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Tesla is committing automotive suicide

electrek.co

361–370 of 458 posts

Re: Tesla is committing automotive suicide

#361
post #356

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And now the US has its own car manufacturer literally started by a Nazi. If you dislike Nazis, is that rational or emotional?

I actually don't really care if he's a nice person or not, just like I don't care who the CEO of other car makers are. But for the record I think it's pretty silly to call him a Nazi.

How many Sieg Heils do you have to do consecutively before it’s NOT silly to be called a nazi? In your opinion

Re: Tesla is committing automotive suicide

#362

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I actually don't really care if he's a nice person or not, just like I don't care who the CEO of other car makers are. But for the record I think it's pretty silly to call him a Nazi.

How many Sieg Heils do you have to do consecutively before it’s NOT silly to be called a nazi? In your opinion

I saw more of an awkward guy doing a weird gesture, either because he was trying to be edgy, or he meant it as something else. He might even have done it as an ill advised joke because people were already calling him one.

It's silly to call him a nazi because he doesn't fit the profile well at all. It only works if you redefine nazi to be whatever you don't agree with at the moment. This might even be harmful, as it's an obvious strawman that provides cover for his real faults.

He denies being a nazi. We can take his word on that. One thing about nazis is they are weren't shy about their beliefs.

Re: Tesla is committing automotive suicide

#363

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not in principle, mind you. It's just that the company has stalled every major project they started, and, so far, completed a rather shitty an uninspiring one in Vegas that has no reason to exist in the first place (it's subway but with Teslas instead of trains). Its only purpose is to prevent the money from being spent on viable public transportation projects, and in that sense, it's very interesting that it got so…

Or, digging tunnels is a lot harder than expected and there have been no big technical leaps to change that. The idea is great, but only if the cost goes down and digging speed goes up by a lot. I assume you got a cut of the $23bn my state took with the promise of a high-speed rail, which afaik is the only "viable(?!)" transportation project that could have been affected by this, or you just hate subways/subterranean…

The idea isn’t great, tunnels for cars or pods have really low throughput (low occupancy + safety margin headways, even at a high speed). And it hinged on them magically revolutionising an already highly mature field, which surprise, surprise didn’t work out.

If it had been possible to speed up and reduce the cost of tunneling, the thing that would most make sense is running regular trains through them. But they never had any real ideas to actually make it cheaper or faster (apart for making it too small for proper emergency egress), just the idea that SV tech guys would be able to find a way to do it.

Re: Tesla is committing automotive suicide

#364

I bought a new Model Y a few months ago. On the whole, it's a great car, it really is. They've pretty much nailed the fundamentals. It's opinionated, not unlike Apple, but if the opinions work for you you'll enjoy the car. But there are shortcomings, and they are jarring. The parking sensors basically don't work at all due to being vision only - and apparently can't be made to work properly. The lane change and rever…

>There is so much motivated reasoning around this brand that it's hard to take any article like the above, or half the comments in this thread, seriously.

Funny, because for the last year, any submission that have Tesla or Musk or Musk associated with something negative have been flagged very quickly. I assume by Musk fanboys. So when an article or two slips the Crack, it naturally is filled with criticism. Survivor bias at its finest.

Your criticism paragraph being longer than "it really is great!" paragraph does point towards motivated reasoning going both ways.

Re: Tesla is committing automotive suicide

#366

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Things scale so differently, we don’t need a parts list to make a general tradeoff relationship. Of the moon and orbital, orbit is much closer and will be cheaper to start with. But a lunar site would scale to much greater mean density and unlimited total capacities. And be much cheaper for reasons I gave, at some threshold scale. Neither is easy, and it’s not at all clear that either is actually better than down her…

I'm not asking for a parts list, I'm asking for math

if you want some math beyond identifying different scaling issues, go for it.

Re: Tesla is committing automotive suicide

#367

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I kind of don't really care, as long as I get good service if my car is affected. I'm not defending them here. The next few years will tell if it was a bad buy or not. So far I'm really happy with it. My point was there's a huge anti-Tesla bias entirely as a reaction to Elon Musk. It's emotional, not rational. It's not objective criticism of Tesla. Sure, there are some awful moves he's made, vision only, FSD claims,…

Outside of the personal opinions of Musk, what is the most annoying for me is the constant false promises. They sell cars based on promises that a missing function will work in a few months/years and that your car will be compatible. With the years of feedback we have now, we know that those were not promises but lies. Other brands sell as-is cars, without empty promises. (outside the stupid "perfect outback trip" in…

Thanks for the thoughtful response. You know what, I do feel a bit conned by this vision only implementation. It wasn't obvious when we test drove it, and they didn't mention it. When we picked the car up, on the shop floor, before it had even moved we saw the "Park Assist Degraded" warning and questioned it. They assured us it just needed time to calibrate. It has never gone away. It will never go away.

As a consumer, I'm pissed off. I do feel conned.

But I'm fine explaining Musk's promises away as hubris. He made promises he should not have, and couldn't keep. He shouldn't have done it, but I do think he believed it. I don't think it was an intent to mislead. Incompetence before malice and so on.

He deserves credit where credit is due. He did push us into the EV era.

Re: Tesla is committing automotive suicide

#368

I bought a new Model Y a few months ago. On the whole, it's a great car, it really is. They've pretty much nailed the fundamentals. It's opinionated, not unlike Apple, but if the opinions work for you you'll enjoy the car. But there are shortcomings, and they are jarring. The parking sensors basically don't work at all due to being vision only - and apparently can't be made to work properly. The lane change and rever…

>There is so much motivated reasoning around this brand that it's hard to take any article like the above, or half the comments in this thread, seriously. Funny, because for the last year, any submission that have Tesla or Musk or Musk associated with something negative have been flagged very quickly. I assume by Musk fanboys. So when an article or two slips the Crack, it naturally is filled with criticism. Survivor…

If I said I wasn't a Musk or Tesla fanboy, I would expect you to take me at my word. I gave a two sided account of my Tesla experience. I do like this car, and I bought it because I liked it.

Maybe it gets flagged because there's no chance of having an intellectually honest discussion if it involves Elon or Tesla? I certainly don't flag them.

Re: Tesla is committing automotive suicide

#369

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How many Sieg Heils do you have to do consecutively before it’s NOT silly to be called a nazi? In your opinion

I saw more of an awkward guy doing a weird gesture, either because he was trying to be edgy, or he meant it as something else. He might even have done it as an ill advised joke because people were already calling him one. It's silly to call him a nazi because he doesn't fit the profile well at all. It only works if you redefine nazi to be whatever you don't agree with at the moment. This might even be harmful, as it'…

> because people were already calling him one.

Now if that's not the darndest coincidence.

Re: Tesla is committing automotive suicide

#370
post #369

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I saw more of an awkward guy doing a weird gesture, either because he was trying to be edgy, or he meant it as something else. He might even have done it as an ill advised joke because people were already calling him one. It's silly to call him a nazi because he doesn't fit the profile well at all. It only works if you redefine nazi to be whatever you don't agree with at the moment. This might even be harmful, as it'…

> because people were already calling him one. Now if that's not the darndest coincidence.

Godwin's Law. But without the usual irony.
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