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Tesla’s European gigafactory will be built in Berlin

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Re: Tesla’s European gigafactory will be built in Berlin

#371

Post by robert_foss »

mariorossi666 wrote: post #302
kmlx wrote: post #265

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Having a Google office with >400 decidedly well-compensated people move in would very much change the neighborhood and not for the better. i don't understand this. so berlin would rather have poor citizens? how is that better for the city? and how would >400 "well-compensated" people affect the city in anything but a positive manner? has there been any sort of study as to how better wages affect a city?

> so berlin would rather have poor citizens? not everything is about money I take "poor citizens" but cultural fecund Berlin anytime over "rich" USA cities with homeless people living on the streets while FAANG workers spend half of their huge salary on mediocre apartments > and how would >400 "well-compensated" people affect the city in anything but a positive manner? a city is not only (I would say not at all) the…

cultural fecund.. what an expression.

/me swoons

Re: Tesla’s European gigafactory will be built in Berlin

#372

Post by Zenst »

donpott wrote: post #362
Zenst wrote: post #346

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you have any proof that Tesla was going to build a plant in the UK before? Or are you overlooking how Germany has manufacturing and infrastructure more suited to building cars over all other EU members, including the UK!

Elon himself has cited Brexit uncertainty as a reason for choosing Germany over the UK. Source: https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2019/nov/13/tesla-cit...

He also said “Some of the best cars in the world are made in Germany. Everyone knows that German engineering is outstanding, for sure, and that’s part of the reason why we are locating our gigafactory Europe in Germany. We are also going to create an engineering and design centre in Berlin.”

Thing is with Brexit, you have 50% wanting to leave, 50% wanting to stay and a proportional represented result being playout out by a first past the post system, yielding all sorts of chaotic stagnation. Which all gets blamed upon the initial proportional vote.

Hence if any business is asked about the UK, the whole uncertainty and chaos will come up in the subject. Just that people love to presume that was the single reason and without that things would be different. I don't see any reason or indication from Elon or Tesla to of picked the UK, even without the current climate of chaos and limbo finger pointing politics.

Re: Tesla’s European gigafactory will be built in Berlin

#373

Post by mikojan »

adrianN wrote: post #369
lm28469 wrote: post #366

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rent prices doubled since early 2010. Berlin is not mountain view, normal people actually live here and can't afford it anymore.

Rent prices didn't double because incomes doubled, otherwise people could still afford it. Rent increases because Berlin doesn't build enough affordable housing.

No, they are exactly right. Former migrant and working-class districts have been turned into habitats for the rich and the upper-middle class. Lower and middle income groups are driven out of the city. (Not completely. After all, we need them to take a two hour commute to wash the clothes of the rich and serve them coffee.)

Re: Tesla’s European gigafactory will be built in Berlin

#374

Post by Krasnol »

Krasnol wrote: post #299
vertex-four wrote: post #287

Watching a SV company suddenly have to deal with German workers' rights (think: unions, significant protection from being fired without cause, rights to paid holiday and enforced maternity leave, even workers' councils which have representation at a management level) is going to be hilarious.

Maybe this is part of the reason why he does it. "Look he made it work in Germany with their "strict" workers rights. It can't be so bad" Also going to Germany, right in the face of the traditional car industry is a great show off too.

Oh well...maybe there were other reasons:

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2019/nov/13/tesla-cit...

Re: Tesla’s European gigafactory will be built in Berlin

#375

Post by xedeon »

swish_bob wrote: post #319
xedeon wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Tesla had several incidents with injured workers and safety violations More than the industry average in the state of California? If so, care to site your source?

Numerous, repeated stories over the years. They keep claiming they've improved, and it's possible they have, but stories keep surfacing. https://riskandinsurance.com/5-takeaways-from-teslas-safety-...

Again, how do the numbers of substantiated report stack up compared to other manufacturers? That would be the only metric that matters.

The article you linked looked like an opinion piece and provided zero data points or official documents.

Lastly, Cal-OSHA has much stricter rules than other states. Tesla is pretty much the only auto manufacturer in the state of California currently.

Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Motor_vehicle_assembl...

Re: Tesla’s European gigafactory will be built in Berlin

#376

Post by mstipetic »

jashmatthews wrote: post #298
mstipetic wrote: post #274

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The startup culture in Berlin is mediocre at best. I think bringing in proper high tech will be very valuable

What do you see it lacking? Berlin already has a lot. Just many of the "startup scene" aren't really aware of stuff like: Mozilla and HPI (Oracle JVM research) doing cutting edge work. Ableton and Native Instruments as world leaders in niche but influential software. Car2Go and Coup with major financial backing from Mercedes and Bosch. Tons of small seed-stage companies funded by the great smaller VCs here. ECB centr…

Well I am a part of the Berlin startup scene, so I have personal experience there, completing a fundraising attempt myself. I'm not saying there is no tech happening in Berlin, I just don't think that Car2Go and Coup are good examples of startups.

They are actually perfect example of the German mentality in investing in startups - fairly secure plays which they can understand.

As far as early stage investments companies go, it's not as nice as you make it sound. Have a look at any list of startups and apart from infarm (which is great and I've worked there) and maybe n26, most are ecommerce platform plays and some fintech (of which most are too late to the game). A lot of the people in my network wanting to do something different had to go elsewhere

Re: Tesla’s European gigafactory will be built in Berlin

#378

Post by Tomte »

DarkWiiPlayer wrote: post #264
odiroot wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> So far besides maybe Siemens there wasn't too much industry here, which is more present in the south of the country. Siemens is big in Niedersachsen (e.g. Braunschweig) so it's more about East/West divide.

Some background for the non-German readers: Within Germany there's still a very noticeable divide between east and west, with average waegs, for example, being considerably higher in the west. This goes back to the different ways the two regions were managed after WWII. So when a big (and presumably well-paying) company is going to create lots of jobs in the country, whether this is in an eastern or a western state i…

In socioeconomic terms the north-south divide is much more pronounced than the east-west divide.

Politically, east-west is obviously dominant.

Re: Tesla’s European gigafactory will be built in Berlin

#380

Post by ptaipale »

choeger wrote: post #2

Please drop your inevitable BER jokes below so we can recylce them properly later.

Der Postillon:

Musk: "We chose Berlin as the location because it has the only CO2-free airport in the world"

https://www.der-postillon.com/2019/11/tesla-ber.html

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