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ChatControl: EU wants to scan all private messages, even in encrypted apps

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Re: ChatControl: EU wants to scan all private messages, even in encrypted apps

#361

Post by vslira »

gjsman-1000 wrote: post #325
demosito666 wrote: post #323

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What exactly did those people taste that it got them upset so much and who exactly those "people" are? Last time I checked these laws are pushed through as covertly and sneaky as possible and no "people" asked for them. I can't recall any demonstrations with protesters asking to violate their privacy to keep them safe for those evil internet trolls that want to have a sexual intercourse with their relatives. You're t…

> You're trying to frame the classic authoritarian power grab Half of US states now have age verification for pornography; three will be requiring age verification to even download apps soon. There is indeed a push from society to get the internet under control, even if the EU is not necessarily connected the same way. This is a huge, unprecedented reversal of opinion over the last decade that has almost completely g…

> Nobody believes in a free internet anymore.

Civil liberties, like elections and liberal principles in general, are unfortunately only popular when the right side (coincidentally one's own) is winning

Re: ChatControl: EU wants to scan all private messages, even in encrypted apps

#362

Post by hollerith »

mapontosevenths wrote: post #337
logicchains wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nazi Germany, Communist China and Soviet Russia have by far the largest number of deaths by _men with guns_, over a hundred million people killed by their own governments. The guns of US citizens have so far prevented this kind of government-led mass citizen genocide from happening. The number of people killed by gun violence in the US is a rounding error compared to the number of people killed by Mao, Hitler and Sta…

> The guns of US citizens have so far prevented this kind of government-led mass citizen genocide from happening. No they haven't. Our system of checks and balances has. At no point has there been a civil war in which the US's citizens attempted to fight back against the US military. If there were, the citizens would lose without even presenting a challenge.

>the citizens would lose without even presenting a challenge.

That's not true. The US Army spent 20 years and trillions of dollars trying to impose regime change on Afghanistan, but were defeated by a group (the Taliban) that had very little military capability beyond men with rifles and some explosives to make improvised bombs. (Yes, they also had decades-old weapons with which to shoot down helicopters.) Algeria's war of independence from France in the 1950s and early 1960s is another example where a group with very little in the way of military capability defeated one of the most powerful militaries in the world.

I don't necessarily buy the argument that the US should continue with the gun status quo just because all those guns would come in handy in a revolution, but you haven't successfully refuted the argument.

Re: ChatControl: EU wants to scan all private messages, even in encrypted apps

#363

Post by gambiting »

nickslaughter02 wrote: post #315
txrx0000 wrote: post #287

Dear citizens of the EU: If this gets pushed through, you will gradually lose control of your government much like how the people of the UK already lost control of theirs. What are you going to do when the government's interests inevitably drift out of alignment with yours? Start a political movement? You will have the police knocking on your door for criticizing the establishment. Start a revolution? You have no wea…

> you will gradually lose control of your government That happened the moment European countries surrendered their sovereignty to EU.

Which of course never happened, as each member country retains full sovereignty in every possible way you can think of, which is actually fully enshrined in the way EU works.

Re: ChatControl: EU wants to scan all private messages, even in encrypted apps

#364

Post by mystraline »

jimbo808 wrote: post #243
like_any_other wrote: post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, what is "the problem"? Is it children being abused, or is it the distribution of CSAM? And if you say both - how would you rate the relative severity of the two problems? Specifically, if you had to pick between preventing the rape of a child, and preventing N acts of CSAM distribution, how big would N have to be to make it worth choosing the latter?

I don't think they care what N is, they are just scapegoating a vile group they know will have no defenders, and they can use it to silence the critics by associating them with that group.

Bingo.

Today its the pedophiles and 15-17-philes (those are this fake group adolescent, which are also tried as adults when convenient).

Tomorrow, its the adult sex workers.

Then its the fringe group's topics that is on the outs with the majority.

Then they come for you, and nobody is able to speak up because they banned protests.

... To paraphrase Martin Niemoller.

Re: ChatControl: EU wants to scan all private messages, even in encrypted apps

#365

Post by varispeed »

DoingIsLearning wrote: post #27

This is (mostly) about Tech companies' money, namely: - Palantir Technologies - 'not-for-profit' Thorn > The Commission’s failure to identify the list of experts as falling within the scope of the complainant’s public access request constitutes maladministration. [0] > ... the complainant contended that the precision rate of technologies like those developed by the organisation are often overestimated. It is therefor…

and if people point out EU is completely corrupt and we have complete breakdown of any agencies that should keep it under control, they get downvoted.

EU turns into fascist (policies controlled by corporations) quasi state before our eyes.

If you are working for any crime agency, put away biscuits and move your lazy arse to work!

Re: ChatControl: EU wants to scan all private messages, even in encrypted apps

#366

Post by jenadine »

lovelearning wrote: post #45

Is CSA really that widespread in Europe that everyone's chat messages have to be monitored? And if it is that widespread, shouldn't they try to address it socially to prevent CSA as much as possible rather than try to catch just the subset of tech-savvy abusers, that too after they've already committed CSA?

With the access to phones, underage teenager may be taking nude pictures of themselves. They should be put in jail where they belong. /s

Re: ChatControl: EU wants to scan all private messages, even in encrypted apps

#367

Post by Saline9515 »

zkmon wrote: post #326

A nation is a concept that comes into existence only because people agree to lose some of their freedom, income and privacy. To what extent is the question. 100& privacy is not possible and it simply derails a nation, due to lack visibility and lack of control.

Indeed, the world was a chaotic place before the soviets invented CCTV and allowed therefore the creation of civilization.

Re: ChatControl: EU wants to scan all private messages, even in encrypted apps

#368

Post by potsandpans »

gjsman-1000 wrote: post #325
demosito666 wrote: post #323

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What exactly did those people taste that it got them upset so much and who exactly those "people" are? Last time I checked these laws are pushed through as covertly and sneaky as possible and no "people" asked for them. I can't recall any demonstrations with protesters asking to violate their privacy to keep them safe for those evil internet trolls that want to have a sexual intercourse with their relatives. You're t…

> You're trying to frame the classic authoritarian power grab Half of US states now have age verification for pornography; three will be requiring age verification to even download apps soon. There is indeed a push from society to get the internet under control, even if the EU is not necessarily connected the same way. This is a huge, unprecedented reversal of opinion over the last decade that has almost completely g…

[flagged]

Re: ChatControl: EU wants to scan all private messages, even in encrypted apps

#369

Post by gjsman-1000 »

potsandpans wrote: post #368
gjsman-1000 wrote: post #325

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You're trying to frame the classic authoritarian power grab Half of US states now have age verification for pornography; three will be requiring age verification to even download apps soon. There is indeed a push from society to get the internet under control, even if the EU is not necessarily connected the same way. This is a huge, unprecedented reversal of opinion over the last decade that has almost completely g…

[flagged]

Don't worry; HN makes such statements all the time, you can't accuse me of not grasping the format. On that note, not once did I use the words "complete failure" or "all people" despite your quotation in this thread, so please don't argue dishonestly yourself.

I cited a reality: We went from SOPA/PIPA over copyright, to no question about age verification on morality grounds. It shows a trend towards zero interest in free and open internet activism. Such a trend indicates something is severely wrong, and the idea of an open internet has become disconnected from popular belief, internationally, as something to strive for. Prove me wrong.

Re: ChatControl: EU wants to scan all private messages, even in encrypted apps

#370

Post by nickslaughter02 »

gambiting wrote: post #363
nickslaughter02 wrote: post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> you will gradually lose control of your government That happened the moment European countries surrendered their sovereignty to EU.

Which of course never happened, as each member country retains full sovereignty in every possible way you can think of, which is actually fully enshrined in the way EU works.

> Which of course never happened, as each member country retains full sovereignty in every possible way you can think of, which is actually fully enshrined in the way EU works.

Which of course is false.

> The principle was derived from an interpretation of the European Court of Justice, which ruled that European law has priority over any contravening national law, including the constitution of a member state itself.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Primacy_of_European_Union_law

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