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Danish government agency to ditch Microsoft software (2025)

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Re: Danish government agency to ditch Microsoft software (2025)

#361

Post by jongjong »

pydry wrote: post #204
ilikerashers wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Europe has just been catastrophically slow in developing anything related to it's own tech infrastructure. Its doesn't back itself. Given how poor it's responding to things like the Draghi report, I wouldn't anticipate success. Just more flailing around and working groups.

There are plenty of european hosts (e.g. hetzner) and with payments systems the technology is rarely the problem it's the politics. I imagine EPI will have no problem succeeding. The major problem Europe has (mentioned in the draghi report) is with industrial competitiveness and strategy and access to cheap energy. With the former it's not like the US is doing any better though. I dont think anybody in the west even…

Yes, it's glaringly obvious to me that they've been actively suppressing their own tech sector. Feels like a lot of EU politicians owned shares of US tech companies.

This effect of politicians making decisions based on what corporate shares they own is ubiquitous now.

In the other direction, I even wonder if US threats about Greenland were related to this trend of Denmark moving off US big tech. I feel like the real game is military coercion dressed up as economics.

I suspect if people knew the real reasons behind each political decision, they'd be shocked. I'm sure it's all 100% about money; about taking as much as possible whilst giving as little in exchange as possible; filling the gap with pure coercion.

Re: Danish government agency to ditch Microsoft software (2025)

#362

Post by close04 »

bobmcnamara wrote: post #172
close04 wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Someone yanked your chain with this one. Nobody gets a house or a job at Microsoft for buying Microsoft, these cases can't even register in the statistic of the total volume of orders. Every tech company would buy you a house if that worked, when a house is always a rounding error on the value of the contracts we're talking about. They buy it because it's the "safe", "does everything" choice that "everyone else has".…

> Nobody gets a house or a job at Microsoft for buying Microsoft... This is the same Microsoft we're talking about right? https://finance.yahoo.com/news/microsoft-pays-25-million-end... https://techcentral.co.za/eoh-microsoft-ensnared-in-sec-corr... https://www.wsj.com/tech/former-microsoft-employee-alleges-b... Any fines that allow profitable operations are no more than a tax.

This is the same comment we’re referring to right? The one that said that MS gets contracts because they buy houses and cars or give jobs to the people deciding where the contract goes?

That’s someone who read a couple of articles on corruption and just extrapolated to “all of it must be the same”.

Re: Danish government agency to ditch Microsoft software (2025)

#363

Post by wiredpancake »

flopsamjetsam wrote: post #355
Mashimo wrote: post #15

I work in software development for Danish hospitals, and some regions already used OpenOffice, now libre office, for .. well over 15 years. At least in parts. We integrate with an API into libreoffice, and it more or less did not change in well over a decade. But sometimes libreoffice crashes and you can't figure out why. There are just no logs. It feels like a black box at times. But I don't think they will be switc…

> But I don't think they will be switching away from Teams as quickly. I'm interested to know why Teams is so sticky for the team. Are there not good replacements available? I've used it a little, but am by no means a power user.

Because 'Teams' isn't just a simple meeting application. It's very feature rich. If you ever have to deal with the admin.teams.microsoft portal you'll know how many options and toggles it has.

Alongside this many businesses deploy 'Teams Supported' or 'Teams Enabled' devices into meeting and conference rooms. Yealink is a popular brand, they don't have baked in support for LibreMeet or whatever meeting products exist.

Re: Danish government agency to ditch Microsoft software (2025)

#364

Post by close04 »

Foobar8568 wrote: post #299
close04 wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Someone yanked your chain with this one. Nobody gets a house or a job at Microsoft for buying Microsoft, these cases can't even register in the statistic of the total volume of orders. Every tech company would buy you a house if that worked, when a house is always a rounding error on the value of the contracts we're talking about. They buy it because it's the "safe", "does everything" choice that "everyone else has".…

I can't quote examples for obvious reasons. Since you quoted Microsoft, remember this? https://www.dhs.gov/archive/news/2024/04/02/cyber-safety-rev... you have other companies that have a much better track record on Security. If you browse HN everyday, at least once a weak, you'll see security issues related to Azure and Microsoft product, to the point that Microsoft stopped bounty programs or don't include some prod…

If you want to establish a pattern or rule you’ll need way more than one example you can’t give.

Is Google’s search engine used just because they give money to those who do? Because they pay Apple and Mozilla. Just set Google as default and the check’s in the mail right?

The last paragraph was obviously a diss at MS for costing a lot in support and having shitty security. Anyone with first hand experience (as opposed to hearing the stories) with MS contracts and heard the justifications again and again doesn’t need the joke explained.

Re: Danish government agency to ditch Microsoft software (2025)

#365

Post by troad »

teekert wrote: post #189
troad wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I don't see what you mean with your remark about the balkanized internet, the problems is we've been building our systems in US walled gardens, and now we want our freedom back. The short version is that Europe's influence on tech is going to be significantly reduced by Europe trying to silo itself off from the rest of the world. If Europe becomes even more marginal of a market than it is now, then the established…

Those are good points indeed, I didn't look at it that way before. Thanx. Edit: You made me think, there are downsides indeed. But we still need to not be spied upon by the US, and we still don't need International Criminal Court judges have their email blocked in retaliation.

There are definitely up- and downsides. This is all much trickier than I think people realise, with complex second and third order effects. (Some that I haven't even mentioned. A more nationalised Internet will hurt smaller countries, for example, that cannot create services on par with US juggernauts. It will harm third countries that are neither the EU or the US. It will weaken the West's collective influence vis-à-vis China, Africa, etc.)

I don't know what the optimal course of action is.

Re: Danish government agency to ditch Microsoft software (2025)

#367

Post by aucisson_masque »

partiallypro wrote: post #321
rambojohnson wrote: post #171

Europe’s reading the room and building exits. They’re also cutting dependence on Visa/Mastercard because tying your payment rails to a declining, unstable empire is a bad long-term bet. Wero, the digital euro, local infrastructure, all of it points to the same thing: financial sovereignty matters when America looks more like a geopolitical liability. my read is that 2026 to 2027 is basically Europe saying, "we should…

I don't know how to break this to you, but Europe itself has been the burning building for 20 years. I don't see that changing any time soon. The anti-US stuff is largely flailing, the US is better positioned than Europe for the next 20 years also. They struggle with investment, have almost no large companies left of any merit in tech, have political problems that are similar to the US's, and regulate themselves to d…

That's extremely condescending and naive. I'd say Europe citizen are in much better situation than the usa citizens, don't care about tech sector or shareholder revenue.

Usa still don't even have universal social security and medications are overpriced 10 time more. Just to name a few.

Then there is the American debt. Good luck with that when countries are switching from dollar to yen and euro. No really, I think that there are enough challenge to overcome in the states that you don't need to be condescending.

Re: Danish government agency to ditch Microsoft software (2025)

#368

Post by aucisson_masque »

prerok wrote: post #329
gizzlon wrote: post #247

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "Data sovereignty" is now an important parameter when chosing supplier. I hope you're right! I'm a backend dev and engineer, and I would love to specialize in helping companies off US cloud. Haven't found a lot of interest here in Norway so far..

In my experience, companies are perfectly happy with US companies, as long as the data doesn't leave Europe. This means we have to prove we only store data in European datacenters. I guess that's fine for now, but it would be better if we could get European alternatives to AWS or GCP.

USA companies are subject to us laws, so any data will never be safe. Companies can be gagged, forced to seal their customer data and forced to lie about it, by law !

Re: Danish government agency to ditch Microsoft software (2025)

#370

Post by themafia »

rambojohnson wrote: post #171

Europe’s reading the room and building exits. They’re also cutting dependence on Visa/Mastercard because tying your payment rails to a declining, unstable empire is a bad long-term bet. Wero, the digital euro, local infrastructure, all of it points to the same thing: financial sovereignty matters when America looks more like a geopolitical liability. my read is that 2026 to 2027 is basically Europe saying, "we should…

> to a declining, unstable empire

It's funny that we've wrapped the clock all the way around and people don't see Europe as the declining and unstable empires anymore.

> less like stable infrastructure

It's perfectly stable. The news makes a lot of money generating interesting in overstating this problem. The supreme court is designed for national stability. It is doing it's job. It just doesn't act _instantly_, and if you're aiming for actual stability, you don't want it to.

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