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That awkward moment when Apple mocked good hardware and poor people

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Re: That awkward moment when Apple mocked good hardware and poor people

#371

Post by ryao »

simonh wrote: post #285
alienbaby wrote: post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

obsoletion built into the product roadmap

And yet Apple devices have longer software support lifetimes than any Android devices and better resale values for a longer time. That hardly sounds like a set of characteristics you'd associate with products designed to become obsolete.

They are dependent on Apple for updates due to the code signing. Alternative operating systems also cannot be installed once Apple stops supporting them. That ensures obsolensce in the long term, even if it is longer term than their competitors' blob-ridden Android products.

Anyway, plenty of machines sold then and even today are junk, so maybe replacing them is not such a terrible idea. However, I think replacing the software matters more. Linux is an excellent option for these systems in the long term. If Apple made Mac OS X available for them, it would be too.

Re: That awkward moment when Apple mocked good hardware and poor people

#372

Post by mhurron »

Udo wrote: post #10

I'm an Apple-only user at the moment, both mobile and desktop. When Apple asserts that a desktop computer should be replaced by a locked-down handheld device with very limited capabilities, the odd thing seems to me is they don't realize these devices do very different things and fulfill very different needs. I don't worry about the demise of the desktop because I'm nostalgic, I worry about the loss of power and prod…

> either Apple is misjudging the needs of their users, to the point where trendsetters like programmers will be switching away from the platform. Or, they succeed in their vision and breed several generations of technologically illiterate information workers fumbling their way through life with nothing but extremely limited mobile devices as their only productivity tool.

I would dispute the 'programmers are trendsetters' assertion.

Apple is probably completely correct in the way that most people use their computer. The majority of users do not use their desktop in a way that would not work on something like an iPad. They browse the web. They use webmail. They listen to music.

Now, do you really think that the only way anyone knows how to use a computer at work is because they use the same thing at home? Users learn click here, here and here and you do your job they don't have to know anything about the underlying system. Which is a good thing, because they are probably using some software at work that they can not get at home. Using a locked down device at home is not going to turn people into drooling morons any more or less than they already are.

The one thing that would be lost if tablets like the iPad or similar Android devices became the primary device at home is that children would not have a system they could learn the inner workings of, explore on and being to learn to create on. I'm talking about learning programming, not drawing or related artistic activities.

Re: That awkward moment when Apple mocked good hardware and poor people

#373

Post by Retric »

cableshaft wrote: post #205
Retric wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I thought those where locked/discounted phones. First is: Boost (67.99), or Sprint prepaid (104$) Second is: AT&T Go Phone only. But, it looks like you can get a new unlocked smartphone for 60$. http://www.amazon.com/BLU-Advance-5-0-Unlocked-Smartphone/dp...

I got the Lumia 635 for $30 last year as a temporary replacement for my Nexus 5 that I walked into a lake on accident, and it's worked out so well I still have it with no plans to upgrade. I've gotten cheap Android phones that have felt sluggish and super buggy after a mere 6 months (not the Nexus 5, though, that just had a crap battery life, but I also spent ~$450 on it, so it wasn't cheap), but this one still opera…

It's a good deal, but I think it's subsided.

http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/mobile/phone/lumia635/offers?...

Amazon lists: $131.11 and Cricket has it for 20$. Still, as long as your not locked into a contract and can buy replacements at that cost it's not a problem.

PS: Windows does seem to beat Android on low end phones.

Re: That awkward moment when Apple mocked good hardware and poor people

#374

Post by chillingeffect »

JohnBooty wrote: post #275
noxToken wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I am not sure if I was suddenly without money, the iPhone would be what I would want to give up. If you have an iPhone and then become poor, sure. You probably won't get ahead much by getting rid of your iPhone. If you're already poor, then an iPhone (not a smartphone) is definitely a luxury. There are capable smartphones for much cheaper then an iPhone that could get the job done. That's what GP was likely getting…

> If you're already poor, then an iPhone (not a smartphone) is definitely a luxury. It's not wrong, nor necessarily economically irresponsible, for "poor" people to have a few nice things. Assuming a lifespan of 3 years, the cost difference between a $600 phone and a $300 phone is barely more than $0.25 per day - and probably even less, considering that iPhones have a higher resale value. Maybe that "poor person" car…

Other responses disagree with you, but I agree with you... and I'm rather anti-consumerist (it's difficult to pull off completely...).

In fact, I feel a bit silly having paid "only" $300 for my Samsung phone, having read your economic breakdown. I was imagining myself having an extra $200 for stuff... but I go through a lot of wasted time having "only" 16GB.. continuously moving stuff off of it... missed photos and videos I could have taken. Perhaps the pix didn't have economic value worth $200 over 3 years, but the time is probably worth it.

I've also heard the perspective on the poor that if they have to be poor, it helps to have at least one nice thing. the nice thing of choice is the phone.

The real question is, imho, how to leverage these choices to get what helps an individual. e.g. use the phone to get jobs, to shop around for the best price, to buy used things on craigslist to save money, to watch inspiring and encouraging videos, to learn new skills to get better jobs, etc.

Re: That awkward moment when Apple mocked good hardware and poor people

#375

Post by thirdsun »

kybernetyk wrote: post #116
vbezhenar wrote: post #32

I can't imagine how I would replace my laptop with iPad. Some tasks are definitely doable: Web browsing, Mail processing, Music listening, Skype (though chatting on iPad is terrible because you have to switch around all the time, losing your focus, may be split apps might help, can't experience it, because my iPad have RAM like 15-year old PC). Generally speaking for power user every activity on iPad is strictly wors…

I think the iPad Pro project is Apple's last try to re-vive the tablet form factor. Tablet sales are going back, no one I know makes real good use of them (even my elderly mother prefers her MacBook to her iPad for browsing, etc). My friends all own an iPad in some incarnation but it usually is just a dust collector. And I don't have only techie friends. If the iPad Pro fails as the iPad did I think Apple's going to…

Anecdotally I'd have to disagree - my iPad is easily the most used device at home. Not a day without multiple hours of use goes by. That's not to say that I could ever imagine replacing my desktop iMac with it - that's not going to happen, but unless I'm coding or working in audio (where the iPad also comes in handy as a controller), I'll prefer using the iPad compared to the iMac. So I do "real work", just not as frequently as reading, browsing, writing emails etc.

Don't own a laptop because it would it would sit around idle for weeks. iPad + Microsoft Universal Mobile Keyboard is a very mobile and comfortable combination. And for "truck work" I prefer a real, powerful desktop with a big display to a MacBook.

Re: That awkward moment when Apple mocked good hardware and poor people

#376

Post by JohnBooty »

digitalsigil wrote: post #342
JohnBooty wrote: post #275

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you're already poor, then an iPhone (not a smartphone) is definitely a luxury. It's not wrong, nor necessarily economically irresponsible, for "poor" people to have a few nice things. Assuming a lifespan of 3 years, the cost difference between a $600 phone and a $300 phone is barely more than $0.25 per day - and probably even less, considering that iPhones have a higher resale value. Maybe that "poor person" car…

> It's not wrong, nor necessarily economically irresponsible, for "poor" people to have a few nice things. I strongly agree with this, but if someone does choose to buy an iPhone they should know it's a luxury. It bothers me that Apple doesn't acknowledge this.

I don't want to totally let producers of consumer goods off the hook here: they are certainly not blameless when it comes to the unhealthy consumer culture we have, and Schiller's comment was tone deaf IMHO.

But generally I feel it's appropriate for companies to tell us how awesome their products are; it's up to us to recognize which things are necessities and which are luxuries.

Re: That awkward moment when Apple mocked good hardware and poor people

#377

Post by smarx007 »

bryondowd wrote: post #339
smarx007 wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

First, let's get the internet part clear. Mobile internet is consistently more expensive that fixed line (in xUSSR at least). And as somebody with more than 1 degree, I can tell you that you don't need an iphone map, phone, alarm, or camera functionality to make your life better, while internet and email on a mobile device is counterproductive. If you really want to save money and get better, go buy a core 2 duo desk…

Well, I pay $5 for the limited data plan on my phone, here in the US (Walmart Family Mobile). That's on top of $25/mo primary line and $20/mo additional lines. The cheapest internet line for my home I could find was around $30 at a promotional rate, which bumped up to $45 after a year. Yes, I can get more data per dollar out of that $45 line, but aside from entertainment purposes, I can get by on my 1GB of data. Or I…

I now live in EU and can relate to your experiences. But when I was referring to what struggling folk need, I meant what can really improve their position. And I hope you understand that it's not something like 9gag, but udacity. And udacity is a pain on a tablet (let alone phone) if you do the exercises.

Re: That awkward moment when Apple mocked good hardware and poor people

#378

Post by tuukkah »

siegecraft wrote: post #332
qznc wrote: post #268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just never enter your Google password into your Android phone. The problem is: Access to the App Store. Not sure, if you can work around this.

You could use alternative app stores (Amazon's comes to mind, although of course you have to sign in to amazon for that) or download APKs directly.

F-Droid is the free app store.

Re: That awkward moment when Apple mocked good hardware and poor people

#379

Post by ChemicalWarfare »

sickbeard wrote: post #110

Story time! My gf and I went to take pictures of some expensive cars at an Audi dealership. While there one of the nicely dressed sales people started talking to us about the Q7. He quoted about 70k cdn as a starting price and argued, sure it was an expensive car but it lasts longer and you save money in the long run. I think maybe that's what apple was trying to get across, buy some quality hardware that is updated…

Total Cost of Ownership on imports is brutal even when compared to similarly priced domestic cars like let's say a Grand Cherokee in this case.

So while I do agree that in some cases it makes sense to invest a little more (I'm typing this on a top of the line MSI laptop after all) - cars are not the best example here for a variety of reasons.

Re: That awkward moment when Apple mocked good hardware and poor people

#380

Post by eropple »

julianozen wrote: post #357
vbezhenar wrote: post #32

I can't imagine how I would replace my laptop with iPad. Some tasks are definitely doable: Web browsing, Mail processing, Music listening, Skype (though chatting on iPad is terrible because you have to switch around all the time, losing your focus, may be split apps might help, can't experience it, because my iPad have RAM like 15-year old PC). Generally speaking for power user every activity on iPad is strictly wors…

Apple has already explained this. Car vs Trucks. Apple isn't trying to replace your professional tool. Apple is trying to make a computer that is easy to use, can handle some light tasks that some people need occasionally, can stream video lightly and can play lots of games. You need a truck. Most people just need cars

Implicit in what you're saying is that the iPad is a good "car". I tend to disagree. Its ability to execute even "light tasks", like writing a three- or four-paragraph email, is significantly worse than even a Chromebook. And a perfectly usable Chromebook costs a quarter of what the iPad does. Fewer games, but better actually-important-stuff.
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