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How One Stupid Tweet Blew Up Justine Sacco’s Life

nytimes.com

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Re: How One Stupid Tweet Blew Up Justine Sacco’s Life

#361

Post by 21echoes »

russelluresti wrote: post #240
danso wrote: post #17

I'd like to think that as the world gets more saturated in constant social media and sharing, that we'd have a higher tolerance for things...in this case, a joke that if a person told it to you, with the right tone of voice, it'd be funny...imagine Louis CK making that quip. But no, I doubt it...I think it's more a physical limitation of our brains...we just don't have the brain system designed to adequately consider…

I feel like most people realized the tweet was a joke. But a "HAHA isn't racism funny?" joke by a white person just isn't socially acceptable anymore. Personally, I'm in the camp where I believe that you should be able to joke about anything, but I know I'm in the minority. As a society, we have judged that certain things can't be joked about. This list includes "racist jokes made by white people". Personally, this j…

it's hard to read the joke as having any purpose other than the same one as the famous-ish political cartoon about coverage of ebola victims: http://www.episcopalcafe.com/lead/Faye%20on%20media%20respon...

Is being cynical and self-deprecating really such an unacceptable packaging of the message that someone should be fired over it?

Re: How One Stupid Tweet Blew Up Justine Sacco’s Life

#362

Post by spb »

paulhauggis wrote: post #219

This is the reality of social media. If you offend the wrong person, you will most likely get fired from your job and or get unwanted attention in other parts of your life..all for just expressing an opinion. It's essentially online bullying by people that want to silence you for having an opinion that is different than their own. The ex-Mozilla CEO knows this well. An online bullying campaign was launched against hi…

> The ex-Mozilla CEO knows this well. An online bullying campaign was launched against him and he was forced to quit.

It's kind of weird to think that Brendan Eich is still active in the web standards community, even though he's been forced to leave Mozilla. A man without a company.

Re: How One Stupid Tweet Blew Up Justine Sacco’s Life

#363

Post by GhotiFish »

chris_wot wrote: post #146
EvanKelly wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not really understanding how the wikipedia community operates, why were you irritated by the signature and how was writing the comments such an irreconcilable wrong? Were they inappropriate comments?

The comments weren't awful. It was really a bad judgement call because it violated the principle "don't be disruptive to make a point", which I really didn't consider very clearly before doing it. The reason I was annoyed about it was because signatures are the way you see who is saying something in a conversation thread. Back then you'd click on the person's username and get easy access to their pages, talk page, bl…

You'll have to forgive me, because even after you explained it, I still don't understand.

If someone has a link in their signature pointing to an unassigned user name, then grabbing that username could also be interpreted at plugging a security hole as a stop gap measure while the problem is being discussed.

I don't see how it's outrageous. I don't see how you overstepped your bounds.

It's not clear to me what happened here.

Re: How One Stupid Tweet Blew Up Justine Sacco’s Life

#364

Post by protomyth »

gear54rus wrote: post #254
protomyth wrote: post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"justice were being democratized" = mob rule same as it ever was, now with a lot less effort from the mob

I'd say for a mob it may even be understandable (if you decided to roll with us, you're in for a full trip), we are talking about deeds after all, not empty words. Here, it's just ridiculous.

But the empty words now result in people being fired and blacklisted, with as little effort as writing a sentence or a retweet. The mob doesn't even have to be in the same ballpark as truth. The worse thing is these things are picked up by newspapers trying to tap into social and making them "the official record".

Re: How One Stupid Tweet Blew Up Justine Sacco’s Life

#365

Post by ChikkaChiChi »

The article cites the destruction of self-respect as being in some ways worse than a punishment of death. I could argue that those that participate in this sort of public shaming have a lack of self-respect and seek the thrill of dragging everyone else down to their level.

Sadly, there will never be a lack of self-confidence, which means that there will never be a shortage of these sorts of things happening.

I wish humanity was better than this.

Re: How One Stupid Tweet Blew Up Justine Sacco’s Life

#366

Post by tjradcliffe »

jimbokun wrote: post #274
foehp wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is deceptive to characterize angry comments posted online as a "lynch mob".

It's hyperbole, as the victim doesn't actually die. But there are certainly similarities. They were able to get Sacco fired. They were able to mobilize someone to take her picture right after her plane landed. And she had to leave Cape Town because "no one could guarantee her safety". So, it could have easily escalated into a real lynch mob. How about people getting "swatted" by internet vigilantes? So the "not dying…

Not only is someone bound to end up dead, based on past human behaviour the majority of shamers will claim they deserved it, and feel no shame themselves for their part in the death of an innocent. Diffusion of responsibility is a terrible thing: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diffusion_of_responsibility

Re: How One Stupid Tweet Blew Up Justine Sacco’s Life

#367

Post by jasonlotito »

ll123 wrote: post #300
coldpie wrote: post #255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The ex-Mozilla CEO knows this well. An online bullying campaign was launched against him and he was forced to quit. Hahahahahahaha no. Eich paid money to political campaigns to ensure that some of his own employees and fellow citizens would not have basic human rights. Then, he refused to apologize for it and dodged the question when asked if he would do it again. That's not "expressing an opinion," that's nearly s…

Do you think people should get fired and ostracized for donating to Planned Parenthood? They literally murder babies. What kind of person thinks murder is ok, and would donate money to help an organization systematically murder? This kind of person does not belong in a position of power, full stop.

> Do you think people should get fired and ostracized for donating to Planned Parenthood?

Yes, I think people, in a position where PR is a part of their role such as CEO, that work toward things that cause substantial outcry that prevent him from doing his job, should probably not be in that position.

Or are you saying that you'd think someone working against the ideals of Planned Parenthood in their own time would be suited to lead it?

You might disagree with the reasons, but the reality is, he couldn't do his job because of the outcry. So, the fundamental question becomes: Do you think someone should get fired for not being able to do their job?

Re: How One Stupid Tweet Blew Up Justine Sacco’s Life

#368

Post by andybak »

gearoidoc wrote: post #275
andybak wrote: post #266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fair? Do you really think so? If so you terrify me. I've done plenty of really f*cking stupid things in my time. I'm very thankful most of them were offline or pre-internet.

You're terrified by the idea that someone should be fired for gross unprofessionalism? To repeat: she did not deserve ANY bullying or harassment whatsoever. Did you experience consequences of the stupid actions you've taken?

> To repeat: she did not deserve ANY bullying or harassment whatsoever.

That wasn't clear. You said the "outcome was fair" - the outcome was that her life was ruined.

Re: How One Stupid Tweet Blew Up Justine Sacco’s Life

#369

Post by bighi »

jonifico wrote: post #94

I actually thought it was funny. If you get offended by a thing that's so over the top it just can't be taken seriously, you sir are an absolute moron. Hate how people are just looking to get excuses to get offended and show off their 'righteousness' at the expense of other people. Point is: It's a joke. Learn the difference.

But it's not that over the top. There are A LOT of people that would say the "I'm white" comment and MEAN IT. It's not obviously over the top.

Once I saw a T-Shirt in tshirthell.com that said something like "arrest black babies before they become criminals". I don't remember the exact words. THAT is obviously and ridiculously over the top.

Re: How One Stupid Tweet Blew Up Justine Sacco’s Life

#370

Post by icebraining »

bhayden wrote: post #242
freeasinfree wrote: post #180

Comedians say much worse on a daily basis and rarely catch any flack. Are regular people not allowed to make jokes?

That is my issue with this. Daniel Tosh makes sexist, racist, and rape jokes on a daily basis and people at large aren't up in arms threatening to strike if he visits their workplace. To me this says these psuedo-activists care more about picking on an easy target than actually preventing hurtful speech. Not to mention the hypocrisy of many of those tweets when they call her a bitch, or send her death threats.

I'll let another comedian, George Carlin, explain:

There is absolutely nothing wrong with any of those words in and of themselves. They’re only words. It’s the context that counts. It’s the user. It’s the intention behind the words that makes them good or bad. The words are completely neutral. The words are innocent. I get tired of people talking about bad words and bad language.

Bullshit! It’s the context that makes them good or bad. The context. That makes them good or bad. For instance, you take the word “Nigger.” There is absolutely nothing wrong with the word “Nigger” in and of itself. It’s the racist asshole who’s using it that you ought to be concerned about. We don’t care when Richard Pryor or Eddie Murphy say it.

Why? Because we know they’re not racist. They’re Niggers! Context. Context.

We don’t mind their context because we know they’re black.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Pksx_IAHDE

In this case, people know the context of Daniel Tosh's words, therefore they don't mind. They minded here, because a Tweet has no context.

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