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Facebook Asking for Some New Users' Email Passwords

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Re: Facebook Asking for Some New Users' Email Passwords

#371

Post by pas »

ndnxhs wrote: post #173
pas wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe, but that's very counter-productive actually. If you want to do ethical stuff FB is a perfect place to try to influence what happens.

Unless you have been doing deeply corrupt work for them for years you are not going to be making any change at that megacorp. I know someone who worked there and they just remove anyone who does not conform.

Changing them can be done with market forces and political will from the outside and through participation on the discussions on the inside.

Probably all approaches are needed.

I'm simply stating, that if no one is on the inside, then we're missing out on a possible interaction channel that could help changing FB.

Re: Facebook Asking for Some New Users' Email Passwords

#372

Post by pas »

anoncake wrote: post #175
pas wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe, but that's very counter-productive actually. If you want to do ethical stuff FB is a perfect place to try to influence what happens.

At the same time, you help Facebook do what it currently does, i.e. unethical stuff. I dont think an individual engineers ability to influence a company they dont own outweighs their contributions.

Not necessarily. You don't have to lie during the recruitment/interview. If you get in you get in. And you can resign when they ask you to do something you feel you should not participate in.

Simply trying to get in to be on the inside - without lying, is better than not even trying.

Of course, trying to advocate for better political control (privacy, transparency, lower barriers to enter the market) is important, and can and should be done while trying to engage with FB, trying to get close to their internal decision making process.

And, naturally, not everyone has the affinity to work at FB, but since it's a spectrum, likely there are a lot of software engineers that do have some ethical concern with regards to what and how FB does, and they shouldn't be discouraged from working at FB, but they should be very much empowered to be able to stand up and leave when their moral compass signals.

Re: Facebook Asking for Some New Users' Email Passwords

#373

Post by pas »

Nasrudith wrote: post #217
pas wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe, but that's very counter-productive actually. If you want to do ethical stuff FB is a perfect place to try to influence what happens.

Eh I don't think that holds universally - and even when it does is an inversion of responsibility. A small mutual protection street gang maybe could work for with resources but one doesn't make a vicious gang like the Cartels nicer by joining them and trying to reform them from the inside.

Okay, it might not hold, that it's the best place to try to exert change, but it's undeniably a channel of interaction. Not exploiting it leads to less change.

Re: Facebook Asking for Some New Users' Email Passwords

#374

Post by breakingcups »

yebyen wrote: post #256
SN76477 wrote: post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Steve Jobs understood the problem. https://youtu.be/fuZ6ypueK8M

I was looking for the Steve Jobs quote in this thread, thought this was going to be "It doesn't make sense to hire smart people and tell them what to do; we hire smart people so they can tell us what to do."

Yeah, if there's one thing Steve Jobs is known for, it's listening to other opinions.

Re: Facebook Asking for Some New Users' Email Passwords

#375

Post by breakingcups »

morganvachon wrote: post #214
daemin wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only big companies that seem to be able to diversify their income somewhat are Microsoft and Amazon. Microsoft makes its money from various products and services, and Amazon now makes a lot of money from AWS let alone its online shopping. Compared to those two Google and Facebook are one hit wonders.

Amazon loses money on their online shopping. It is their consumer-facing offering so it grows their brand, while they make their money via services like AWS.

Do you have a source on that?

Re: Facebook Asking for Some New Users' Email Passwords

#376

Post by yebyen »

breakingcups wrote: post #374
yebyen wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was looking for the Steve Jobs quote in this thread, thought this was going to be "It doesn't make sense to hire smart people and tell them what to do; we hire smart people so they can tell us what to do."

Yeah, if there's one thing Steve Jobs is known for, it's listening to other opinions.

Ain't that the truth, but he said so at least the once, and now I guess that's how we remember him!

Re: Facebook Asking for Some New Users' Email Passwords

#377

Post by morganvachon »

breakingcups wrote: post #375
morganvachon wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Amazon loses money on their online shopping. It is their consumer-facing offering so it grows their brand, while they make their money via services like AWS.

Do you have a source on that?

https://www.thestreet.com/opinion/amazon-is-losing-money-fro...
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