My kid can’t handle a virtual education, and neither can I • Hacker News Board

Re: My kid can’t handle a virtual education, and neither can I

#371

Post by fatherof2 » Thu, Aug 20, 2020, 4:32 AM UTC

dj_mc_merlin wrote: post #40

All of these comments make me think HN has never interacted with a 5 year old. Adults are barely able to make it through a day of Zoom meetings without feeling drained, how do you expect an almost toddler to react when forced to sit in front of a screen? The only reasons adults can do it is years and years of learning impulse controls and suppression of bad emotions for everyone's good. A 5 year old does not have the…

I have 2 kids. One is 4 and the other is 8. I agree that most 5 years probably cannot sit through 30 minutes of a zoom meeting.

When the lockdowns first in started in March, my 4 year old, who was 3 at the time, could barely last 15 minutes before wandering off. She has gotten better since then. She can now last 45 minutes online with her teacher, but I don’t think it’s the norm. My wife still needs to sit with her to make sure she focuses on the teacher.

I think that a lot of these parents that have young children that cannot focus online should be looking on building a small co-op for learning. Partner with 2 or 3 other trusted families and hire a teacher or share responsibilities in teaching the kids. Covid is dangerous taking some risk should be considered.

Re: My kid can’t handle a virtual education, and neither can I

#372

Post by kumarvvr » Thu, Aug 20, 2020, 4:34 AM UTC

scottlamb wrote: post #370

kumarvvr wrote: post #362

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't it sad that as a society, it has come down to schools to provide security to children, as opposed to their own family. I think the root cause is the fragmented family system in the US. Marriages and divorces happen so much that the ultimate sufferers are the children. A society that is so fragile socially, will eventually collapse.

> Isn't it sad that as a society, it has come down to schools to provide security to children, as opposed to their own family. It hasn't. Families _are_ the primary way we provide security for children. No family is perfect but most keep their kids safe. Some don't, all over the world, so we have checks and balances. People trained to fill that role are called "mandated reporters". Teachers are arguably the most impo…

> No family is perfect but most keep their kids safe

Curious, what percentage of families, on average, do you think are "Not perfect"?

Re: My kid can’t handle a virtual education, and neither can I

#373

Post by africasiaeuro » Thu, Aug 20, 2020, 4:47 AM UTC

We went through this since Covid-19 started. What we found was that a virtual classroom has a lot of flaws. For our 8 year old - who is highly intelligent - the virtual classroom was a disaster. Though he is an outstanding student, he simply refused to comply with homework assignments. Writing short observations in particular was a disaster. He became extremly agitated and simply refused to complete the assignments. He was arguing his case with us and the teacher, trying to explain that the scenario given in the assignment does not exist as a result he won't comply. It was hell to get him to do something he did not see as real. The continuous stress created by the Covid situation certainly was partially responsible. Our own assessment: We prefer to send him to a real classroom. Home virtual schooling can not be a substitute for the real thing. AfricAsiaEuro

Re: My kid can’t handle a virtual education, and neither can I

#374

Post by pfranz » Thu, Aug 20, 2020, 4:48 AM UTC

easde wrote: post #164

bdamm wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

iPhone cameras are pretty good and they're very thin. Front or back.

Unfortunately, they're not thin compared to a laptop lid. Especially with the taper near the edges that Macbooks and many other high-end laptops have. There are some exotic optical solutions out there that allow for thinner lenses but I doubt we'll see those in laptops anytime soon.

Apple got over having a "camera bump" on their phones years ago. On laptops they have way more options--the most straightforward would be to put a matching notch in the bottom-case for when it closes.

Finally higher quality build-in cameras are being included in iMacs. I hope very soon they start making their way into their laptops.

Re: My kid can’t handle a virtual education, and neither can I

#375

Post by isabelc » Thu, Aug 20, 2020, 4:54 AM UTC

pyzon wrote: post #62

I can't help but feel that many of the dismissive comments here must be either from folks without kids, or from people that got lucky with a well-mannered child. You think those good manners were all your amazing parenting? You probably deserve some credit, but I think you also lucked out more than you realize. Haven't you seen parents with multiple kids and those kids have wildly different dispositions? I urge you t…

Yes. Anyone with more than one child will know that the main thing we know about kids is that "no two are alike."

Re: My kid can’t handle a virtual education, and neither can I

#376

Post by pdonis » Thu, Aug 20, 2020, 4:55 AM UTC

dghughes wrote: post #341

redshirtrob wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had all day kindergarten in '83. First half was in English, and the second half was in French. And no, this was not a private school. This was Cincinnati Public.

I'm pretty sure I went to kindergarten all day and that was in the early 1970s. I remember my mother saying how a neighbour forgot it was his turn to pick up me and my fellow neighbourhood classmates. It was at 4pm after he was off work and I'm pretty sure I would have started at 8am or 9am.

I would have gone to kindergarten in the early 1970s, but my mom put me in first grade instead. She told me years later, jokingly, that it was because kindergarten was only half a day but first grade was all day so she would have more free time. I'm pretty sure the half day vs. all day part was true even if it wasn't her real reason (her real reason was that she knew I'd be bored in kindergarten).

Re: My kid can’t handle a virtual education, and neither can I

#377

Post by scottlamb » Thu, Aug 20, 2020, 4:59 AM UTC

bcrosby95 wrote: post #108

tboyd47 wrote: post #35

I just pulled my own kids out of public school because I can't stomach it either. I can't in good conscience subject my kids to 6 hours of online class 5 days a week. Whether or not you want to judge me for feeling this way or call me nasty names, "psychic torture" is exactly how I'd describe the solution these educators have come up with.

Our first week was rough. But our school came up with a much better schedule for our kindergartener. Class is now from 8:20-9am, meet in small group with the teacher for 30 minutes (time depends upon your group), then closing instruction at 12:45pm-1:15pm. The rest of the time is "self study". Basically, you have assignments you need to do and complete with your kid. You can do it during self study time. Or at night.…

Nice! That's what I was hoping for but it's not going quite like that.

We're on day 3 of virtual kindergarten.

* Day #1 was a "minimum day": class from 08:35–11:50am, with a break from 09:40am–10:20am. That was okay, except for a technology fail: the (awesome) teacher has two pages of kids, so she doesn't always see when someone is "raising a quiet hand". And growing pains as kids learn the classroom etiquette. After class, we dropped off our kindergartener at the preschool where his younger sister goes. That gave him play time with other kids without exposing our family to another group of people, and it gave us some uninterrupted work time.

* Day #2 was similar, except there was a long gap between the end of the morning Zoom at 11:30am and the "circle time" at 1:45pm–2:00pm. The teacher used this to start meeting families one-by-one; the other families didn't have much assigned to do in that time. The gap was frustrating. Day #4 and #5 will be like this again, except our kid might be absent from afternoon circle time...

* Day #3 was an "asynchronous day" similar to what you're describing. It went pretty well.

Next week they're supposed to be on Zoom in the afternoon until circle time, too. I'm not looking forward to this at all, even though the afternoon time is supposed to be some of the most fun stuff (music, art, science).

It sounds like our teacher is not the one deciding all this, but I'll pass along your message anyway.

I don't know how parents with less flexible work arrangements manage this at all. There are a couple programs to support them, but I think they involve a bunch of kids in the same room in different virtual classes on different schedules, not enough adults there to help them focus, and no reason to believe it's any safer than regular school. I imagine they're quite horrible.

Re: My kid can’t handle a virtual education, and neither can I

#378

Post by james_s_tayler » Thu, Aug 20, 2020, 5:07 AM UTC

dpcan wrote: post #241

james_s_tayler wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah, so the original comment is predicated on the assumption that all adults are capable of doing that for their kids. Some are. Some aren't. Same goes for the kids.

I'm saying that all adults are capable of making distance learning work for their kids. They CAN do it, but it will be HARD.

Nah.

Re: My kid can’t handle a virtual education, and neither can I

#379

Post by zwirbl » Thu, Aug 20, 2020, 5:15 AM UTC

miles wrote: post #273

learc83 wrote: post #97

Kids can't learn all day long in a classroom. I don't know why we expect them to be able to do it remotely. School has always been 1/3 learning 2/3 baby sitting. When my parents were kids, they only went to kindergarten for half a day.

> Kids can't learn all day long in a classroom John Taylor Gatto is an award-winning public school teacher who was honest and brave enough to concur with you: The Six-Lesson Schoolteacher https://www.cantrip.org/gatto.html

> School is like starting life with a 12-year jail sentence in which bad habits are the only curriculum truly learned. I teach school and win awards doing it. I should know

Sounds like it is more about learning to keep your head down and this award winning teacher is very aware of that

Re: My kid can’t handle a virtual education, and neither can I

#380

Post by Johnny555 » Thu, Aug 20, 2020, 5:17 AM UTC

dghughes wrote: post #341

redshirtrob wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had all day kindergarten in '83. First half was in English, and the second half was in French. And no, this was not a private school. This was Cincinnati Public.

I'm pretty sure I went to kindergarten all day and that was in the early 1970s. I remember my mother saying how a neighbour forgot it was his turn to pick up me and my fellow neighbourhood classmates. It was at 4pm after he was off work and I'm pretty sure I would have started at 8am or 9am.

You remember the end time pretty clearly but are you sure about the start time? My kindergarten had 2 groups - a morning group and an afternoon group, so a 4pm pickup time could have just meant you were in the afternoon group.