

#379

Post by oblio »

SanderNL wrote: post #327
oblio wrote: post #253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Firefox is on the Google chopping block. They won't admit it but they're killing it by a thousand CSS cuts.

Why are you guys here on HN still using Chrome? There is literally not a single reason I can think of to be supporting this behemoth that is killing the open web. Firefox is excellent actually and Firebug IMO is far superior to Chrome's offering. I understand non-techies using it like they used Explorer, but come on guys.

Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:85.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/85.0

Re: Flutter 2

#380

Post by pvinis »

rubyn00bie wrote: post #373

I've been writing a desktop app using Flutter and couldn't be happier honestly. The widget pattern makes sense, the bloc library does what it's supposed to do, and just building an app is mostly on you. My blossoming love of Dart has also been a nice but welcome surprise. It has a couple weird spots and irritations, but so does literally everything else... It works well for the problem space its used in and has the n…

Show me any flutter app you want and I'll find a problem with a list view.
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