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18-year-old personal website, built with Frontpage and still updated

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Re: 18-year-old personal website, built with Frontpage and still updated

#371

Post by Moru »

bjornjajajaja wrote: post #182
ath92 wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While this website still works fine, the actual HTML that Frontpage generated isn't exactly easy to maintain if Frontpage stops working for whatever reason. The author of this website is basically stuck using whatever version of Frontpage supports the markup of his website. And I bet there have been plenty of people who used who are no longer able to maintain their website because their editor no longer runs on their…

Microsoft has been fairly good at allowing older binaries to run on newer systems. Apple is pretty annoying in this regard. There’s a lot of software that doesn’t work on versions maybe only 5 years old. A lot of software doesn’t need to change to be honest. Microsoft word for example. Word processing: you sit down and type stuff, maybe change the font once or twice. I guess the collaborative features are nice being…

I wish I could find the movie on youtube again, a demonstration of collaborative text editor from 1960-ish. Been looking for it a number of times just this year.

Re: 18-year-old personal website, built with Frontpage and still updated

#372

Post by danShumway »

Moru wrote: post #371
bjornjajajaja wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Microsoft has been fairly good at allowing older binaries to run on newer systems. Apple is pretty annoying in this regard. There’s a lot of software that doesn’t work on versions maybe only 5 years old. A lot of software doesn’t need to change to be honest. Microsoft word for example. Word processing: you sit down and type stuff, maybe change the font once or twice. I guess the collaborative features are nice being…

I wish I could find the movie on youtube again, a demonstration of collaborative text editor from 1960-ish. Been looking for it a number of times just this year.

Please post back if you find it, I'd be curious to see.

Re: 18-year-old personal website, built with Frontpage and still updated

#373

Post by lucasjans »

I'm surprised no one mentioned it here: before Front Page was a Microsoft product it was created by an independent company, Vermeer. But as many pointed out it produced horrible code.

My favorite editor of the day was a "hand coder" called Home Site

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macromedia_HomeSite

Re: 18-year-old personal website, built with Frontpage and still updated

#374

Post by weka »

znpy wrote: post #348
cameronbrown wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Webmaster" - I miss that term..

Ah, the time when you could actually "master" all the web technologies to keep a website up and running...

There's no reason why you can't slap some CSS (flexbox, cssgrid!) with some ES6 JavaScript linked on an index.html on a Netlify server...

Loads super fast.

Re: 18-year-old personal website, built with Frontpage and still updated

#375

Post by alxlaz »

ath92 wrote: post #166
geocrasher wrote: post #90

These simple sites show us something profound: If you want something to last, don't base it on something that won't last. There are a some technologies that will never allow somebody to build a site and leave it unchanged for 20 or 25 years. Cold Fusion comes to mind. Almost nobody hosts it anymore for one. Can you imagine running the same WordPress version for 25 years? The version of PHP it runs on will be EOL long…

While this website still works fine, the actual HTML that Frontpage generated isn't exactly easy to maintain if Frontpage stops working for whatever reason. The author of this website is basically stuck using whatever version of Frontpage supports the markup of his website. And I bet there have been plenty of people who used who are no longer able to maintain their website because their editor no longer runs on their…

> The author of this website is basically stuck using whatever version of Frontpage supports the markup of his website.

But at least getting it done largely depends only on them, and it's not too hard. I have friends who swear by ProTracker and still use it, even though it's thirty years old and the platform it's running on has been dead for more than twenty. They don't have an Amiga but it's trivial to get it running in an emulator today.

You can run Windows 98 in a browser, and your web editor in it. It's certainly less complicated than hosting a WebObjects application today.

Re: 18-year-old personal website, built with Frontpage and still updated

#376

Post by syntheticnature »

sidarape wrote: post #271
dwheeler wrote: post #186

My personal site was posted on September 12, 1999, is still updated, and has no problems. It;s a static site that mostly uses straight HTML/CSS. There are a few scripts that generate pages, but generating HTML/CSS pretty easy. https://dwheeler.com . Geocrasher said: > I guess what I'm saying is that if you want to build a site to last 25 years without numerous redesigns, build a static HTML page. Yes. I don't get pai…

You could use a static website generator such as Jekyll or Hugo. Then, if the tools stop working for any reason, you always have the generated HTML than you can update.

They already are, hand-rolled: "There are a few scripts that generate pages"

Re: 18-year-old personal website, built with Frontpage and still updated

#377

Post by tech-no-logical »

Moru wrote: post #371
bjornjajajaja wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Microsoft has been fairly good at allowing older binaries to run on newer systems. Apple is pretty annoying in this regard. There’s a lot of software that doesn’t work on versions maybe only 5 years old. A lot of software doesn’t need to change to be honest. Microsoft word for example. Word processing: you sit down and type stuff, maybe change the font once or twice. I guess the collaborative features are nice being…

I wish I could find the movie on youtube again, a demonstration of collaborative text editor from 1960-ish. Been looking for it a number of times just this year.

from the mother of all demos (1968) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJDv-zdhzMY&feature=youtu.be...

I suppose you mean this video ?

Re: 18-year-old personal website, built with Frontpage and still updated

#378

Post by scarface74 »

zamalek wrote: post #357
cptskippy wrote: post #258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're drawing an equivalence between 5 and 25 year old software? Microsoft Windows 10 is able to run software that predates all of Apple's supported platforms.

There's always a person who is happy to explain how Apple bests any competitor you could mention at any metric you could imagine.

So if Apple kept “25 years” of backwards compatibility, should they have been better off bundling a 68K and PPC emulator? Why stop there? They should have kept compatibility with the Apple //e and also bundled a 68K emulator?

Someone else was complaining that they didn’t keep FireWire. Should modern Macs come with ADB ports?

Re: 18-year-old personal website, built with Frontpage and still updated

#379

Post by dahauns »

scarface74 wrote: post #329
cptskippy wrote: post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would disagree, most of what was brought from Classic OS was ported, adapted, out of necessity and short lived. OSX was an entirely new operating system that ported some frameworks and software but wasn't backward compatible. Were it so, they wouldn't have provided an emulator. I think you're just supporting the original assertion that Apple does not support things for very long. Does Software written for OS X v10.…

You call the Carbon API that existed from 2001-2018 “short lived”? The entire Carbon API was used to port software like PhotoShop and Office. Carbon was a port of enough of the Classic API to port major important programs. AppleScript is still built into the current version of OS X. It was introduced in 1993-94 And seeing that 10.1 was PPC only, do you expect them to keep a PPC emulator around? Can you run PPC based…

Sounds to me more like the ported programs were short lived - and IMO, in that they are not entirely wrong.

Sure, Carbon and Rosetta certainly were no mean feat, and the drastic PPC/x86 break is something Microsoft never really had to deal with (heh, the biggest problem trying to run a PPC/MIPS/Alpha based NT application today is actually finding one :) ).

But Apple never went to the same lengths as Microsoft regarding backwards compatibility, and while Carbon and Rosetta immensely eased the transition, the continuity definitely wasn't comparable and it was never transparent to the developers (and in Apple's defense, this was never their intention and they always were quite open about it.)

For one, Rosetta (and thus PPC compatibility) was dropped with Lion in 2011, so no amount of Carbon would help 10.1 applications after that.

And even with Rosetta, each release, especially after Tiger, came with quite a list of API changes and deprecations (with the whole of Carbon declared obsolete in 2012) - and and increasingly longer list of high-profile software that would not run anymore and require an update or upgrade. And while Microsoft did a lot even to prevent and/or work around issues with notorious software (hello Adobe! :) ), Apple was far less willing to do so.

I mean, just as an example - I can run Photoshop 6.0 (from 2000) on Windows 10 (certainly no thanks to Adobe), but no chance for PS 7.0 even on Leopard...

Re: 18-year-old personal website, built with Frontpage and still updated

#380

Post by jsgo »

scarface74 wrote: post #362
virtue3 wrote: post #356

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon_(API) "Carbon was an important part of Apple's strategy for bringing Mac OS X to market, offering a path for quick porting of existing software applications, as well as a means of shipping applications that would run on either Mac OS X or the classic Mac OS. As the market has increasingly moved to the Cocoa-based frameworks, especially after the release of iOS, the need for a port…

So, what exactly did you say they refuted anything I said? The Carbon API was 32 bit only and was supported until the latest release of MacOS. Do you realize how many deprecated end of life frameworks that Microsoft has been lugging around for decades? So should Apple have kept support for 68K software in 2019? Also, do you realize that for all intents and purposes the entire .Net Framework is deprecated and EOL exce…

I've only heard complaints from Silverlight and Windows Phone/Mobile developers anecdotally.

From a web perspective (and my experience), .NET Framework 2/4 -> Core is actually not a big changeover outside of the views (probably better if you switched to MVC).

The Windows Phone apps I built are dead now, but that isn't a matter of APIs no longer being supported, but an entire platform going under.

As a macOS user, I had one operating system update kill external GPU w/ Nvidia cards (that sucked) and another update kill 32 bit apps (that one isn't a big one for me personally). All on the same computer.

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