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A growing number of young Americans are leaving desk jobs to farm

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Re: A growing number of young Americans are leaving desk jobs to farm

#371

Post by randomstudent »

ghostbrainalpha wrote: post #82
ryguytilidie wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I don't buy a lifestyle from them, I buy fucking good milk from animals that are loved like family, and I'm proud to be helping them make a living doing something that is good for everyone(including the cows). It's not a lifestyle, it's just supporting people who aren't shitting on everyone's future. The things you say here seem like you are ABSOLUTELY buying a lifestyle here. ie. values for how animals should be tr…

I think he means that he is buying "the cow's lifestyle", instead of his. I applaud the sentiment, but do small farm cows, loved like they are part of the family actually do less damage to the environment? Is factory farming doing something that makes factory cows produce more methane? I also disagree he is not buying a lifestyle for himself. Non pasteurized milk is ABSOLUTELY better tasting. So he is purchasing a lu…

You might also find yourself buying tuberculosis with your milk, but that's your choice.

Re: A growing number of young Americans are leaving desk jobs to farm

#372

Post by why15characters »

cmrdporcupine wrote: post #130
Retric wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're right I should preface this by limiting things to America. Making 7$ / day or 210$/month is a living wage in much of the world, but only adds up to ~2,500$/year. I am sure many of these farms provide a better standard of living than many of my ancestors had.

But it's not just incomes and labour costs. It's equipment prices, it's also land prices, it's land availability, and in North America subsidies for cash cropping favour that kind of farm. But also a huge part it is equipment costs and other costs that favour huge economies of scale here that is not necessarily the case in some parts of Europe, Asia, etc. Look at what Chinese small farmers farm with -- small nimble w…

> Now try to get yourself one of these in North America.

No, don't. They are massively overpriced and underpowered even as the cheap crummy chinese imports, nevermind BCS. This is also true in Europe, so the idea that this is an American problem isn't well founded.

>A BCS or Grillo walk behind fully equipped (rototiller/rotary plow, decent sized engine, cultivator attachment, etc.) ends up being at least $10,000 worth of an investment

But you can get a far more capable garden tractor off of craigslist for $500. Tillers, plows, cultivators, etc run $100-300. Buying new is a huge waste of money. Just because it is possible to waste money, doesn't mean it is required. You can make a good living on a small farm if you treat it like a business, but lots of people treat it like an image they want to project. "Look at my expensive tractor, it costs more than your house" might make people feel good about themselves, but it will also make their business fail.

Re: A growing number of young Americans are leaving desk jobs to farm

#373

Post by why15characters »

PeachPlum wrote: post #229
nabla9 wrote: post #39

Some commentators here have difficulty of understanding how small farming can be profitable. It's relatively easy to explain. They are not selling just the product. Just like microbreweries, small farms sell for people who want more than just a beer or lettuce. They want to distinguish themselves and buy the feeling of authentic life and values. Consumer pays more for "small farm" even if the product is not any diffe…

I think you're wrong. Look up Justin Rhodes on YouTube or Joel Salatin. Small holding is profitable once you get over the hump and get customers

>Justin Rhodes

75 acres is not a smallholding. And he makes his living selling "how to do the farming I pretend to do on youtube" courses, not farming.

>Joel Salatin

550 acres is really not a smallholding. At least he is actually a farmer though.

Re: A growing number of young Americans are leaving desk jobs to farm

#374

Post by MsMowz »

pcurve wrote: post #7
MsMowz wrote: post #3

Farming is no way to make a living. I'm glad that these people are finding success, but I come from a farming community and family and for decades farming has only been affordable if you also had another full-time job. Although microfarms for trendy produce might not be so bad.

As someone with first hand experience or exposure, what do you think are main reasons? I'm still amazed at how cheap food is in the U.S. (though quality just isn't there for the most part).

It varies with whatever you're trying to produce, but the biggest problem is that family farmers are being displaced by larger farms mostly because of economies of scale. The only thing left (at least, where I'm from) that family farms can do alright by is beef, and the reason is that you can't just stick a calf in a feedlot for its entire life like you can with chickens or hogs, so there's not as much room for economies of scale.

Farming has been a race to the bottom for a long time, and this is welcomed by people who want to see cheaper food at any cost. I'm sympathetic to that view, but when I watch the continued erosion of rural communities based around the erosion of farming as a living, I have to think we should do something. What will happen to those people? And what will we do when (or if) we take into account the enormous environmental costs of large-scale farming? You're not going to just get those family farms back, because unless you're raised on a farm you probably won't have an interest in farming.

Re: A growing number of young Americans are leaving desk jobs to farm

#375

Post by rhn_mk1 »

vogt wrote: post #141
clord wrote: post #112

We did this. My wife has a masters in microbio, and I worked at IBM on their C++ and for Fortran compilers for about 8 years (yay std::atomics). I still do remote contract work to help pay for upgrades to the farm. Would be nice to get one of my side-projects finished and start pumping out some income streams, but it's not a big rush anymore. I have a point of sale system built with React and Haskell that integrates…

Here's a question about adjustment to rural life, because I have been daydreaming about this for a long time: Are you now isolated from existing friends and family? That's really my one big worry. I'm super burned out on software, and currently facing all the same concerns it sounds like you did before, it just frightens me the idea of being further removed (geographically) from the few family and friends we have lef…

Maybe I can shine some light on the adjustment, as I have quite some experience with moving and living in small towns.

I did lose a great many friends whenever I moved from one place to another. Usually meeting up once-twice a month keeps the thread alive, but closest people will stay in touch online probably forever.

That being said, if you put some work into it, you will find new friends. This requires a mindset of getting involved in any open event that you're even slightly interested in. The bigger the town, the easier it seems to come across those.

In the other hand, talking to neighbors is easier when there's no one else around. I have an impression this creates a tighter knit community, where you can find new long-term friends.

This would probably happen in my case if I didn't relocate again :)

Re: A growing number of young Americans are leaving desk jobs to farm

#377

Post by vogt »

rhn_mk1 wrote: post #375
vogt wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's a question about adjustment to rural life, because I have been daydreaming about this for a long time: Are you now isolated from existing friends and family? That's really my one big worry. I'm super burned out on software, and currently facing all the same concerns it sounds like you did before, it just frightens me the idea of being further removed (geographically) from the few family and friends we have lef…

Maybe I can shine some light on the adjustment, as I have quite some experience with moving and living in small towns. I did lose a great many friends whenever I moved from one place to another. Usually meeting up once-twice a month keeps the thread alive, but closest people will stay in touch online probably forever. That being said, if you put some work into it, you will find new friends. This requires a mindset of…

Thanks, that's interesting. I have moved around a lot, so I'm used to adjustments there, I'm just concerned with moving to a small rural town here in Texas and being 3-4 hours away from the few friends family we do have left.

Re: A growing number of young Americans are leaving desk jobs to farm

#378

Post by LoonyBalloony »

dsfyu404ed wrote: post #322
andyisageek wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I also grew up on a farm... in Maine. It did instill a work ethic that I find it difficult to teach to my own children. But I always joke with people and say it is a great place to visit and a great place to be from. Not so much a great place to actually be.

Meh, still better than the tourism based places. At least with a farm you're busy all year. With tourism you're under employed half the year and shooting up something to kill the time.

"shooting up something to kill the time."

I like FPS games to. ;-)

Re: A growing number of young Americans are leaving desk jobs to farm

#379

Post by dailyvijeos »

clord wrote: post #112

We did this. My wife has a masters in microbio, and I worked at IBM on their C++ and for Fortran compilers for about 8 years (yay std::atomics). I still do remote contract work to help pay for upgrades to the farm. Would be nice to get one of my side-projects finished and start pumping out some income streams, but it's not a big rush anymore. I have a point of sale system built with React and Haskell that integrates…

You can say that again. Cities are, for the most part, where humanity (i.e., compassion and community) goes to die. I’m seriously contemplating migrating someplace where people aren’t 80% deplorable jerks, like suburban Oregon or New Mexico.

Plus, all of the learned helplessness and ostensibly “incapable,” self-absorbed bullshit job people whom are disconnected from anything but a narrow specialty of bullshit... if food prices spiked for any reason, they’re boned.

Re: A growing number of young Americans are leaving desk jobs to farm

#380

Post by dailyvijeos »

JPKab wrote: post #243
clord wrote: post #112

We did this. My wife has a masters in microbio, and I worked at IBM on their C++ and for Fortran compilers for about 8 years (yay std::atomics). I still do remote contract work to help pay for upgrades to the farm. Would be nice to get one of my side-projects finished and start pumping out some income streams, but it's not a big rush anymore. I have a point of sale system built with React and Haskell that integrates…

I grew up in a rural community where farming was basically the only industry. It's easy to talk about how awesome it is when you basically are selling insanely overpriced boutique goods (organic, free-range, etc) to yuppies who are willing to pay triple for their calories. Once enough people do this, the prices fall and you're just another farmer, scraping by. I grew up working on farms. It's not romantic to me in an…

My mom’s family were Dust Bowl refugees, and my grandfather had to hustle to not starve to death.

On a lighter note, check out this Canadian using a large backyard as a profitable farm: https://youtu.be/KO-OuqbR3EE

Here’s also a working Swedish homestead/farm (that’s being threated by the uncertainty of oil/mineral extraction): https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC7GkLSNBmds1DZit_oHk-Fg

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