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Come here and work on hard problems – except the ones on our doorstep

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Re: Come here and work on hard problems – except the ones on our doorstep

#361

Post by berntb »

arethuza wrote: post #360
berntb wrote: post #337

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd guess the Polish rant is based on that Soviet really did support the anti-nuclear weapon movement, and so on. Seing conspiracy theories like those, I am strengthened in the belief that the US extreme left and right are equally crazy. In Europe we mostly see the Chomsky brigade, some variation would make it less irritating.

That rant also ignores the fact that after the 1930s (and particularly after the Spanish Civil War) it was clear that the Soviets regarded any "socialists" who weren't under their direct control as more of a threat than their apparent enemies. Most socialists in Western Europe (e.g. the UK Labour Party) were more afraid of the Soviets than those on the political right.

In e.g. Sweden, the communists stooped being Stalinists when Moscow told them that Stalin was bad... They did start to critizise the Eastern block dictators early... about 1990!

(There were also anarchists etc, but in general the non-communist extreme left-wingers were few before ~1968, when they got more numerous and varied).

Also, I remember reading surprise after 1989 on how much control Soviet had over the West European communist parties. E.g. that the Italian communist party had such an accomodating attitude by order (Soviet wanted to get a de facto split in Western/Eastern Europe.)

Re: Come here and work on hard problems – except the ones on our doorstep

#362

Post by ippisl »

dominostars wrote: post #230

San Francisco homelessness is not a question about rich vs. poor. It's a question about what to do with people who are mentally handicapped and/or drug abusers. This is partially a money problem, but it's largely a social problem. A lot of other countries deal with this better because they have stronger family support structures. Programming can help, but this isn't a programming problem. And there's no money in it,…

What programmers can do about homelessness(and poverty):

Simple. Work for places(or build startups) that:

1. Help develop better and cheaper healthcare systems, products and processes. 2. Help develop technology that reduces the price of construction and in general the cost of living. 3. Help non profits and social entrepreneurs. 4. Help political change through technology.

And yes, doing some of this things might mean less wages , and not living in San Francisco.

Re: Come here and work on hard problems – except the ones on our doorstep

#363

Post by pessimizer »

regis wrote: post #231
pessimizer wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're projecting your desires for a bit of freedom from the rat-race onto the homeless.

Perhaps a bit, but these comments are also based on real conversations with homeless people in SF.

You can project onto people you're having conversations with.

Re: Come here and work on hard problems – except the ones on our doorstep

#364

Post by arethuza »

berntb wrote: post #361
arethuza wrote: post #360

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That rant also ignores the fact that after the 1930s (and particularly after the Spanish Civil War) it was clear that the Soviets regarded any "socialists" who weren't under their direct control as more of a threat than their apparent enemies. Most socialists in Western Europe (e.g. the UK Labour Party) were more afraid of the Soviets than those on the political right.

In e.g. Sweden, the communists stooped being Stalinists when Moscow told them that Stalin was bad... They did start to critizise the Eastern block dictators early... about 1990! (There were also anarchists etc, but in general the non-communist extreme left-wingers were few before ~1968, when they got more numerous and varied). Also, I remember reading surprise after 1989 on how much control Soviet had over the West E…

I don't know about anywhere else but in the UK there was a very large "socialist" party in Labour and tiny "communist" parties that never really had much power.

Re: Come here and work on hard problems – except the ones on our doorstep

#365

Post by redbad »

bmmayer1 wrote: post #351
scotty79 wrote: post #349

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You probably are strongly opinionated and people you meet are strongly biased subset of Europeans. I personally know no one that would want to live in US. Even the entrepreneurial types. They are aware about rampant litigation, exorbitant costs of even simplest medical procedures that is reflected in costs of health insurance and sheer volume of US tax code. I knew one person though, who went to US to buy some goods…

Actually, most of my European friends are socialists, but that's not the point. We live in a global economy, and people want to go where the opportunities are, and there are still a lot of opportunities here, especially for upwardly mobile young Europeans who are having trouble finding employment what with a near 50% youth unemployment rate in some countries.

    > with a near 50% youth unemployment rate in some 
    > countries.
Can you name one besides Spain?

Re: Come here and work on hard problems – except the ones on our doorstep

#366

Post by ohwp »

onemorepassword wrote: post #183
tokenadult wrote: post #162

Places with good weather have huge visible homeless populations. (I have traveled all over the United States, and have been to all fifty states. AFTER EDIT: I have been in, and have lived in, gritty "skid row" neighborhoods of large United States cities, and have lived in Los Angeles.) Places with lousy weather, like the place where I grew up and now live, certainly have people who are "homeless" in the sense of not…

There is no Europe. I can only speak for my country, the Netherlands, and there is no such thing as people not having the personal funds to buy or rent housing. That's why we have minimum wages, social security, rent subsidies and regulated rent. The homeless here are people mostly people with mental health issues that reject or don't respond to treatment. It's by far not a perfect utopian system, but to have people…

I'm also from the Netherlands and working with homeless people in my spare time.

"The homeless here are people mostly people with mental health issues that reject or don't respond to treatment." Well in most cases it's the other way around. They become mentally ill because of being homeless (and lonely, and drugs all around to 'ease' the pain).

Did you know there are homeless people in the Netherlands that have a job? Divorced, have to pay child alimony so they don't have enough money to pay the rent. There are children that have a home but can't call it home, so they prefer to live in the streets.

And there are a lot of people with a home but without gas and/or electricity because they can't afford it. They aren't homeless but imagine living in a house when it's -7 degrees outside (most of the time they can add like 3 degrees to the outside temperature).

What I'm trying to say is that a lot of the failure of civilized society is hidden.

Re: Come here and work on hard problems – except the ones on our doorstep

#367

Post by coldtea »

LekkoscPiwa wrote: post #268
pyoung wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The lack of universal health care probably exacerbates the homelessness situation in the U.S. With that said, what you see in San Francisco is largely a product of the combination of homeless friendly policies and tolerable weather. Many of the 'homeless' you see during the day don't actually sleep on the street (although a decent number do) and actually reside in SRO's, subsidized housing, and shelters (One complain…

European nations would not be able to afford universal healthcare and all the welfare if they had to pay for their security. US bases in Europe are great financial aid. I never hear discussions about Iran or Russia being a possible threat in Europe. I do in the US. Which is funny because it really is much bigger problem for Europeans to have guys like Putin and Mahmoud Ahmadinejad at their door steps. Never happens.…

>European nations would not be able to afford universal healthcare and all the welfare if they had to pay for their security. US bases in Europe are great financial aid.

This is the kind of statement that only an American, and a very naive and ignorant of world matters at that, would ever make. US bases in Europe are no security at all.

They are a pest, relics of the cold war and unwelcome by the people of Western Europe. The US took advantage of the battered post-WWII European states and the (then real) threat of USSR, to promote NATO and establish army bases in Europe.

>I never hear discussions about Iran or Russia being a possible threat in Europe.

That's because a lot of Europeans actually follow world news and foreign policy and are not spoon fed the latest "enemies" by their media. Oh, and they travel to those "enemy" places and have been dealing with them, culturally, diplomatically and otherwise, for a millennium of so, instead of just hearing about them whenever their media gets its war mood on.

People in America can think that Iran or Russia are "a possible treat" because they rarely follow what's happening outside their hometown, and because all those ludicrous hollywood movies (I've seen tiny nations in Eastern Europe that their military couldn't hurt a fly even if they tried being portrayed as epicenters of plans to attack the US).

Discussing Iran as a (non terrorist) threat to Europe or the US is the kind of thing that only people needing advice from their Media to not conflate Chechnya and the Czech republic would consider.

>The thing that really gets on my nerves is that some politicians even want the US bases to be moved out from Europe. They simply don't understand the world in which they are living.

Oh, the irony.

Re: Come here and work on hard problems – except the ones on our doorstep

#368

Post by coldtea »

LekkoscPiwa wrote: post #280
entropy_ wrote: post #276

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had honestly never heard about this before, what does the U.S. pay to countries that have bases in them? Any references? I'm honestly curious

Never heard that there are for example over 50,000 US soldiers in Germany operating military equipment worth billions of USD courtesy of the US tax-payer? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Army_Europe So, any attack on the German soil must result in dead American soldiers. Now, who sane would risk doing so? Yeah, very convenient preaching universal healthcare and welfare for the poor when somebody else pays…

>Never heard that there are for example over 50,000 US soldiers in Germany operating military equipment worth billions of USD courtesy of the US tax-payer?

The US, acting as a post-colonial superpower, took advantage of the collapsed post-WWII Germany, to setup a protectorate in the heart of Europe. The country was divided in two, and the Eastern side was given to USSR to play with, whereas the west was the US/NATO frontier to eastern Europe.

The "US bases in Germany" are a relic of this past. And they were meant to establish a stronghold on Europe, and keep the USSR at check. Now they also serve as operations base for missions to further pursue US interests (i.e exploit local people) in Middle East and Africa.

Despite what BS you have been fed, no Iran, no Iraq, no Syria and nobody bloody else, including Putin's Russia, would ever attempt to

To understand how inane your beliefs are to actually foreign affairs savvy Europeans, non fed with Fox News and Glen Beck and non provincial, it would be like South Dakota attacking Texas. Nay, it would be like Fargo attacking Texas.

Re: Come here and work on hard problems – except the ones on our doorstep

#369

Post by berntb »

arethuza wrote: post #364
berntb wrote: post #361

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In e.g. Sweden, the communists stooped being Stalinists when Moscow told them that Stalin was bad... They did start to critizise the Eastern block dictators early... about 1990! (There were also anarchists etc, but in general the non-communist extreme left-wingers were few before ~1968, when they got more numerous and varied). Also, I remember reading surprise after 1989 on how much control Soviet had over the West E…

I don't know about anywhere else but in the UK there was a very large "socialist" party in Labour and tiny "communist" parties that never really had much power.

I thought Labor was ~ Social Democrat? Maybe shocking to right wing crazies, but hardly _Socialist_ in a modern use of the language?

(But OK, even I know that Labor have changed a lot over the last 50-60 years.)

Re: Come here and work on hard problems – except the ones on our doorstep

#370

Post by LekkoscPiwa »

coldtea wrote: post #367
LekkoscPiwa wrote: post #268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

European nations would not be able to afford universal healthcare and all the welfare if they had to pay for their security. US bases in Europe are great financial aid. I never hear discussions about Iran or Russia being a possible threat in Europe. I do in the US. Which is funny because it really is much bigger problem for Europeans to have guys like Putin and Mahmoud Ahmadinejad at their door steps. Never happens.…

> European nations would not be able to afford universal healthcare and all the welfare if they had to pay for their security. US bases in Europe are great financial aid. This is the kind of statement that only an American, and a very naive and ignorant of world matters at that, would ever make. US bases in Europe are no security at all. They are a pest, relics of the cold war and unwelcome by the people of Western E…

Your argumentation is pathetic and typical of many Europeans. Americans are stupid. That's the beginning, middle and end of your idea about the country and your only argument in the discussion.

You are the one who should learn more about Iran or Russia. You are the one naive like a child who thinks everybody's nice, while they are playing you. It was the same with Hitler (who some of you still claim was a great leader). It was the same with Stalin (who many of you still love in Europe). It's the same with Iran now. Seeing world in white & black only isn't good, but going deep into color spectrum so much that you don't see obvious is not too smart neither. Especially given your history of ignorance in the face of threats.

EDIT: "argument" instead of "voice" from here: "country and your only argument"

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