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Trump's NASA cuts would destroy decades of science and wipe out its future

latimes.com

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Re: Trump's NASA cuts would destroy decades of science and wipe out its future

#361

Post by raxxorraxor »

margalabargala wrote: post #304
Ray20 wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not an American and may not understand what is going on inside, but from the outside it appears that you are simply engaging in political smears. Authoritarianism means oppressing the masses, having an undemocratic government and acting against the will of the people. It happens in Venezuela. It happens in Turkey. It happens in Hungary. It doesn't happen in the US. If anything, what is happening in the US is exa…

> If anything, what is happening in the US is exactly the opposite: Trump, who won the popular vote, therefore a representative of the oppressed majority, is waging a war against their oppression (as masses seems it) by the authoritarian deep state. Countries have laws that govern how they are nominally meant to operate. When the ruler of a country breaks the laws that are supposed to constrain his behavior, and face…

Governments that were not considered authoritarian have broken laws as well. This didn't start with Trump, I would say Trump is a result of laws being ignored.

For the fight against terrorism or any other shit de jours that caused the current outrage.

So now any reference to laws sound hollow. It doesn't mean anything. What mattered is what governments used their power for.

Re: Trump's NASA cuts would destroy decades of science and wipe out its future

#362

Post by potato3732842 »

ilc wrote: post #253
potato3732842 wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So what? No state is gonna to tits up because they're no longer getting $1.03 back for every dollar they send to daddy fed. It'd be a giant nothingburger for the most part.

It isn't that small. And the swing between states depending on how it's measured can be QUITE large. As someone from a state that puts in a hell of a lot more than it gets out. I'd be glad for you to reduce my tax load, and let my state improve its services all at once! I can't speak of how happy I'd be. Even if it is 10-20%, that's nice phat cut. Which isn't far off in the more extreme cases.

See that's the thing. Even the states that turn out ten cents on the dollar (in terms of tax money, not necessarily GDP) poorer would still likely consider themselves better off because they don't have to cater to fed regulations that are at best a compromise and at worst a capitulation to other states.

Those losing states still get to reap all sorts of savings by not doing things that are done at the behest of the feds. Like for example California has dragged its dick all over every policy involving indoor water and plumbing and outdoor rainwater and runoff management in just about the worst ways. Pretty much every state east of the Mississippi could stain to instantly gain more bang for their buck in every expenditure of that nature by simply creating their own (perhaps in cooperation with nearby states) sensible rules on the subject. It's just pants on head retarded that we've got desert states and wet states using the same rule book in this area. Repeat for all sorts of other subject where the sensible policy scoping level is something other than "the entire nation".

Re: Trump's NASA cuts would destroy decades of science and wipe out its future

#364

Post by [deleted] »

rockemsockem wrote: post #217
sc68cal wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

NASA still sets requirements and invites several companies to compete for contracts with different solutions. See the lunar lander contracts from a few years ago for example. You are ascribing beliefs to be based on others in this thread I think. What I think is that if a company is going to build and provide the solution then they should own the design. NASA should of course get to be involved in reviews and discuss…

[deleted]

Re: Trump's NASA cuts would destroy decades of science and wipe out its future

#365

Post by supplied_demand »

Jensson wrote: post #358
supplied_demand wrote: post #350

Earlier quoted context omitted.

==Government has no mechanism to ensure the money it spends is on things that have a positive ROI== Sure they do, elections.

And this thread is talking about the result of that, and quite a lot of people seem to think this "control via elections" thing isn't working that well.

Most democracies don’t have 100% vote share or approval going to one party, so we have disagreements. There are also lots of other elections that happen more often than every 4 years.

Re: Trump's NASA cuts would destroy decades of science and wipe out its future

#366

Post by ethbr1 »

xedrac wrote: post #310
ethbr1 wrote: post #238

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People who think that's a massive elephant are shortsighted. You know what illegal immigrants do? Work. For shitty wages. You know what that does? Boosts the US' labor force and economy, which buffers the declining fertility rate [0]. The fact that anti-immigration (of any sort) folks never think beyond first-effects is mind boggling. Illegal immigration causes some problems; it also solves others. [0] https://en.m.w…

I have no problem with legal immigration - people who have worked hard to become citizens via legal channels, and who love our country. They wouldn't dream of rioting or committing violence, all while waving another country's flag. I have a huge problem with what happened over the last 4 years.

The problem with supporting legal immigration only is that Congress has been unable to pass common sense immigration reform over the past decades, because there's not enough political backbone. (And also the Republican Party has made it increasingly toxic)

Illegal immigration = the difference between legal immigration supply and demand for immigration (both external and domestic)

And the rioting / nativist arguments are political theater to score points.

It's a fact that most illegal immigrants don't commit crimes or riot, in the same way that most people in general don't. But distorting frequency and total count has long been a popular pathos argument.

Similarly, enculturation and assimilation is a broader topic than a flag. And more over, the US explicitly and unambiguously grants freedom of expression as a right (all persons in America, not just citizens). So saying "I hate this country; I support ____" is and has always been an option as an American.

Re: Trump's NASA cuts would destroy decades of science and wipe out its future

#367

Post by yesfitz »

Whoppertime wrote: post #294
yesfitz wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you elaborate on how the country would be hamstrung with unaffordable debt? Like, what effects would that have on the country/citizens?

https://www.japantimes.co.jp/commentary/2025/05/22/japan/gre... Japan would be a classic example of a developed country hamstrung by unaffordable debt https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Debt-trap_diplomacy While Chinese Debt Trap Diplomacy is a classic example of the trap poorer countries can fall into with unaffordable debt

Sure, thank you for the links. I was hoping for the original poster to respond with what they thought being "hamstrung by unaffordable debt" would look like for the United States.

Do you have a vision of that?

The article on Japan illustrated debt looks different between different countries (although Japan and Argentina are always economic exceptions). It's the same with people, I suppose.

Someone with a $100k annual salary and $100k in debt can be a good thing (a mortgage or a cashflowing business) or a bad thing (credit card debt, high-interest student loans and no degree). Although someone with that same salary and $10MM in debt would be a different story, almost regardless of what they did with the money. So there's definitely an upper limit to debt.

Re: Trump's NASA cuts would destroy decades of science and wipe out its future

#368

Post by FuriouslyAdrift »

AnimalMuppet wrote: post #299
FuriouslyAdrift wrote: post #298

Earlier quoted context omitted.

well... sure. I hope we get a Congress that is more balanced and can compromise on things, but I am way too cynical to believe it will happen. Best case might be a strong Republican majority in both houses that can just say 'no' to Trump or at least stiffle certain agendas. Politics is a blood sport, after all.

Why would you think that a strong Republican majority would say "no" to Trump?

Because they can. Right now they can't. If you think the R party is going along with Trump because of ideological alignment, you'd be wrong. There are very few members that are aligned with him.

The current situation is of political survival. Nothing more.

Re: Trump's NASA cuts would destroy decades of science and wipe out its future

#369

Post by ethbr1 »

raxxorraxor wrote: post #360
ethbr1 wrote: post #238

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People who think that's a massive elephant are shortsighted. You know what illegal immigrants do? Work. For shitty wages. You know what that does? Boosts the US' labor force and economy, which buffers the declining fertility rate [0]. The fact that anti-immigration (of any sort) folks never think beyond first-effects is mind boggling. Illegal immigration causes some problems; it also solves others. [0] https://en.m.w…

You parent is wrong but so are you and you make the same mistakes. The effects you describe have higher order effects as well that can indeed have negative effects. Not saying republicans would give a crap about them, but they are undeniable. For wages developments and housing prices, topics that fundamentally influence basic needs very much in contrast to GDP growths, even if there are positive side effects as well.…

The wage arguments are somewhat wishy washy, given the extreme concentration of illegal labor in low-skill, low-wage work. Agriculture, meat processing, construction.

Putting aside the moral qualms about underpaying someone for hard, physical work, it's hard to argue that the American economy (and the average American) loses more than it gains from cheaper labor.

Housing would be a clusterfuck without illegal immigration, so I'm also hesitant to draw that connection too boldly. Would stopping all illegal immigration ease prices? A bit. Would it fix an undersupplied housing market and overconsolidated rental market that's driving price inceases? No.

Re: Trump's NASA cuts would destroy decades of science and wipe out its future

#370

Post by ethbr1 »

newhope1978 wrote: post #260
ethbr1 wrote: post #238

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People who think that's a massive elephant are shortsighted. You know what illegal immigrants do? Work. For shitty wages. You know what that does? Boosts the US' labor force and economy, which buffers the declining fertility rate [0]. The fact that anti-immigration (of any sort) folks never think beyond first-effects is mind boggling. Illegal immigration causes some problems; it also solves others. [0] https://en.m.w…

so your reason that why we need them is because they are wage slaves that will eventually replace us? Why not just use the billions of dollars spent on immigration to boost wages, make life more affordable, and give tax cuts to ACTUAL AMERICANS as an incentive to have more kids?

Economies run on labor. Raging isn't going to change that hard truth.

I'm also not sure we see the math the same way.

Illegal immigrant = working, not consuming social services (outside of guaranteed entitlements like EMTALA), paying payroll and sales taxes

Tax cuts = ??

You think COVID stimulus would have made people understand that flooding more money into a system with limited supply capacity will just lead to price inflation.

The way to address quality of life for parents and promote having children is to decrease the economic cost of doing so.

PS: Bolding actual americans made me laugh. Actual Americans are anyone who works hard in this country.

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