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Kenvue stock drops on report RFK Jr will link autism to Tylenol during pregnancy

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Re: Kenvue stock drops on report RFK Jr will link autism to Tylenol during pregnancy

#361

Post by elcritch »

giardini wrote: post #339
elcritch wrote: post #314

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems that higher sensitivity to pain could be a very plausible cause. I believe there's studies showing lowered (and altered) pain tolerance with autism. Though I'd expect that if aspirin did have an affect that it'd change the prevalence or severity of autism in children having genes related to autism. There'd be a first order correction fornthe likelihood that aspirin is causitive by controlling for increased i…

Aspirin ???!! Its not mentioned in the OP. No one here mentioned it. WTF???!

Ugh yeah, s/aspirin/Tylenol/. My brain always wants to call Tylenol and acetaminophen as generic "aspirins" and it's a hard habit to break. Joys of having ADHD I didn't even notice the switch.

Nevertheless, comparing the observed correlations of Tylenol with aspirin and ibuprofen would be the first thing to check. Seems unlikely to me that the OP's suggestion could be controlled for that way. I'll be curious if Kennedy's report checks those basic things.

Re: Kenvue stock drops on report RFK Jr will link autism to Tylenol during pregnancy

#362

Post by elcritch »

sheepybloke wrote: post #351
azinman2 wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

According to my friend who is a geneticist, 30% of cases of autism can be found in DNA. Clearly not all cases are.

That's what our genetic councilor said as well. It's important to note autism is a spectrum and quite varied, some of it genetic and some of it related to other factors.

I've read some studies which suggest there's a variety of genes which are linked to autism as well as link to both autism and ADHD. I believe those genes are linked to how different brain circuits interact.

It makes a lot of sense given with I've seen talked a lot about in autism and adhd groups, with some symptoms overlapping.

Re: Kenvue stock drops on report RFK Jr will link autism to Tylenol during pregnancy

#364

Post by dotnet00 »

Izkata wrote: post #310
CogitoCogito wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The irony is that if Tylenol use in pregnancy actually does increase the risk of autism, RFK's destruction of trust in the government's scientific process will probably just push that sort result back. He's a charlatan and totally unscientific regardless. Luckily for those of us who care, there are private and foreign government organizations who still take healthcare and science seriously. Unfortunately the only san…

You're forgetting that for half the country that trust was destroyed years ago, and RFK actually being aware of and wanting to investigate evidence like this is restoring it.

That half of the country is not having their trust in science restored. They're forcing their superstitions onto everyone else and calling that science.

Re: Kenvue stock drops on report RFK Jr will link autism to Tylenol during pregnancy

#365

Post by dotnet00 »

jgalt212 wrote: post #46

The entire medical community is doing their impression of Shaggy, i.e. "it wasn't me!" But there are thousands of suffering parents and children and this lack of empathy really does nothing for no one. Another hand-wavy response I have heard is that given the new Autism Spectrum diagnosis, many more kids are now diagnosed with autism. That being said, none has even come up with a reasonably derived estimate saying th…

No one supporting this quack's actions and opinions has any right to claim that the people devoting their lives to understanding, managing and healing illnesses, are the ones lacking empathy and not the ones doing their best to make healthcare less accessible, discrediting and shutting down any research that doesn't support their biases and irresponsibly spreading misinformation.

Re: Kenvue stock drops on report RFK Jr will link autism to Tylenol during pregnancy

#366

Post by catlikesshrimp »

AndyPa32 wrote: post #277
johnisgood wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some people have it. Some do not. I have taken very large amounts of opiates before and I have never ever experienced nausea from them. I think you are not likely to experience it at lower doses from say, codeine or hydrocodone either, but honestly, it varies by individuals. It would suck if I experienced nausea, and it would equally suck if I experienced euphoria from opiates, because I have an addictive personality…

The risk of NSAID ulcers can be vastly reduced by Pantoprazole (Protonix®)

You can see blood that you vomit, But NSAIDs also cause kidney damage, which you don't realize until it is extensive. Lost nephrons don't come back.

Re: Kenvue stock drops on report RFK Jr will link autism to Tylenol during pregnancy

#367

Post by steve1977 »

elcritch wrote: post #361
giardini wrote: post #339

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Aspirin ???!! Its not mentioned in the OP. No one here mentioned it. WTF???!

Ugh yeah, s/aspirin/Tylenol/. My brain always wants to call Tylenol and acetaminophen as generic "aspirins" and it's a hard habit to break. Joys of having ADHD I didn't even notice the switch. Nevertheless, comparing the observed correlations of Tylenol with aspirin and ibuprofen would be the first thing to check. Seems unlikely to me that the OP's suggestion could be controlled for that way. I'll be curious if Kenne…

One important point here is that NSAIDs like aspirin and ibuprofen should be avoided at least in the second half of pregnancy. Acetaminophen is usually the “go to” painkiller for pregnant women, which of course skews the result.

Re: Kenvue stock drops on report RFK Jr will link autism to Tylenol during pregnancy

#368

Post by throwaway2037 »

themafia wrote: post #190
docstryder wrote: post #75

It is the safest painkiller currently available. Ibuprofen can cause gut bleeding and renal issues if overdosed on. We all know about opiates. Some facts - typical adult dose is 1g. Max suggested cap on the drug label is 3g per day (about 6 pills at usual 500mg dose). You need to take 10g (20 pills) to be at real risk of hepatotoxicity. So 10 times the typical dose is when you have overdose effects. (basically 20 pil…

> the safest painkiller currently available Likewise I find it one of the least _effective_ painkillers on the market.

What do you prefer?

Re: Kenvue stock drops on report RFK Jr will link autism to Tylenol during pregnancy

#369

Post by pixxel »

kelnos wrote: post #308
CogitoCogito wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The irony is that if Tylenol use in pregnancy actually does increase the risk of autism, RFK's destruction of trust in the government's scientific process will probably just push that sort result back. He's a charlatan and totally unscientific regardless. Luckily for those of us who care, there are private and foreign government organizations who still take healthcare and science seriously. Unfortunately the only san…

Right, I think this falls under the "broken clock correct twice a day" saying. RFK Jr says a lot of crazy things, but he probably does occasionally say something that makes sense, through no skill of his own. I mean, he rails against processed food and color/dye additives, some of it being stuff that other countries with reputable FDA-analogues have banned. There could be something to that, even though I can confiden…

[dead]

Re: Kenvue stock drops on report RFK Jr will link autism to Tylenol during pregnancy

#370

Post by exe34 »

kelnos wrote: post #323
exe34 wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

paracetamol is unusual in this respect, that the toxic dose is so close to the therapeutic dose, but the benefits outweigh the risks. after I had dental surgery, I took paracetamol and ibuprofen in alternate doses every 4h - I would have been in screaming pain if I couldn't have both as an option.

Maybe by FDA-type standards, 4x is "close", but to me, I would think it absurd to take 4x the recommended dose of something unless directed to by a doctor. I was recently prescribed 800mg ibuprofen for an injury, where 200mg is the standard OTC dose, and I even questioned that .

you'd be surprised how casual some people are with doses. my old grandma had a big bag of medication she had collected over the years and occasionally she'd sit down and pick a couple like smarties and gulp them down.

when my dad decided to step in, he took her to a doctor to get a full review and confiscate the bag.

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