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European Commission fines Google €4.34B in Android antitrust case

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Re: European Commission fines Google €4.34B in Android antitrust case

#371

Post by sigzero »

r_singh wrote: post #324
archi42 wrote: post #279

Site is under maintanance, Google Cache link (hahaha): http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:europa.... //edit: oh, took only a minute or two :) nice work I really like this point: > [Google] has prevented manufacturers wishing to pre-install Google apps from selling even a single smart mobile device running on alternative versions of Android that were not approved by Google (so-called "Android forks")…

I agree, if dropped, this will motivate big electronics players to release smart phones powered by android that aren't Google infested. Sometimes when I'm in a cynical mood, I feel like my android phone isn't really mine, it's owned by google and exists purely to serve them. This would improve the smartphone market on so many levels. We need a great driver support for AOSP, multiple app stores, community driven updat…

>Sometimes when I'm in a cynical mood, I feel like my android phone isn't really mine, it's owned by google and exists purely to serve them.

I am not aware of a smartphone out there where that isn't true. What is the incentive for Google to continue updating Android at all?

Re: European Commission fines Google €4.34B in Android antitrust case

#372

Post by cornholio »

xg15 wrote: post #200
pdw wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From Wikipedia: In their Statement of Objections, the European Commission accused Google of the breach of EU antitrust rules in three ways: - by requiring mobile manufacturers to pre-install Google Search and Google Chrome browser and requiring them to set Google Search as default search service on their devices, as a condition to license certain Google proprietary apps; - by preventing manufacturers from selling sma…

My understanding is that the "certain Google proprietary apps" most importantly contain the Play store. Yes, in theory you could install FDroid - however if you, as a manufacturer, don't want to break the "install our app" flows of basically every website, you need the Play store - and therefore you also need to install Chrome, default Google Search and never sell a phone with Lineage OS installed ever again. Not sur…

The margins of the Play Store are huge and it's quite easy to disrupt with a copy cat - the developers will flock to an alternative store with similar functionality and 2% fees. And of course customers.

The Play store is the crown jewel and protecting that massive revenue stream is paramount, it could well become the most important software market in the world.

Re: European Commission fines Google €4.34B in Android antitrust case

#373

Post by sorokod »

endorphone wrote: post #286

This is a dangerous ruling that pushes the world further into the potential for trade wars by proxy. Contrary to numerous posts- -no, the law isn't "clear". This is an incredibly nuanced situation, and the notion that Google was just overtly flouting (ed: thx sjcsjc) the law is outright nonsense. Google has a huge litany of bad practices (I personally recently switched my daily driver to an iPhone for that reason), b…

no, the law isn't "clear"

Well , judges had a look and decided it was

Re: European Commission fines Google €4.34B in Android antitrust case

#375

Post by princekolt »

VikingCoder wrote: post #265
hrktb wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A better source: > The European Commission has accused Google of abusing its Android market dominance by bundling its search engine and Chrome apps into the operating system. Google has also allegedly blocked phone makers from creating devices that run forked versions of Android. https://www.theverge.com/2018/7/18/17580694/google-android-e... > How is it any different Apple doesn’t have a dominent search engine to pu…

Oh, Apple is a brutal dictatorship that doesn't share anything? That's fine. Oh, Google, you're willing to share almost everything with anyone for free, but you want to put terms on that? Hey, here's a giant fine. I just don't understand the logic of this at all.

> I just don't understand the logic of this at all.

That doesn't mean it is wrong. =)

Re: European Commission fines Google €4.34B in Android antitrust case

#377

Post by bkor »

repolfx wrote: post #133
sveme wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't it great that you're heading for a hard brexit, then? If the competition is no level-playing field anymore, how should a local company be successful? Your points have been addressed above already, if Apple had a dominant market position, the EU would have handled things differently. And Apple has been fined by the EU before as well.

Obviously, the EU deciding to terminate all cooperation with the UK because of an ideological "all or nothing" approach is a tyrannical and cult-like way to run international relations. However if the alternative is having to deal with the EU Commission then yep, I guess hard brexit is the next best alternative. The reason the EU doesn't have any local mobile companies isn't do to with Android or Google's licensing t…

> However if the alternative is having to deal with the EU Commission then yep, I guess hard brexit is the next best alternative.

They're currently headed towards not really exiting the EU. Once they looked into the details they determined that the drawbacks were outright lies (350M GBP/week) and the benefits are huge. It might even end up as a paper exercise.

Re: European Commission fines Google €4.34B in Android antitrust case

#379

Post by gniv »

cortic wrote: post #360
endorphone wrote: post #286

This is a dangerous ruling that pushes the world further into the potential for trade wars by proxy. Contrary to numerous posts- -no, the law isn't "clear". This is an incredibly nuanced situation, and the notion that Google was just overtly flouting (ed: thx sjcsjc) the law is outright nonsense. Google has a huge litany of bad practices (I personally recently switched my daily driver to an iPhone for that reason), b…

>"well it's only a quarter's earnings across all of Google" actually, 2017 google made $110B so its not 1/4 but 1/22 of their profits last year.. enormous? meh.

That's revenue. Earnings last year were $12.7B.

Re: European Commission fines Google €4.34B in Android antitrust case

#380

Post by rusk »

oliwarner wrote: post #362
SparklingCotton wrote: post #328

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple should be forced to pay back 10x what they gained in this illegal deal. It's bleedingly obvious that it's illegal to be taxed differently than other companies. Paying back €13bn is nothing. Companies that "make deals" on tax anywhere in the world should be effectively banned from the EU market. It's pure evil. Or pay 10x of any gain they have made anywhere in the world by "making deals" on tax, thereby undercut…

Playing states against each other is par for the course in the US. Each state can offer wildly different tax structures and incentives, and they all do, because each wants to be the state government that oversaw "6000 new jobs". They've seen similar issues with the collection of sales tax, when one company can "operate" over many state lines. But saying "hey, that's obviously corruption" isn't enough. We need a good…

There is literally a "world" of difference between a collection of trade-aligned sovereign nations, and a single nation of autonomous economic regions. As you mention, it's an accepted part of daily business in the US but everybody pays taxes to the Fed at the end of the day. All governed by the same congress, president, and a coherent political dialogue throughout. That's not to say it'll always remain so.

The particular problem with the EU is that it's a system of "good faith" agreements that has until quite recently been quite weak against cynical attacks.

This kind of dealing undermines the spirit of the EU accords and you can expect it to be dealt with in the course of time - probably through tax harmonisation, which wouldn't then be a million miles away from the american model.

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